# Are all religions anti-homosexuality. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 15, 2012, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801 "2012-09-15T17:30:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/21 "2012-09-17T01:48:47Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > You don’t have to “scour” the OT to find it anti-homosexual. Ah, good point. I stand corrected. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/22 "2012-09-17T02:04:03Z")
I wish I could remember details, but I recall reading of an Asian religion which had always been accepting of homosexuality. Yeah, not much help, but maybe that will jog some memories better than mine. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/23 "2012-09-17T02:29:55Z")
> [@AboutAsWeirdAsYouCanGet](#): > > I have a friend who grew up Wiccan with a mom straight outta Dykes to Watch Out For. Wicca is apparently very accepting of GLB stuff…so much that H came ou as gay when she was 15. Thought she was gonna be one of those womyn who go to Mitchfest and vacation in P’Town. She was REALLY freaked out to fall in love with guys a few years later, so no. Wicca seems, overall, to not only be accepting of gays but accepting of whatever sexual behavior works for you that doesn’t harm anyone. As mentioned elsewhere here, some Protestant groups fully accept gays into fellowship and do not condemn the behavior. As for the rest, I believe that, among the Christians who do not believe that homosexual behavior is acceptable, many do not want to see backdoor banditry as a secular criminal offense, but as a matter to be regulated by the church. ---
**Author:** ![kevin1521](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4bbf92/32.png) [@kevin1521](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kevin1521)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/24 "2012-09-17T02:33:53Z")
not hinduism, or at least of what i know of. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 9:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/25 "2012-09-17T09:04:16Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > I think that depends a lot on the individual/group. Based on people I’ve known I’d say that Wiccans are generally pretty gay-friendly, but I’ve heard secondhand that there are some that do believe heterosexuality is superior because it is more “natural” or because a heterosexual union brings together the feminine (Goddess) and masculine (God). The Gardnerians are a branch of Wicca dating to the 1930s. They’re the ones with the heteronormativity. Wicca is not synonymous with Witchcraft; Witchcraft is the broader term and Wicca is one subset of it, mainly identified with the Gardnerian and Alexandrian traditions. Reclaiming Witchcraft is notably open to every possible permutation of sexuality. My experience with it is a lot of LGBTQ people plus a lot of straight but not narrow people who work together very harmoniously. The Reclaiming tradition draws much of its basis from a highly esoteric tradition called Feri, which is extremely open and all-inclusive as to gender and sexuality. As far as I know, non-Gardnerian Witchcraft and Neopaganism in general (with ?the possible exception of Teutonic reconstructionists such as Ásatrú) are quite LGBTQ-friendly and supportive. Has anyone mentioned the UU and the UCC? You may recall the UCC was President Obama’s church. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/26 "2012-09-17T09:18:20Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > The Gardnerians are a branch of Wicca dating to the 1930s. They’re the ones with the heteronormativity. Wicca is not synonymous with Witchcraft; Witchcraft is the broader term and Wicca is one subset of it, mainly identified with the Gardnerian and Alexandrian traditions. Is there any evidence of Wicca before Gerald Gardiner? I know he claimed to be revealing an existing tradition & coven structure, and I have no doubt that witches & covens did exist through the British Isles, but were they “Wiccans” as described by GG or is “Wicca” as such an invention by GG &/or others? Gavin & Yvonne Frost’s Church & School of Wicca USED to be anti-gay, tho at the time (early 1970s) NOT anti-ephebophile. Eek! ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/27 "2012-09-17T09:18:35Z")
> [@kevin1521](#): > > not hinduism, or at least of what i know of. The [wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_topics_and_Hinduism) article seems to bear you out. So yes, I suppose Hinduism doesn’t have institutionalised anti-homosexuality built in. > [@](#): > > Hindus have many sacred texts and different communities give special importance to different texts. Even more so than in other religions, Hindus also foster disparate interpretations of the meaning of various texts. The Vedas, which form the foundation of Hinduism for many, do not refer explicitly to homosexuality, but Rigveda says Vikruti Evam Prakriti (perversity/diversity is what nature is all about, or, what seems un-natural is also natural), which some scholars believe recognizes the cyclical constancy of homosexual/transsexual dimensions of human life, like all forms of universal diversities.[35] People of a third gender (tritiya-prakriti), not fully men nor women, are mentioned here and there throughout Hindu texts such as the Puranas but are not specifically defined. In general they are portrayed as effeminate men, often cowardly, and with no desire for women. Modern readers often draw parallels between these and modern stereotypes of lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender sexual identities. > Historians Ruth Vanita and Saleem Kidwai, in their pioneering book, Same-Sex Love in India: Readings from Literature and History, for the first time compiled extracts from Indian texts, from ancient to modern times, including many Hindu texts, translated from 15 Indian languages. In their accompanying analytical essays, they also demonstrated that Hindu texts have discussed and debated same-sex desire from the earliest times, in tones ranging from critical to non-judgmental to playful and celebratory. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/28 "2012-09-17T11:21:47Z")
As far as some Christian sects accepting it, it seems to me that if we define a religion as anything people say it is, then sure, there are religions that accept homosexuality. However, if we define religions as based on ancient writings that people actually believe in and follow, I don’t think there are any. To me, a religion without rules written down is like a nation without a constitution. There’s nothing there, people just make it up as they go along. ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/29 "2012-09-17T12:59:43Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yes, it’s only in recent times that it is not considered a mental disorder or worse. That’s kind of, well, ignoring most of the world’s history. Unless you truly believe the world was created around, oh, 1880, and think that nothing but Europe and North America exist. There have been nearly as many different attitudes towards homosexuality as there have been cultures. As mentioned, for instance, many ancient Greeks and Romans didn’t have ‘homosexual’ as a category – it didn’t matter whether the person you were with had a penis or not; what mattered is who was in charge. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/30 "2012-09-17T14:18:35Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > Is there any evidence of Wicca before Gerald Gardiner? I know he claimed to be revealing an existing tradition & coven structure, and I have no doubt that witches & covens did exist through the British Isles, but were they “Wiccans” as described by GG or is “Wicca” as such an invention by GG &/or others? > > Gavin & Yvonne Frost’s Church & School of Wicca USED to be anti-gay, tho at the time (early 1970s) NOT anti-ephebophile. Eek! To the best of my knowledge, Wicca as such originated with Gardner in the 1930s. One of the sources he used was _Aradia_, a 19th-century account of Italian witchcraft. I don’t know if it’s ever been established how much of what was described in _Aradia_ is factual and how much is embellishment. I’m not familiar with the group you mentioned. Gardnerian Wicca is something I’ve only read about, no personal acquaintance. I participate in Reclaiming, which came together in San Francisco circa 1979 and makes no claims of antiquity. ---
**Author:** ![Noone\_Special](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noone_special/32/2863_2.png) [@Noone\_Special](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noone_Special)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/31 "2012-09-17T14:37:00Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > As far as some Christian sects accepting it, it seems to me that if we define a religion as anything people say it is, then sure, there are religions that accept homosexuality. However, if we define religions as based on ancient writings that people actually believe in and follow, I don’t think there are any. **To me, a religion without rules written down is like a nation without a constitution**. There’s nothing there, people just make it up as they go along. I would just like to point out that claiming that Britain and Israel (and probably others) are not “nations” is not going to score your logic too many points… In other words, your definition of religion, not to mince words, is bunk. (bolding in quote mine) ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/32 "2012-09-17T15:14:46Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > As far as some Christian sects accepting it, it seems to me that if we define a religion as anything people say it is, then sure, there are religions that accept homosexuality. However, if we define religions as based on ancient writings that people actually believe in and follow, I don’t think there are any. To me, a religion without rules written down is like a nation without a constitution. There’s nothing there, people just make it up as they go along. Many (most?) religions do not consider their scriptures anything akin to a “rule book” or constitution. Speaking as an Episcopalian, we take the Bible very seriously and read/study it constantly, and recognize it as containing the Word of God. But it requires interpretation and application of context. In otherwords there is a wide middle way between “religion as anything people say it is” and taking a literalist approach to scripture. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/33 "2012-09-17T16:25:03Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > This isn’t a subject I know much about, but it’s my impression that Buddhism, Taoism, and Shinto are pretty neutral on the subject of homosexuality. According to the Dalai Lama Budhism is anti-homosexuality from his wikipedia page: “a Buddhist point of view, lesbian and gay sex is generally considered sexual misconduct” ---
**Author:** ![Lightlystarched](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Lightlystarched](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightlystarched)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/34 "2012-09-17T18:34:15Z")
I seem to recall that some Native American cultures were accepting of homosexuality. And some others were more open to gender flexibility. Men could dress or behave like women without stigma. This is purely from memory and I’d have to look it up to be certain. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/35 "2012-09-17T19:33:13Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > As far as some Christian sects accepting it, it seems to me that if we define a religion as anything people say it is, then sure, there are religions that accept homosexuality. However, if we define religions as based on ancient writings that people actually believe in and follow, I don’t think there are any. To me, a religion without rules written down is like a nation without a constitution. There’s nothing there, people just make it up as they go along. I believe that there are several religions or religious groups that believe that a living leader (or a group of living leaders acting in concert) has a special relationship with God and is able to authoritatively pronounce rules. I believe that Roman Catholicism and the LDS Church have this feature. Other groups such as Quakers or Baptists would not normally consider any human to currently have divine authority to set doctrine. Is the Pope “making it up as he goes along” when he pronounces the official interpretation of a scripture passage or formally defines teaching regarding a bible figure or a saint? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/36 "2012-09-17T20:33:36Z")
> [@Noone\_Special](#): > > I would just like to point out that claiming that Britain and Israel (and probably others) are not “nations” is not going to score your logic too many points… > In other words, your definition of religion, not to mince words, is bunk. > > (bolding in quote mine) What is religion based on if not ancient writings or at least an oral tradition? It’s something someone made up. We laugh at people who could build a statue with their own hands and then worship it. How is it any different to make up a belief system and then call it truth? But sure, if we define “religion” as anything people choose to believe, there are religions that accept homosexuality. If we define it as something more structured though, with a long written and oral history and set of principles that weren’t made up yesterday by someone named Robert Heinlein, then no, no religions accept it. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/37 "2012-09-17T20:34:49Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > Many (most?) religions do not consider their scriptures anything akin to a “rule book” or constitution. Speaking as an Episcopalian, we take the Bible very seriously and read/study it constantly, and recognize it as containing the Word of God. But it requires interpretation and application of context. > > In otherwords there is a wide middle way between “religion as anything people say it is” and taking a literalist approach to scripture. It’s the word of God and it shouldn’t be taken literally? ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/38 "2012-09-17T22:01:49Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It’s the word of God and it shouldn’t be taken literally? Not the _words_ of God, like God dictated it to the authors – although maybe he did in some cases, who knows. But what I said is that it contains the _Word_ of God - the _[Logos](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logos_(Christianity))_. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/39 "2012-09-17T22:09:59Z")
Even if you believe it’s the word of god, s/he could be speaking allegorically, in parable, give general guidelines to be extrapolated on etc. much like a parent might tell a story to make a moral point. ---
**Author:** ![Noone\_Special](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noone_special/32/2863_2.png) [@Noone\_Special](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noone_Special)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2012, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801/40 "2012-09-17T22:21:31Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It’s something someone made up. We laugh at people who could build a statue with their own hands and then worship it. How is it any different to make up a belief system and then call it truth? As an atheist, I wholeheartedly agree with this. And I think this _does_ describe _all_ religions, not just the Johnny-come-lately’s such as LDS and Scientology. > [@adaher](#): > > It’s the word of God and it shouldn’t be taken literally? many religions believe that they are following the path towards God taken by a holy person who may or may not have actually had a direct relationship with God; not that their written traditions were dictated by the deity with their prophet acting as a glorified stenographer. So, no, not necessarily. (mind you, I may be mangling this, since I don’t believe in any religion. But this is theway I’ve heard it explained.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-all-religions-anti-homosexuality/634801.md?page=3)