# Are Democrats setting themselves up by underestimating Trump's debate skills? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [September 25, 2016, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885 "2016-09-25T21:30:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/21 "2016-09-26T01:24:10Z")
> [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](#): > > Mark Cuban will have to sit there and take the insults. He’ll respond after the debates but he won’t have a hundredth of the audience that Trump does. Quite possibly. And quite likely that news programs or documentaries about current events don’t have a hundredth of the audience of “reality TV” shows featuring the Kardashians’ tits. Which do you suppose is more conducive to informed national self-governance? ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/22 "2016-09-26T01:24:27Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > If Trump ends up debating Mark Cuban, he might as well announce his withdrawal the next day. > > Trump needs to show up and look presidential. He needs to reassure voters who are concerned about his stability in order to expand beyond his current base. This. Trump can win the election as a racist. He cannot win it as an unhinged Commander in Chief. Conway, Bannon, and Ailes understand this. Trump will show up with the goal of being boring. ---
**Author:** ![Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pearl\_Clutching\_Provocateur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pearl_Clutching_Provocateur)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/23 "2016-09-26T01:48:56Z")
Trump’s derision of Hillary’s “I’m With Her” slogan with “I’m With you” seems pretty powerful to me. I think he’ll paint himself as the ultimate outsider and embrace the repudiation by newspapers and other institutions. Few people trust them anyway.He’ll be an underdog, and Americans like that. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/24 "2016-09-26T02:09:04Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > The second part is the fact-checking, and I’d love to see a thorough media analysis of all the responses afterwards. Now this part I think _will_ happen, and it will expose Trump’s multitude of shameless brazen lies, but unfortunately no Trumpsters will ever read it. They’ll be back to watching reality TV and celebrating their hero’s victory because Trump said something brilliant about the size of his dick. Even if the moderator herself or himself doesn’t do it, it would be nice if the networks did. Just a simple screen ticker that pops up when a candidate says something that is unquestionably false. I think that you could do a reasonably decent job with some prep work and a 60 second tape delay. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/25 "2016-09-26T02:09:48Z")
Yeah, he’s built his entire reputation on being an underdog. How can it miss? ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/26 "2016-09-26T02:31:44Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > So Trump will interrupt her many times and can simply smirk if Lester Holt says anything about it (which he may not–he may well have been intimidated by Trump’s calling him A Democrat). Seriously? isn’t the point of a moderated debate that the moderator can just cut Trump’s microphone when it’s Clinton’s turn to speak. Yes if it’s a free for all Trump will probably win, if the moderator lets Clinton speak (by whatever means necessary), it’s much less clear cut. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/27 "2016-09-26T02:34:06Z")
Mrs Clinton has to be very careful. If you watch Trump’s actual debates with his Republican primary opponents, as opposed to the highlights, his tactic was to say something shocking about them and as they tried to absorb that, hit them with attack on actual weak points in policy, leaving them flustered. Is she lets him do that; he’ll win, she needs to ignore his outrageous comments and anticipate the actual attack. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/28 "2016-09-26T02:48:21Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > I agree with this. Trump has been getting away with the most brazen lies imaginable, not just in this campaign, but for years (“you wouldn’t believe what my investigators in Hawaii are finding out [about Obama’s apparent non-birth there]”), etc. Then he just brazenly claims that he’s the one who finally settled the matter, and shame on Hillary for starting that nasty rumor about Obama being born in Kenya! :rolleyes: > > His technique when challenged on these things is to ignore the challenge and forcefully bloviate about something else entirely. He’s a born carnival barker, a born con-man, a showman, and a professional liar. > > So there are two parts to the debate challenge. I don’t think it’s reasonable to expect the moderators to be fact-checkers because of (a) time constraints – if you had to factually correct everything Trump said it would take up the whole 90 minutes, and (b) the risk of being perceived as being biased (remember when Candy Crawley corrected Romney and was accused of being in the tank for Obama?). But I think it absolutely **is** reasonable and essential for the moderators to insist that a question actually be answered and not just deflected with meaningless rhetoric, and if the candidate doesn’t do it, give the candidate another minute to do so, and failing that, plainly note that the question was not answered, and move on. Of course this will never happen, but I wish it would. > > The second part is the fact-checking, and I’d love to see a thorough media analysis of all the responses afterwards. Now this part I think _will_ happen, and it will expose Trump’s multitude of shameless brazen lies, but unfortunately no Trumpsters will ever read it. They’ll be back to watching reality TV and celebrating their hero’s victory because Trump said something brilliant about the size of his dick. This is why Hillary shouldn’t leave it in Lester Holt’s hands. She should do what Little Marco did and attack him and talk directly with viewers. Little Marco’s mistake was in following Donald into the sewer, where Donald loves to wrestle and punch his opposition. The great generals always choose their battlefields. Hillary should attack Donald the way Rubio did on issues and then ask voters to Google certain things. Trump effing hated that debate. Hillary needs to make him hate this debate. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/29 "2016-09-26T03:24:45Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Is she lets him do that; he’ll win, she needs to ignore his outrageous comments and anticipate the actual attack. Those sorts of attacks won’t work so well on a woman, Clinton has an advantage here. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/30 "2016-09-26T03:50:30Z")
I do think the silence of the audience is going to be quite a factor in causing Trump to stumble. I’ve never watched a debate where the audience was allowed to cheer for either side, and my understanding is, this debate will be no different. A clown standing by himself, loudly blustering and lying away, making non-stop derisive comments and attacks with no feedback from his audience, will not play the same as his rallies. Without the instant gratification, I’m not sure he’ll know how to react or what to say. When he speaks off the cuff, the reaction of his audience has a huge impact on the things he continues to say. He may be able to babble out some facts and figures when Holt herds him back to the question at hand, but I don’t think he’ll be able to do it for 90 minutes – and certainly not the degree that Hillary can. I am not overconfident, not at all, because the stakes are much higher for Hillary. But what works in front of a raucous audience for Trump will not necessarily work in a quiet room that is actually paying attention to every word he says. She needs to just calmly grind him down in a matter-of-fact way. I don’t think she will rise to his baiting. She’s had plenty of practice ignoring such antics. Remember the Benghazi hearings. I don’t expect his performance to change the mind of any one of his brainless supporters who would follow him over a cliff – but that’s not the target audience. It’s the people who are, incredibly, still undecideds in this abortion of an election. And I’m far from sure her performance, even if stellar, will make any difference. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/31 "2016-09-26T04:48:48Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > And I’m far from sure her performance, even if stellar, will make any difference. Clinton could pull off the debate performance of the century, and there would be plenty of critics that pick her apart. It does not particularly matter how she actually does. I remember 4 years ago one media outlet published the critique of one of the debates that told how Romney clearly won - trouble is it was published before the debate began. It’s going to be even worse this year. Trump will be declared the winner even if he strokes out on stage, collapses, and has a seizure. He’ll be considered “strong and presidential” if he calls Clinton a pig and a whore. We’ll hear about his strong foreign affairs chops, if he manages to get the name of another country mostly correct. ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/32 "2016-09-26T04:59:45Z")
The Clinton campaign just released 17 pages of ‘fact-checking’ Trump. I hope they’ve forced the moderators’ hands with this strategy, and maybe even forced Trump to rethink some of his “strategy”. If so, that could be awesome, because it is becoming quite clear Trump doesn’t like to do the work, eg “How would you like to be the most powerful VP in history?” ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/33 "2016-09-26T05:04:46Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Mrs Clinton has to be very careful. If you watch Trump’s actual debates with his Republican primary opponents, as opposed to the highlights, his tactic was to say something shocking about them and as they tried to absorb that, hit them with attack on actual weak points in policy, leaving them flustered. > > Is she lets him do that; he’ll win, she needs to ignore his outrageous comments and anticipate the actual attack. We’re talking about a woman who’s withstood a constant barrage of slurs, contempt and criticism for nearly 25 years. Recently, she sat alone and faced nine hours of hectoring, disingenuous attacks from Republicans during the Benghazi hearing. She emerged from that crucible looking calm, reserved and strong, not to mention way smarter than anyone else in the room. I have no doubt Trump will try his usual tactics, but I can’t imagine his repetitive bullying and rehashed talking points have much chance of leaving _this_ opponent flustered. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/34 "2016-09-26T05:04:50Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Trump will be declared the winner even if he strokes out on stage, collapses, and has a seizure. Where are you getting this Bizarre idea from? Trump will be declared the winner, by his supporters no matter what he does, sure. It’s far from certain that the MSM will declare him the winner, he came across looking like an idiot at the veterans forum and the MSM called him out on it. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 9:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/35 "2016-09-26T09:21:08Z")
Charismatic Republican with low expectations going up against a stiff, intellectual Democrat who puts people to sleep. Yeah, I’ve seen this movie before and the ending sucks. > [@coremelt](#): > > Those sorts of attacks won’t work so well on a woman, Clinton has an advantage here. Remember when he called Fiorina ugly and coyly implied Megyn Kelly was on her period? Yours is an optimistic take on American culture, which is laudable. There’s a non-zero chance he calls Hillary the c-word and goes up in the polls. There’s not enough popcorn. ---
**Author:** ![RandMcnally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b782af/32.png) [@RandMcnally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandMcnally)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/36 "2016-09-26T23:07:21Z")
This guy no shit talked about the size of his dick during a debate to be his party’s presidential nominee. And he won! I’m not putting much stock in Clinton’s chances. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/37 "2016-09-26T23:18:32Z")
Moderator: “Mr. Trump, your health plan is projected to cost several trillion dollars. How do you plan to offset that cost?” Trump: "People are saying that Lying whore Hilary is a murderer. Now I have no idea if that is true or not, but Hey. (spreads hands apart) Media pundits: “Well that’s unconventional, but I think he hit a note with the voters on that one - back to you Toni” Trump Supporters “ha ha! That was a good one! Trump wins!” ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/38 "2016-09-28T14:09:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*Are Democrats setting themselves up by underestimating Trump’s debate skills? \*\* Now that the first debate is over, I think the answer to the OP question is clear – “No.” ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/39 "2016-09-28T17:11:35Z")
Trump was okay for a good twenty minutes. His problem was that the debate was ninety minutes long. I found it remarkably ironic that Trump questioned Clinton’s “stamina” in a debate in which he was visibly tired and flagging in the last half hour, while she looked like she could have started Debate 2 right then and there and gone another ninety minutes. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2016, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885/40 "2016-09-28T17:25:57Z")
He did interrupt her a ton. Good call Sherrerd. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-democrats-setting-themselves-up-by-underestimating-trumps-debate-skills/766885.md?page=3)