# Are dogs carnivores or omnivores? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 30, 2016, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753 "2016-06-30T02:52:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/41 "2016-07-01T20:53:28Z")
Uh, guys, what about a pissed-off Rottweiler? Need answer fast. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/42 "2016-07-01T21:09:54Z")
> [@digs](#): > > Uh, guys, what about a pissed-off Rottweiler? Need answer fast. I think you would be better off throwing him a steak to appease him rather than offering him vegan dog food. That would just piss him off more. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![spamforbrains](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@spamforbrains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spamforbrains)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/43 "2016-07-01T21:11:12Z")
> [@](#): > > That doesn’t tell you much about a dog’s natural proclivities. People have actually asked this question. Dogs prefer to eat moderate-protein extremely high-fat foods with a low carbohydrate content, when given the choice. When not given a choice, they eat anything that might provide calories. Dog’s preferred diet provides 30% of calories from protein, 63% from fat, and only 7% from carbohydrates, which matches pretty well with a lot of studies of “the optimal diet” for sporting and performance dogs. And doesn’t match at all with the content of most commercial dog foods, some of which provide practically all of their calories from carbohydrates. If you didn’t know, meat and animal-derived foods contain very low amounts of carbohydrates. Carbohydrates are really only available from fruits and grains. Cats prefer a much higher protein content at the expense of a lower fat content than do dogs, but like dogs, cats do not eat carbohydrates when given a choice. > **[Geometric analysis of macronutrient selection in breeds of the domestic dog,...](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23243377/)** > > Although many herbivores and omnivores have been shown to balance their intake of macronutrients when faced with nutritionally variable foods, study of this ability has been relatively neglected in carnivores, largely on the assumption that prey are... > **[Geometric analysis of macronutrient selection in the adult domestic cat,...](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21346132/)** > > We report feeding studies on adult domestic cats designed to disentangle the complex interactions among dietary protein, fat and carbohydrate in the control of intake. Using geometric techniques that combine mixture triangles and intake plots from... ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/44 "2016-07-01T21:26:06Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > I think you would be better off throwing him a steak to appease him rather than offering him vegan dog food. That would just piss him off more. 😉 “The roast beef is making them stronger… AND THE FALAFEL IS MAKING THEM ANGRIER!” _-Homer Simpson, speaking about mountain lions_ ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2016, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/45 "2016-07-01T23:59:00Z")
> [@spamforbrains](#): > > People have actually asked this question. Dogs prefer to eat moderate-protein extremely high-fat foods with a low carbohydrate content, when given the choice. When not given a choice, they eat anything that might provide calories. I thought dogs were prone to pancreatitis from extremely high fat diets. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGrenze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dbc845/32.png) [@KarlGrenze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGrenze)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2016, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/46 "2016-07-02T01:25:50Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > I thought dogs were prone to pancreatitis from extremely high fat diets. “Dietary indiscretion” is a risk factor, and yes, that usually involves higher fat than what the dog would eat. High triglycerides can also be a risk factor, but that in dogs usually happens with some dog breeds or with dogs with some endocrine diseases. ---
**Author:** ![spamforbrains](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@spamforbrains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spamforbrains)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2016, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/47 "2016-07-02T02:52:53Z")
> [@](#): > > I thought dogs were prone to pancreatitis from extremely high fat diets. Nope. Dogs who get pancreatitis from high fat diets either have a genetic condition (common in mini schnauzers, I believe) or are middle-aged overweight dogs that have eaten nothing but a low-fat high-carb low-quality kibble for years and suddenly get hold of some real food and gorge themselves. Even in that case, most dogs don’t develop pancreatitis, suggesting something else is going on besides the sudden diet change. Dogs that are used to eating high-fat diets don’t develop pancreatitis. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGrenze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dbc845/32.png) [@KarlGrenze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGrenze)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/48 "2016-07-07T14:01:59Z")
The first descriptions of acute pancreatic necrosis (what the clinicians call pancreatitis) were from dogs that were being fed a high-fat/low protein diet as part of an unrelated experiment (they found the disease as a side effect of this). Specific breeds besides Miniature Schnauzers that are at risk include Yorkshire and sikly terriers, nonsporting and nonworking breeds, and overweight/obese middle aged dogs. The endocrinopathies that can cause pancreatic necrosis include hyperadrenocorticism (Cushings) and hypothyroidism, amongst others. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/49 "2016-07-07T15:47:12Z")
> [@KarlGrenze](#): > > The first descriptions of acute pancreatic necrosis (what the clinicians call pancreatitis) were from dogs that were being fed a high-fat/low protein diet as part of an unrelated experiment (they found the disease as a side effect of this). > > Specific breeds besides Miniature Schnauzers that are at risk include Yorkshire and sikly terriers, nonsporting and nonworking breeds, and overweight/obese middle aged dogs. > > The endocrinopathies that can cause pancreatic necrosis include hyperadrenocorticism (Cushings) and hypothyroidism, amongst others. OK. I thought I had read it here where too much dietary fat could cause pancreatitis, but consider my ignorance successfully fought off. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/50 "2016-07-07T16:46:10Z")
So this means that a dog can live on a vegan diet but it will just rue the day it was born? ---
**Author:** ![KarlGrenze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dbc845/32.png) [@KarlGrenze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGrenze)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/51 "2016-07-07T17:37:39Z")
IIRC, there are some vegetarian diets (not vegan) in the market, but I don’t think any of them are in the premium/top brands, although they may conform to [AAFCO regulations](http://www.aafco.org/Consumers). That said, the better foods do have animal meat and organ parts as the main ingredients. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/52 "2016-07-07T17:43:36Z")
this is way into IMHO territory, but if you own a carnivorous animal as a pet and try to feed it a vegetarian/vegan diet, you probably should have it taken away from you. It’s one thing if you decide to remove animal products from your diet, but it is the height of human arrogance to think you can decide that for an animal dependent on you. If you have a problem with the use of animals for food, don’t get a dog or cat. I’m sure a rabbit or guinea pig will fit much better within your lifestyle. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/53 "2016-07-07T18:21:52Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > So this means that a dog can live on a vegan diet but it will just rue the day it was born? No, but the other dogs will make fun of it. ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_Rat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/54 "2016-07-07T18:37:16Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > As mentioned above, wolves will eat fruit, which they can digest and provides some nutrition. And dogs acquired genes that better enable them to digest starch (and thus live on human foods) early in the domestication process. Coyotes will sure mess up a watermelon patch. ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/55 "2016-07-07T18:44:14Z")
> [@Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](#): > > Reminds me of an old “Rhymes with Orange” comic by Hillary Price (which I can’t seem to google up for you), about a Labrador Retriever Flow Chart (demonstrating the method a dog uses to determine if something is edible). Basically it boils down to “eat it, and if it stays down, it’s edible”. [This one?](http://rhymeswithorange.com/files/2013/07/labpyramid.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blue_blistering_barnacle/32/3386_2.png) [@Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blue_Blistering_Barnacle)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2016, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/56 "2016-07-07T23:12:49Z")
> [@JeffB](#): > > [This one?](http://rhymeswithorange.com/files/2013/07/labpyramid.gif) No, it was a flow chart. Thanks for your link, though. I haven’t seen it before, and it does perfectly describe the dietary preferences if a few lab-type dogs I’ve known. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2016, 10:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/57 "2016-07-08T10:31:58Z")
Dogs can thrive on a vegetarian or even vegan diet, with about the same amount of care as a human on a similar diet (making sure to balance proteins, getting enough B vitamins, etc.). They will in general prefer meat, but then, so do humans. Cats cannot thrive on a vegetarian diet, and attempting to force them to do so is cruel and probably futile (if they’re not fed meat, they’ll find ways to hunt it themselves). ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2016, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/58 "2016-07-08T19:50:07Z")
> [@Blue\_Blistering\_Barnacle](#): > > No, it was a flow chart. > > Thanks for your link, though. I haven’t seen it before, and it does perfectly describe the dietary preferences if a few lab-type dogs I’ve known. [Here you go.](http://rhymeswithorange.com/comics/january-21-2005/) ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2016, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/59 "2016-07-09T01:52:11Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I don’t have a dog, but a good friend of mine has a Lab and that dog will eat damn near anything. Chips, peanuts, crackers, cookies, broccoli, whatever you throw at him. I always kid my buddy that he’s starving his dog because the dog is always ready to chow down on whatever he’s offered. Doesn’t that describe about 90% of all dogs? ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2016, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753/60 "2016-07-09T03:44:17Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Apparently cats can be considered on the upper end of the carnivore scale, unable to survive eating plants alone. I have vegan friends who researched this and realized they had to feed meat to their cat, certain enzymes just weren’t available from plants. Dogs can survive on a vegetarian diet, although I doubt any dog is happy to do so. Cats will eat vegetables though. In my experience they like carrots but not peas. (Checks date of post). Yes, you can feed a cat a vegan diet, including vegan diet supplements (Seawead extract is vegan. Yeast is acceptable to all vegans I know. Krill is acceptiable to some vegans). Perhaps ?? your vegan friends made an ethical decision about the natural diet of cats and decided that a natural diet was ethically acceptable for cats ??. Or maybe they also don’t like the idea of “diet supplements”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-dogs-carnivores-or-omnivores/758753.md?page=4)