# are evolution and natural selection the same thing? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 2, 2000, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842 "2000-08-02T14:13:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Asmodeus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@Asmodeus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asmodeus)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/1 "2000-08-02T14:13:59Z")
I am having a debate with DebiJ…a good friend and member here…though she doesn’t post enough! I say natural selection is evolution, she says they walk hand in hand. ut are not the same thing. Tell her she’s wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Asmodeus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@Asmodeus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asmodeus)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/2 "2000-08-02T14:15:03Z")
B damn slow key…🙂 ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/3 "2000-08-02T14:21:42Z")
I’m afraid she’s right. Evolution is a process; natural selection is a tool by which it works. ---
**Author:** ![Asmodeus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@Asmodeus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asmodeus)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/4 "2000-08-02T14:27:51Z")
rats ---
**Author:** ![Myron\_Van\_Horowitzski](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Myron\_Van\_Horowitzski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myron_Van_Horowitzski)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/5 "2000-08-02T15:33:54Z")
Evolution is _what_ happens; natural selection is _how_ it happens. Sorta like continental drift; it’s the outcome, plate tectonics is the mechanism. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/6 "2000-08-02T15:44:04Z")
Sorta like salvation and faith. ---
**Author:** ![Asmodeus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@Asmodeus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asmodeus)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/7 "2000-08-02T16:03:30Z")
So it’s just a matter of semantics? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/8 "2000-08-02T16:24:02Z")
Well, it’s not just “wordplay” if that’s what you mean by semantics (the popularized connotation). Consider that a tiger is a cat, but not all cats are tigers. Yes, that is semantics, but no, it is not trivial. Think of it this way: evolution works by the process of natural selection just as democracy works by the process of elections. But democracy and elections are not the same. I have tried to go this similar route before to explain the difference between a context for government (like libertarianism) and a government structure (like democracy, monarchy, etc.) Some people got it. Some dismissed it as “just semantics”. ---
**Author:** ![Mauve\_Dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ad7895/32.png) [@Mauve\_Dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mauve_Dog)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/9 "2000-08-02T16:49:38Z")
As I’ve posted elsewhere in such discussions, Evolution is the _fact_ that organisms change through time, while Natural Selection is one of the _mechanisms_ describing how/why this change occurs. The two are often confused, but there _is_ a difference, and it’s more than semantic. So, Asmodeus, unfortunately, I, at least, can’t say DebiJ is wrong. Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Danielinthewolvesden](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ce7236/32.png) [@Danielinthewolvesden](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Danielinthewolvesden)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2000, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/10 "2000-08-02T18:02:16Z")
Yes, Evolution is a fact, but natural selection is a THEORY of how that fact works. However, natural selection is not seriously debated. What is seriously argued about is the RATE, ie: “slow & steady” or "fits and stops’. So, when you hear about the “Theory” of Evolution, it is not Evolution itself which is the theory, it is how that fact actually operates. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2000, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-evolution-and-natural-selection-the-same-thing/27842/11 "2000-08-03T04:28:49Z")
Also, realize that there are other methods of evolution. There’s evolution by artificial selection, for instance. Though now pretty much debunked, evolution by the passing on of acquired characteristics was once a serious theory, as well.