# Are Gypsies as a people still viable? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 27, 2005, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910 "2005-11-27T11:51:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![irishgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8edcca/32.png) [@irishgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/irishgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/21 "2005-11-28T17:24:45Z")
**Pushkin** -I wonder if anyone asked the Traveller’s in your parent’s home town if they actually wanted those houses, and what they actually would like? Sometimes the problem is people assuming what the community needs, without actually asking the community. IMHO (and I know this is GQ) it’s awfully hard to pull yourself up by your bootstraps if neither you, nor anyone else in your immediate family, can read or write, if you’re in chronic ill-health and if no-one will give you a job because you’re a Traveller. Travellers need some extra help and services because of their situation, just like single parents and those with mental illness or addiction problems need extra help. But then I’m a socialist who believes that what is good for the most deprived portions of society can only be good for society as a whole. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/22 "2005-11-28T18:15:43Z")
Looking after the deprived is fine, but when the lifestyle is the very fact that leads to the deprivation, why should I pay for that ? ---
**Author:** ![irishgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8edcca/32.png) [@irishgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/irishgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/23 "2005-11-29T07:25:28Z")
Same reason you pay for the single parents, obese people, smokers, drinkers, drug takers, work-shy, gangsters and hoodlums your taxes already support. ---
**Author:** ![Tomcat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Tomcat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tomcat)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/24 "2005-11-29T09:48:28Z")
**Gypsy** and **Roma** are completely inter-changeable here in the Czech Republic, or so I recently read, with gypsy being slightly preferred. Although I do not know how Cigane (pronounced 'tsI-gan-ay) is taken, but you see it on menus and hear it ALL the time. I liken it to my experience with PC in the early/mid 90’s where a white guy got berated at college for saying ‘black’ by a white lady on stage…only to then have said lady turn red in the face when a black guy stood up in the audience and said “I’m black, thankyewverymuch.” Or the time I had a short quip here with someone who mentioned the “African-American” at the end of the table - “Dude, he’s from Ghana!” I don’t think the Roma/Cigane/Gypsies really give a flying fuck what people call them, they already know that 99% of the white population hate them here. Good English language site on the Roma here: [http://romove.radio.cz/en/](http://romove.radio.cz/en/) Lots of articles and history, etc. The upthread comment on how gypsies have transitory, short-term jobs read all-too simple for me. Here a business can fire anyone for no reason up to 3 months after starting. After 3 months it is pretty darn hard to get rid of someone, and you have to pay for their health insurance (and the maternity leave clauses are very burdensome - up to 3 years of paying and holding positions open)…So gypsies find themselves being hired for 2 days short of 3 months, then fired. Repeatedly. They do their fair share of crime, and one wonders what else would you do when your ethnic group faces 85% unemployment? Or that most of the children are put in ‘special’ schools for remedial learners (and thus often drop out at a young age). More to say than time allows- -Tcat ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/25 "2005-11-29T10:09:24Z")
> [@irishgirl](#): > > Same reason you pay for the single parents, obese people, smokers, drinkers, drug takers, work-shy, gangsters and hoodlums your taxes already support. Of course, when a single parent become a parent, there’s not a lot you can do about it. The others _can_ change. ---
**Author:** ![Futile\_Gesture](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f05b48/32.png) [@Futile\_Gesture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Futile_Gesture)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/26 "2005-11-29T11:33:59Z")
> [@Schnitte](#): > > First of all, the term “Gypsie” has become politically incorrect in the past years and decades. This frequently comes up here in discussion about Gypsies on this board. I always point out that the national organisations of Gypsies in the UK contain the word, and have no problem with it as long as you use it correctly. [Here’s a interesting summary of the various terminology from BBC News.](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4368791.stm) ---
**Author:** ![kis\_simon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a4c791/32.png) [@kis\_simon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kis_simon)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2005, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/27 "2005-12-14T10:38:58Z")
[QUOTE=Tomcat] **Gypsy** and **Roma** are completely inter-changeable here in the Czech Republic, or so I recently read, with gypsy being slightly preferred. Although I do not know how Cigane (pronounced 'tsI-gan-ay) is taken, but you see it on menus and hear it ALL the time. Cigane translates exactly as n\*\*\*\*r in the States. From non Gypsy to Gypsy it is an insult, between Gypsies it is fine. The prefered title is Roma. The word ‘gypsy’ apparantly comes from a mistaken belief in that the dark skinned (Indian) travellers who came over to eastern and central europe about 500 years ago were actually from Egypt. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2005, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/28 "2005-12-14T13:59:23Z")
> [@irishgirl](#): > > Many Irish Travellers in Ireland still travel from halting site (which may or may not be legal and which may or may not have running water and sewage facilities) to halting site. There are also “settled” Travellers who live mostly in housing supplied by the government. > > The Irish government has undertaken to provide more legal halting sites with better amenities, as Irish Travellers have a right to Travel under Irish law. How long people stay in one place depends on various factors, including weather, local feeling, opportunities for jobs and the “luck”. Travellers prefer to move as soon as possible after a death or birth in the community so as to get away from the bad luck. > > In theory, if there were sufficinet halting sites and if each halting site had sewage and water facilities, a school, a health service and a social welfare office so that people could get their dole payments and benefits there is no reason why the Travellers traditional lifestyle should not be viable. > > The debate is between those who feel that Travelling is a voluntary lifestyle choice which the state should not “waste” resources on supporting, and those who feel it is an integral and rapidly vanishing part of a traditional culture, which the state has a duty to support. > > Forcing people to settle isn’t ideal, and their educational, social and health needs aren’t being met by the current situation (Irish Travellers have high rates of illiteracy, shortened life expectancy and increased ill-health when compared to the general population). > > I personally feel that the state isn’t currently meeting the needs of the Travelling community and that ignoring those needs in the hope that these hardships will force them to settle and give up what makes their culture distinct is not a viable or desirable policy. > > Preventing problems with proper sanitation, education and healthcare is going to be cheaper and more ethically sound in the long run than dealing with the problems that poor sanitation, ill health and bad education lead to. > > YMMV. There’s a substantial population of Irish Travellers here in the SoOuthern USA, too. One rarely hears about them, but when one does, rest assured, the news is never good. Most may well be honest people, but a large minority are professional con/scam artists. They’ll travel from town to town, usually posing as contractors and construction workers. They’ll take a large down payment for a construction project, and then disappear with the money. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2005, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/29 "2005-12-14T14:08:41Z")
Let’s clear up a bit of misnomer here: “Gypsy” is a little bit like “Jew” in having several distinct connotations depending on use. The majority of the people referred to as “Gypsies” are a member of one of a couple of North Indian cultures who historically made a living as nomadic traders and tinkers. Not all people who lived in this style were in fact ethnic Romani or Sinti; not all ethnic Romani or Sinti lived in this manner, and far more of them are sedentary now than in the past. It’s true that Sammy Davis Jr. and **Eve** are both Jews, but they’re Jewish in distinct ways, depending on different connotations. Sammy is an American Black who converted to the Jewish faith. Eve is an ethnic Jew (IIRC) … if not, substitute somebody else who is … who is not a practicing member of that faith. Likewise with “Gypsy” except that you’re dealing with nomadic culture/lifestyle vs. ethnic idenity instead of ethnic group vs. religion. A person of Romani descent who has a condo and does data input for the First National Bank is still ethnically Romani. ---
**Author:** ![Schnitte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/schnitte/32/9033_2.png) [@Schnitte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Schnitte)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2005, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910/30 "2005-12-15T15:39:51Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > There’s a substantial population of Irish Travellers here in the SoOuthern USA, too. One rarely hears about them, but when one does, rest assured, the news is never good. > > Most may well be honest people, but a large minority are professional con/scam artists. They’ll travel from town to town, usually posing as contractors and construction workers. They’ll take a large down payment for a construction project, and then disappear with the money. You know, this is all so much selective reporting. Firstly, you don’t hear a lot about them in general; if they do something “good,” many media will not consider worth reporting on it, so don’t be surprised that almost everything you hear about them is negative. Secondly, con artists that don’t belong to any ethnic group that has a bad reputation may well be reported on by the media, but without mentioning their ethnicity. But if they belong to one of those ethnic groups, you bet the media will underpin this fact thoroughly in their coverage. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-gypsies-as-a-people-still-viable/332910.md?page=1)