# Are liberals really more "evolved" than conservatives? Scientific study suggests answer is yes. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 23, 2011, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383 "2011-02-23T21:18:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2011, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/181 "2011-03-01T19:33:30Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > There is a difference between saying, “That’s fraudulent,” and suppressing one’s ability to say it. > > I am unaware of any climatologist who has lost his position for maintaining that global warming is happening. Well, that’s because the right’s claims are nonsense. You haven’t answered my question yet. What is the point of the right’s lies, if not to suppress those who say things the right does not like? ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2011, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/182 "2011-03-01T21:08:19Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > Until there are no sanctions whatsoever against investigating and publishing biological reasons for racial differences in crime and intelligence it cannot be said that liberals are more respectful of facts and reason than conservatives. If anyone manages to show something other than correlation to demonstrate the possibility of a biological connection between behavior and race, I’ll be all ears. But no one has. And anyone who fails to understand the fundamental flaw in trying to make the case that correlation equals causation has also demonstrated that their understanding of facts and reason is badly broken. And that goes double when the same person consistently ignores all kinds of responses to their deeply flawed and broken quest. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2011, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/183 "2011-03-01T21:11:00Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Well, that’s because the right’s claims are nonsense. You haven’t answered my question yet. What is the point of the right’s lies, if not to suppress those who say things the right does not like? I think he’s trying to say that the bullshit lies coming from the right about global warming don’t actually end up in anyone losing their job, and I guess he has examples of someone losing their job or other position because they tried to demonstrate that blacks are stupid criminals by nature. ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2011, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/184 "2011-03-01T22:31:17Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > If anyone manages to show something other than correlation to demonstrate the possibility of a biological connection between behavior and race, I’ll be all ears. But no one has. And anyone who fails to understand the fundamental flaw in trying to make the case that correlation equals causation has also demonstrated that their understanding of facts and reason is badly broken. > > And that goes double when the same person consistently ignores all kinds of responses to their deeply flawed and broken quest. A persistent correlation certainly does indicate causation. There is a persistent correlation between health factors like age, obesity, smoking, a high fat, a high salt diet and heart disease. I am unaware of any doctors who deny that these factors actually cause heart disease. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2011, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/185 "2011-03-01T22:51:33Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > A persistent correlation certainly does indicate causation. [Soup Nazi] No [points](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation) for you![/Soup Nazi] ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2011, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/186 "2011-03-01T23:13:18Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > A persistent correlation certainly does indicate causation. There is a persistent correlation between health factors like age, obesity, smoking, a high fat, a high salt diet and heart disease. I am unaware of any doctors who deny that these factors actually cause heart disease. Speaking of Heart disease, although I don’t have the numbers on hand, I would posit that you could find a persistent correlation between those people who ate lunchables in the last week and lack of heart disease. Does that mean that eating lunchables protects you from heart disease? ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2011, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/187 "2011-03-01T23:25:44Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > A persistent correlation certainly does indicate causation. There is a persistent correlation between health factors like age, obesity, smoking, a high fat, a high salt diet and heart disease. I am unaware of any doctors who deny that these factors actually cause heart disease. Age causes heart disease??? Yikes! (And actually, you would be wrong about the high fat and the high salt, too. I could argue about the obesity as well, in that obesity is actually not a cause of heart disease, but rather, along with heart disease, a symptom or result of the causes of both, but that’s a pretty major hijack of a thread about conservative brains…) ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/188 "2011-03-02T03:00:28Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > . . . the only people I associate with crime are criminals and the ones I associate with low intelligence are stupid people. They’re pretty easy to spot. Even on message boards. > [@Belowjob2.0](#): > > I suspect that you’re just not smart enough to follow the arguments made in the linked paper. Derogatory comments about another poster’s intelligence are inappropriate in this forum. Knock it off. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/189 "2011-03-02T03:45:04Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > Thank you for these links. They are fascinating. Unfortunately, the first does not go beyond page 24. I’ve just tried it & pages 27-31 are not included in the preview, but pages 32 - 34 should be there. ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2011, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/190 "2011-03-02T04:00:32Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > Until there are no sanctions whatsoever against investigating and publishing biological reasons for racial differences in crime and intelligence it cannot be said that liberals are more respectful of facts and reason than conservatives. Conservatives are probably not much better in that respect. Although David Friedman does point out the irony of some, particularly on the left, who criticise creationism but are also against the potential implications of evolution. > **[Who is Against Evolution?](http://daviddfriedman.blogspot.com/2008/08/who-is-against-evolution.html)** > > "And the religious right has been the chief force against teaching evolution." ( Quoted from Barbara Forrest, a Southeastern Lousiana Unive... ---
**Author:** ![ProudPrimate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7993a0/32.png) [@ProudPrimate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ProudPrimate)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/191 "2011-04-10T12:01:15Z")
> [@Revenant\_Threshold](#): > > “More evolved” is a nonsense phrase. Evolution is about context, and not something that can be said to be better in and of itself. Decidedly unscientific is certainly the right point to make. I disagree. “More evolved” is not equivalent with “better adapted”. Species whose adaptation histories lead them to new solutions are distinct from those whose most recent adaptations are hundreds of millions of years ago. Cockroaches and ants are extremely well adapted to their niche, and extremely successful creatures, I grant you. But they can be said to be complacent as far as evolution goes. Humans are decidedly more evolved — let’s put it this way, not only more evolved, but more recently and more frequently evolved over their historical path. Here’s an old Mutt & Jeff cartoon: Jeff: (reading newspaper) This guy Gottbucks! If I had his money I’d be richer than he is! Mutt: How so? Jeff: I’d still keep my shoe-shine stand. (In case anyone doesn’t get the joke, the amount he’d be richer is vanishingly small in the context. Likewise, it’s a stretch to call evolution-avoidance a successful evolutionary strategy!) Conservatives not only don’t believe in evolution (many of them), they’re unwilling to participate! “Don’t be bringin’ them coal-oil lanterns in here. Candles was good enough for _my_ dad!” ---
**Author:** ![ProudPrimate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7993a0/32.png) [@ProudPrimate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ProudPrimate)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383/192 "2011-04-10T15:04:26Z")
> [@orcenio](#): > > **Violent Crime (per capita)**:…Oakland \> San Francisco \> San Jose > **Property Crime (per capita)**:…Oakland ~ San Francisco \> San Jose > **Black population** :…Oakland \> San Francisco ~ San Jose > > Thus “blacks” are a breed of biologically violent/retarded criminals. Here’s some more stats for ya — Peaceable States — the bottom of the list. 41 Maryland 3.24 42 S Carolina 3.26 43 Oklahoma 3.27 44 Arkansas 3.30 45 Texas 3.30 46 Alabama 3.42 47 Florida 3.50 48 Nevada 3.50 49 Tennessee 3.61 50 Louisiana 3.97 > [@](#): > > “The inaugural [United States Peace Index](http://www.visionofhumanity.org/info-center/us-peace-index/), created by the international think tank, Institute for Economics and Peace is the first-ever ranking of the fifty U.S. states based on their levels of peace. The U.S. Peace Index (USPI) shows Maine is the most peaceful U.S. state, while Louisiana is ranked the least peaceful. > The USPI report reveals that peace in the United States has improved since 1995 primarily driven by a substantial decrease in homicide and violent crime.” So all these (generally) Red states are the most dangerous. Is it therefore hereditary? Or merely circumstantial? Put another way, is it harder for a black kid in the inner city to live a peaceable life? Or easier to slip on that banana peel, than a white suburban kid? Is the legacy of King Cotton, which I admit, all these little creek towns up here in New England, with their brick spinning mills, benefited from — is that legacy still unpaid, like the bill Reagan ran up on the national credit card? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-liberals-really-more-evolved-than-conservatives-scientific-study-suggests-answer-is-yes/572383.md?page=9)