# Are military snipers trained in physics **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 28, 2005, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196 "2005-01-28T22:32:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2005, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/1 "2005-01-28T22:32:07Z")
Are snipers trained in understanding the physics of velocity, wind resistance and gravity so they know how to compensate for wind and distance or is alot of that info going to be taken care of for them by using the (more advanced) sighting mechanism and they just have to plug in info about wind and distance to the sights? ---
**Author:** ![Scruloose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@Scruloose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scruloose)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2005, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/2 "2005-01-28T22:46:31Z")
[This article](http://science.howstuffworks.com/sniper8.htm) on miltary snipers from “How Stuff Works” would indicate that they do get classroom training on those very subjects. > [@](#): > > Snipers spend plenty of time in school cracking the books and in the classroom learning the principles of ballistics, windage, air density, and many other variables that affect the flight of a bullet. But at the end of the day, it comes down to what snipers call “rounds down range.” A sniper’s most valuable classroom is the firing range. Snipers don’t have time in the field to think about theory. Hours at the range help snipers to apply these principles by “feel.” ---
**Author:** ![CynicalGabe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@CynicalGabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CynicalGabe)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2005, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/3 "2005-01-28T22:56:18Z")
Some keep a small chart with windage info and other variables, so they can quickly adjust their scopes without doing an excessive amount of math. ---
**Author:** ![justwannano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7ab992/32.png) [@justwannano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justwannano)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2005, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/4 "2005-01-28T23:06:53Z")
I have a copy of the Armys "Sniper training and employment " handbook. TC 23-14 june 89 for those of you interested in the handbook.I bought it on ebay. Lots of interesting stuff. It covers rifles scopes night vision ammunition Marksmanship Fundamentals calling the shot zeroing the rifle weather effects elevation or wind Camo Cover navigation sniper positions target selection records range estimation A lot of stuff on employment field training measurements and a lot of other stuff. Lots of practical stuff but not at all like college physics. ---
**Author:** ![CynicalGabe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@CynicalGabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CynicalGabe)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2005, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/5 "2005-01-28T23:40:18Z")
> [@justwannano](#): > > Lots of practical stuff but not at all like college physics. I doubt snipers spend all of their time staring at the redhead girl in the front row. ---
**Author:** ![Roadruner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Roadruner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roadruner)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/6 "2005-01-29T08:44:44Z")
Slightly off topic - can sniper rifles have silencers? You see the Hollywood sniper with rifle with scope and silencer hitting targets miles away. I only know stuff from Discovery type channels so am under the impression that a bullet has to “work” its way trough a fitted silencer and to be subsonic. This surely would not be ideal for a long distance sniper shot. Is Hollywood wrong again? ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/7 "2005-01-29T08:56:37Z")
> [@Roadruner](#): > > Slightly off topic - can sniper rifles have silencers? You see the Hollywood sniper with rifle with scope and silencer hitting targets miles away. I only know stuff from Discovery type channels so am under the impression that a bullet has to “work” its way trough a fitted silencer and to be subsonic. This surely would not be ideal for a long distance sniper shot. Is Hollywood wrong again? IANAS (I am not a sniper) but I would imagine that if a military sniper has you in his sights the noise isn’t going to matter because the bullet will get there around the same time, if not faster. I doubt snipers would bother with silencers on the theory that if you can’t kill it with the first shot there’s no point trying again… ---
**Author:** ![theLaughingMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/90db22/32.png) [@theLaughingMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theLaughingMan)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 9:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/8 "2005-01-29T09:07:48Z")
IAANAS(I also am not a sniper) but silencers require subsonic ammo which would decrese both the range and velocity of the round. It would be pointless to try to shoot a bullet 1000meters if it’s just going to bounce off your target. You couldn’t use flash hiders either as oddly enough they would cause you to be more visible to any enemys looking your way. ---
**Author:** ![theLaughingMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/90db22/32.png) [@theLaughingMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theLaughingMan)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/9 "2005-01-29T09:16:07Z")
oops flash hiders should be flash suppressor ---
**Author:** ![caligynephobia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7feea3/32.png) [@caligynephobia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/caligynephobia)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/10 "2005-01-29T16:02:44Z")
A silencer doesn’t necessarily require subsonic ammo - with supersonic ammunition, the silencer only attenuates the sound of the explosion at the muzzle, not the “sonic boom” (cracking sound) the bullet creates as it flies through the air. To eliminate that sound, you do indeed need subsonic ammo. On submachine guns I’ve seen integral silencers where expanding gases are ported off the barrel into the silencer (which is part of the gun), reducing the oomph behind the bullet and rendering a normally supersonic bullet subsonic. Attenuating only the muzzle explosion makes it difficult to identify the source of the gunshot, though there are tools developed to do it from the sound of the supersonic bullet alone. Back to silencers on big rifles, a [couple](http://www.gem-tech.com/tprs.html) [companies](http://www.awcsystech.com/turbodyne.htm) make them in the US. I understand that in parts of Europe, using a silencer is considered being a good neighbor. In the US there is a popular conception associating them with criminals, paranoid white guys and hit-people so the law creates some barriers to civilians owning them. Not too big of a deal; $500 and a background check IIRC, but still a hassle. Obviously the military and law enforcement agencies don’t have to worry about that. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/11 "2005-01-29T16:07:39Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > IANAS (I am not a sniper) but I would imagine that if a military sniper has you in his sights the noise isn’t going to matter because the bullet will get there around the same time, if not faster. I doubt snipers would bother with silencers on the theory that if you can’t kill it with the first shot there’s no point trying again… I don’t think he was worried about whether the target would hear the shot; i think he was more concerned about not giving away the snipers position to other people who may be in the area. ---
**Author:** ![caligynephobia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7feea3/32.png) [@caligynephobia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/caligynephobia)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/12 "2005-01-29T16:12:00Z")
IANAS, etc. I had to write a paper on this stuff back in school. ---
**Author:** ![Scruloose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@Scruloose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scruloose)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/13 "2005-01-29T16:18:13Z")
**Berkut** posted this video link in another thread. It compares super/sub-sonic ammo through a silenced rifle. [http://www.swrmfg.com/video/omega1.asp](http://www.swrmfg.com/video/omega1.asp) ---
**Author:** ![jester21](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ed655f/32.png) [@jester21](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jester21)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/14 "2005-01-29T16:25:25Z")
wouldn’t Breathing Method and Trigger Squeeze be considered a part of physics? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![jester21](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ed655f/32.png) [@jester21](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jester21)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/15 "2005-01-29T16:33:30Z")
[T-1000](http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/ISN501A.html) There are better links out there… do a google search for keywords: Armed Robots or Robots Iraq or SWORDS or TALON, i tried to find one from a ‘reputable’ news source, but i couldn’t find it on [CNN.com](http://CNN.com) ---
**Author:** ![Chairman\_Pow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Chairman\_Pow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chairman_Pow)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/16 "2005-01-29T16:45:37Z")
> [@theLaughingMan](#): > > You couldn’t use flash hiders either as oddly enough they would cause you to be more visible to any enemys looking your way. 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Chairman\_Pow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Chairman\_Pow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chairman_Pow)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/17 "2005-01-29T16:49:50Z")
> [@justwannano](#): > > I have a copy of the Armys "Sniper training and employment " handbook. > TC 23-14 june 89 for those of you interested in the handbook.I bought it on ebay. > Lots of interesting stuff. > > Lots of practical stuff but not at all like college physics. [This the book](http://www.biggerhammer.net/manuals/23-10/toc.htm)? Interesting. ---
**Author:** ![justwannano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7ab992/32.png) [@justwannano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justwannano)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2005, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/18 "2005-01-29T18:18:36Z")
> [@Chairman Pow](#): > > [This the book](http://www.biggerhammer.net/manuals/23-10/toc.htm)? Interesting. That one is more complete and superceds(sp) mine. Darn. If I’d have known about that one I’d not have bought this one 😃 ---
**Author:** ![theLaughingMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/90db22/32.png) [@theLaughingMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theLaughingMan)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2005, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/19 "2005-01-30T06:56:04Z")
> [@Chairman Pow](#): > > 😕 Not my text but from a site who’s info seems valid > [@](#): > > Flash suppresors on sniper rifles. Unfortunatley the more correct term would be “muzzle blast enancers”. When a sniper is trying to fire from a concealed position he creates a “window” for the blast path to travel through. This window is very small at the muzzle and many times the sniper will put his muzzle into the window and use the depth of concealment to his front to conceal his blast. The blast pattern is very small near the muzzle and it widens to a couple of feet in width at about 6-7 feet. (Anybody ever measure this? Wait, I know Rick has because HE is the keeper of all sniper knowledge!) When you slap on a muzzle blast enhancer, the pattern is now huge at the muzzle which tends to blow the shit out of the snipers cover and concealment. Which makes sense to me. Instead of the blast being long and narrow it becomes a giant flat disk around the barrel. I have never verified this in real life though. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2005, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196/20 "2005-01-30T17:07:21Z")
I have verified it. The M-16A2 flash suppressor, when the muzzle is near some loose dirt, kicks up quite the cloud, and shakes any surrounding foilage enough to catch the eye of an observer. A sniper’s nest typically would have a “tunnel” of clear vision to the target from the shooter, but the muzzle would be inside that tunnel, not peeking out. A flash suppressor would shake up the area around the muzzle. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-military-snipers-trained-in-physics/287196.md?page=2)