# Are police allowed to shoot me if I'm in a church? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 8, 2004, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059 "2004-02-08T01:09:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![teemingONE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b4bc9f/32.png) [@teemingONE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teemingONE)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/1 "2004-02-08T01:09:10Z")
I’ve seen that they can’t in a couple of movies but is it true? Do I have to scream “Sanctuary!” first? ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/2 "2004-02-08T01:13:28Z")
Sure they can. Their not Highlanders. Mostly it would depend though. If you were seen as a threat, you bet your behind they’d pump you full of holes. ---
**Author:** ![ltfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@ltfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ltfire)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/3 "2004-02-08T01:13:45Z")
> [@teemingONE](#): > > I’ve seen that they can’t in a couple of movies but is it true? Do I have to scream “Sanctuary!” first? I think that if you are kneeling in a two fisted combat crouch and aiming your ‘nine’ at the officer, then…yes. ---
**Author:** ![fireman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/71c47a/32.png) [@fireman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fireman)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/4 "2004-02-08T01:14:12Z")
Speaking as an ex-cop, I don’t remember this being taught at the academy. I’d say, if you are posing a threat, they will shoot if necessary. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/5 "2004-02-08T01:56:01Z")
It’s _always_ a Catholic church. Anyway; I saw this on _Streets of San Francisco_ once. They have to bring you pizza and stuff till you surrender. Actually, I think you can claim sanctuary for some crimes. Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![Trillionaire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/aeb1de/32.png) [@Trillionaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trillionaire)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/6 "2004-02-08T01:56:08Z")
I seem to recall hearing years back that there was a particular church in Ireland where the police weren’t allowed to apprehend you, let alone shoot you. Can anyone confirm whether this is (or ever was) true? ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/7 "2004-02-08T02:11:40Z")
I imagine, though, even if you did claim and receive sanctuary in a church, if you did something like climb to the top of the belfry with a rifle and started shooting at people outside, the police would be allowed to shoot you. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/8 "2004-02-08T02:16:59Z")
I’m pretty sure sanctuary refers to _political_, more than criminal offenses. I’m going for a cheeseburger. I expect a learned answer by the time I return. Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/9 "2004-02-08T02:44:25Z")
Well, there is one easy and simple way to get yourself so that it is illegal for the police to shoot you: _throw away whatever you have in your hands and assume the surrender position_. Works just as well in church as out in the park or at the mall parking lot or at a Starbuck’s. It does mean you get arrested and locked up, and depending on the precinct you may have some “fun” times while in custody, but they’re not supposed to shoot you. The typical US police force a matter of practice they will be extra hesitant to employ violence inside a place of worship – as opposed to, say, inside a school gym – and as a matter of policy, if there is no imminent threat they’ll seek first to see if they can convince the miscreant to walk out on his own. Else they’ll just sit you out. This is not uncommon – there are jurisdictions around the world where the police may enter neither churches nor schools uninvited. But if you’re a clear and present threat to others – like **Ranchoth** ’s example: you’re in an active shooting spree – they’ll use whatever means are legal to make that threat stop. As biblically established, “sanctuary” was meant to protect people from a lynching/revenge killing – if you WERE guilty, you could be dragged out of the temple to your lawful punishment even if it meant literally prying your fingers from the altar. ---
**Author:** ![moriah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b2d939/32.png) [@moriah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moriah)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/10 "2004-02-08T04:05:29Z")
Sure they can shoot you in church if they have reason to use lethal force. That’s why when I go to church, I always wear a kevlar vestment. ---
**Author:** ![GaryM](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garym/32/241_2.png) [@GaryM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaryM)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/11 "2004-02-08T04:06:58Z")
It worked for Quasimoto! ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/12 "2004-02-08T05:55:47Z")
[The Rite of Sanctuary](http://www.britannia.com/history/articles/coroner4.html) > [@](#): > > There was a formal pattern to the whole procedure of sanctuary, almost like a religious rite, from which it had indeed descended. Of very ancient origin, the concept of sanctuary began with feelings of compassion for the hunted, aroused by early religious and ethical codes. The Hebrews had six Levitical cities of refuge, and in Greek and Roman times there were sanctuaries that ante-dated the Christian ethic of compassion. The Saxon Kings, especially Aethelbert, had strong views on the inviolacy of sanctuary and the Normans accepted and extended the Saxon scale of fines for the violation of churches to seize sanctuary-seekers. 12th century law states that anyone laying violent hands on a fugitive in a cathedral or abbey was subject to a fine of a hundred shillings, but a parish church merited only twenty shillings and a chapel a mere ten. ---
**Author:** ![boofy\_bloke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@boofy\_bloke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boofy_bloke)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/13 "2004-02-08T06:16:59Z")
With the separation of Church and State, the representatives of the State have authority over the representatives of the Church inasmuch as they would over any citizen. This includes the authority to enter someone’s private residence and gun down any _Bible_-thumping, god-bothering, Sanctuary-claiming miscreant they find there. Especially if the miscreant is reaching for an asthma inhaler. Them inhalers can be lethal in the wrong hands. ---
**Author:** ![mmmiiikkkeee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/edb3f5/32.png) [@mmmiiikkkeee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mmmiiikkkeee)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 8:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/14 "2004-02-08T08:43:27Z")
I don’t think there’s anywhere you can hold up where the police aren’t allowed to shoot you if you need to be shot. Personally, if I was outnumbered and knew I was about to be shot by the cops, I’d quickly turn around, get on my knees, and raise my empty hands in the air. Since I know I’m dead no matter what I try, I’d at least like them to have to explain to the judge/jury the bullet holes in my back, my lack of weapons, and any witnesses that saw me giving up just before I got blown away. Haunt them in court from beyond the grave, muhahaha! ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/15 "2004-02-08T09:12:24Z")
> [@mmmiiikkkeee](#): > > Personally, if I was outnumbered and knew I was about to be shot by the cops, I’d quickly turn around, get on my knees, and raise my empty hands in the air. You’ve just removed any incentive for the cops to shoot you. ---
**Author:** ![cornflakes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@cornflakes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cornflakes)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2004, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/16 "2004-02-08T16:19:55Z")
You could ask David Koresh if police are allowed to shoot someone inside a church. Sure, the Branch Davidian compound wasn’t a cathedral, but any law would have to apply equally for both locations. I’m pretty sure that sanctuary is more of a political concept than a legal one, but I’m no expert (so keep chewing on that burger, **mangeorge**.) ---
**Author:** ![mmmiiikkkeee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/edb3f5/32.png) [@mmmiiikkkeee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mmmiiikkkeee)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2004, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/17 "2004-02-09T16:41:09Z")
> [@Walloon](#): > > You’ve just removed any incentive for the cops to shoot you. BZZZZZTT!! Wrong. You’ve removed legal _authorization_ for them to shoot you, but not neccesarily any incentive whatsoever. I said “if I knew I was about to be shot”, meaning I’d done something so bad they were gonna kill me anyways (being human and all)… like I just abducted and killed 15 children in a daycare full of the cop’s own kids, and was running away from them down an dark country road when they caught up to me. Unfortunately there are all kinds of incidences of authorities abusing their power and killing/severly injuring suspects or even people they just plain don’t like without just cause. It still happens today. I’d at least like to leave a little evidence that this happened to me rather than let my killers make up any story they wanted and have it believed. ---
**Author:** ![pcroughn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/977dab/32.png) [@pcroughn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pcroughn)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2004, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/18 "2004-02-09T19:52:03Z")
I’m pretty sure ‘sanctuary’ isn’t a law. If the cops wait for you to come out, it’s because they don’t want folk to look at them as a-holes. If Osama bin-Laden was holes up in St. Pete’s, I’m pretty sure they’d go in after him. ---
**Author:** ![Chastain86](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Chastain86](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chastain86)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2004, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/19 "2004-02-09T20:17:09Z")
> [@moriah](#): > > That’s why when I go to church, I always wear a kevlar vestment. [golf clap] Good form. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2004, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-police-allowed-to-shoot-me-if-im-in-a-church/228059/20 "2004-02-09T21:05:22Z")
You’re forgetting one of the essential rules of Sanctuary. You have to be granted it by the priest (or whoever actually controls that place of worship.) If you run into a church after shooting, let’s say, a minivan full of nuns yelling for Sanctuary, odds are that kindly old father Reilly is going to wave down the first police car that arrives and yell “Come and get him, he’s in here!”