# Are some parents really that DENSE! Stupid ass book banning Parents! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 14, 2005, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677 "2005-09-14T22:27:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/61 "2005-09-15T15:19:52Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > Ban Hawthorne? > > (draws sword) Never bring a knife to a gun fight. (draws gun) ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/62 "2005-09-15T15:30:04Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Never bring a knife to a gun fight. > > (draws gun) Never draw a gun on the man who poisoned your coffee 20 minutes ago - šŸ™‚ How you feelā€™in? ā€¦turns and walks away šŸ˜‰ Seriously folks. Those of you who were required to read _The catcher in the Rye, Of Mice and Men, The scarlet Letter, Night, The Bacchae_ - are you seriously any worse the wear? Reading these literary classics is what makes us free thinkersā€¦amongst other things. ---
**Author:** ![Madd\_Maxx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Madd\_Maxx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Madd_Maxx)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/63 "2005-09-15T15:31:01Z")
> [@BwanaBob](#): > > Is that list publicly available? I donā€™t know but Iā€™ll make you a copy and send it to you. Iā€™m going to grab one for myself on Monday. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/64 "2005-09-15T15:32:02Z")
> [@Phlosphr](#): > > Seriously folks. Those of you who were required to read _The catcher in the Rye, Of Mice and Men, The scarlet Letter, Night, The Bacchae_ - are you seriously any worse the wear? > Reading these literary classics is what makes us free thinkersā€¦amongst other things. Bah. I HATED _Catcher in the Rye_. Freakinā€™ whiny bastard Holden. ā€œOoh, woe is me. Oh, Iā€™m so angsty!ā€ Damn idiot. So, yes, I am worse for wear. šŸ™‚ ---
**Author:** ![5que](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/5/3bc359/32.png) [@5que](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/5que)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/65 "2005-09-15T15:34:43Z")
> [@bouv](#): > > So yeah, count me in on the ā€œcousin=ickyā€ crowd. But getting back to the OP. Considering my cousinsā€¦ Iā€™m in the cousin=icky squared crowd. Make that cousin=icky cubed. And Iā€™m from the southā€¦ ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/66 "2005-09-15T16:07:20Z")
> [@Case Sensitive](#): > > Tom Bombadil sucked dick? Nah, just licked the tip a little. Or was that licked a little tip? The words are so similar in the original Quenya. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![Hyperelastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Hyperelastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hyperelastic)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/67 "2005-09-15T16:17:12Z")
> [@Maureen](#): > > The whole idea behind getting kids to read some of these books is to expose (gasp!) them to different view points. Open their minds to things theyā€™d never otherwise be exposed to. Getting them to think about things from a different perspective. My 12 year old read _The Diary of Anne Frank_ in her history class last year. If 12 is old enough to know about something as obscene as ā€œethnic cleansingā€, is 17 really too young to know about oral sex? Is it really that horrible? Comparing _The Diary of Anne Frank_ to a minor novel published to mixed reviews in 1992 is what literary scholars refer to as ā€œreally stretching itā€. Cocksucking is not a viewpoint. If the school wants kids to learn about the relationship between Islam and India, they ought to assign something by Naipaul or Rushdie, preferably both. It would be a lot easier to defend those authors against an attempted book-banning. > [@MaddMaxx](#): > > My school (Penn State) has a list hanging up of the books that have the most attempted bannings. I see it as a personal challenge to read some of the oneā€™s I havenā€™t read. That is the dumbest possible reason for deciding which books to read. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/68 "2005-09-15T16:34:20Z")
Why is that dumb? When you consider that such childrenā€™s classics as _Little House on the Prairie_ and _The Phantom Tollbooth_ were both banned at one timeā€“the lists of banned books piques my curiosity no end. What the hell is wrong with people --how does a BOOK threaten someone? I donā€™t see how an ā€œalternateā€ assignment is in the kidā€™s best interests at all. How does s/he then discuss and debate theme, plot and character? Oh, yeahā€“those who support banned books also donā€™t support different points of view and opening of young minds. My bad. I keep forgetting. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/69 "2005-09-15T16:58:22Z")
> [@eleanorigby](#): > > \ > I donā€™t see how an ā€œalternateā€ assignment is in the kidā€™s best interests at all. How does s/he then discuss and debate theme, plot and character? They donā€™t they are left out, and other students are left to discern for themselves why little Tammy canā€™t read the book with naked people in it. Or hopefully little Tammy is discusted with her Motherā€™s tyranny and rebels and starts reading the book anywayā€¦ ---
**Author:** ![if6was9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@if6was9](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/if6was9)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/70 "2005-09-15T17:27:33Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > If the school wants kids to learn about the relationship between Islam and India, they ought to assign something by Naipaul or Rushdie, preferably both. It would be a lot easier to defend those authors against an attempted book-banning. You want them to select the books on the basis that theyā€™re defendable? The banners will have already won. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/71 "2005-09-15T17:37:33Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > Cocksucking is not a viewpoint. If the school wants kids to learn about the relationship between Islam and India, they ought to assign something by Naipaul or Rushdie, preferably both. No, but a young woman in a nascent Islamic state certainly has a _point of view_. What do you suppose the reader is supposed to make of the _almost_ ā€œcocksucking?ā€ Did you get the sense that it was intended to have prurient appeal? Or were we meant to feel that the protagonist was imperilled in some way? What conditions led her to blithely take her cousinā€™s penis in her hand? What information does this vignette convey about her environment? Do you think the author believes that complete naivete about sexual matters serves a twelve-year-old-girl well? ---
**Author:** ![SusanStoHelit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ab992/32.png) [@SusanStoHelit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SusanStoHelit)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/72 "2005-09-15T17:47:04Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Sheā€™s _seventeen_. Surely thatā€™s old enough to be able to allow her daughter to read whatever the fuck she wants. I wouldnā€™t try to control that motherā€™s parenting choices (as long as they werenā€™t abusive) any more than she should try to dictate anyone elseā€™s. And anyway, what if the daughter wanted to read something different? There should always be another reading choice for classroom assignments. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/73 "2005-09-15T17:56:36Z")
> [@SusanStoHelit](#): > > And anyway, what if the daughter wanted to read something different? There should always be another reading choice for classroom assignments. What if the daughter wanted to continue reading the assigned work but momm y didnā€™t want her to? ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/74 "2005-09-15T18:02:17Z")
> [@SusanStoHelit](#): > > = And anyway, what if the daughter wanted to read something different? There should always be another reading choice for classroom assignments. No there should not, **if** the reading is going to be further discussed in class. The entire class needs to be on the same page _(pun intended_). **If** the purpose is just to write a report at the end, I can see offering alternative choices. ---
**Author:** ![Giraffe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giraffe/32/129_2.png) [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/75 "2005-09-15T18:03:47Z")
> [@SusanStoHelit](#): > > And anyway, what if the daughter wanted to read something different? There should always be another reading choice for classroom assignments. Not if the class is reading and discussing a book together, as happens in most high school english classes. And where did the idea that classroom assignments should be voluntary come from? What if the daughter doesnā€™t want to do a given algebra assignment, or chemistry lab, or read a given history book? Students donā€™t get to pick and choose what they learn. ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/76 "2005-09-15T18:09:16Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > ā€¦That is the dumbest possible reason for deciding which books to read. Yeah, Iā€™m really not getting that. Part of what literature is, at least to me, is a mirror that is held up to the world. It is a way for us to see our society better. The fact that a group of people are up in arms enough that they donā€™t want anyone else to look is very interesting and, as far as I am concerned, is an indication that those particular books have the potential to be more interesting and important than others simply because of the dialog and backlash that they have caused with society. ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/77 "2005-09-15T18:16:19Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > Comparing _The Diary of Anne Frank_ to a minor novel published to mixed reviews in 1992 is what literary scholars refer to as ā€œreally stretching itā€. Cocksucking is not a viewpoint. If the school wants kids to learn about the relationship between Islam and India, they ought to assign something by Naipaul or Rushdie, preferably both. It would be a lot easier to defend those authors against an attempted book-banning. And tapdancing around my question is what we here at the Dope call ā€œavoidance.ā€ So how about you answer, huh? Why is it appropriate for a 6th grade history teacher to use _Diary of Anne Frank_ as a tool for 12 year olds to gain perspective on what it was like to be Jewish in Germany during the reign of Adolph Hitler, but inappropriate for a senior high school lit teacher to choose a book which, in their opinion, illustrates the religious mores and interpersonal relationships in India? Bearing in mind that when it comes to Lit teachers, opinions count for a great deal of what ends up on the syllabus. > [@](#): > > That is the dumbest possible reason for deciding which books to read. Really? Ever open a locked thread just on the basis that it was locked? How come? Reading a book on the sole basis that itā€™s been banned is no worse a reason than solely reading books because someone says itā€™s a classic. Reading a banned book tells whoever it is trying to ban it that they are not allowed to make your choices for you. That you are not going to be led by their views of what is and what is not acceptable reading material. In short; that you can think for yourself. They hate that. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/78 "2005-09-15T18:27:35Z")
> [@SusanStoHelit](#): > > I wouldnā€™t try to control that motherā€™s parenting choices (as long as they werenā€™t abusive) any more than she should try to dictate anyone elseā€™s. > > And anyway, what if the daughter wanted to read something different? There should always be another reading choice for classroom assignments. Certainly. I suggest we stick with Dick & Jane (all 8 pages) as an alternative choice all throughout primary and secondary education. Of course, weā€™ll have to change the name to make it less offensive, but what are you gonna do? Nothingā€™s perfect. Of course, any book that mentions religion must have an alternative that doesnā€™t. And, well, I just donā€™t like them negroes, so anything that has anything other than lily-white folks just wonā€™t do. And you canā€™t mention the USA because itā€™ll piss off foreigners since so many of them hate the USA, and besides, mentioning the USA could offend some southern folksā€¦you donā€™t want to remind them that they lost the War of Northern Aggression. I guess the only solution is to read nothing at all. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/79 "2005-09-15T18:34:23Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#): > > Okay, I retract this somewhat, having hunted down the actual passage. I had assumed that, because it is uncontroversial in Pakistan, it must be extremely oblique. Not so much. > > [Here is the text thatā€™s being objected to.](http://www.larrymudd.com/images/cracking_india_passage.gif) Are you sure that isnā€™t testimony from the Clinton impeachment? šŸ˜› ---
**Author:** ![Orual](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/779978/32.png) [@Orual](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orual)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2005, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677/80 "2005-09-15T18:34:59Z")
> [@SusanStoHelit](#): > > I wouldnā€™t try to control that motherā€™s parenting choices (as long as they werenā€™t abusive) any more than she should try to dictate anyone elseā€™s. > > And anyway, what if the daughter wanted to read something different? There should always be another reading choice for classroom assignments. How on earth is a student supposed to take part in class discussions if they donā€™t read the same book? You seem to have a fundemental lack of understanding about how a high school eEnglish class works. If a parent is that insistent on choosing the reading material for her child, perhaps she should look into home schooling. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-some-parents-really-that-dense-stupid-ass-book-banning-parents/321677.md?page=5)