# Are the actions of BLM wise or foolish? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 22, 2015, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278 "2015-11-22T15:18:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2015, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/381 "2015-12-14T13:32:58Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > Yo, first of all calm down. I’m not a Nazi. Come on, brother, I’m not about that life. I am an American who is an independent. I want a strong military, because a weak one is not a good one. I want to have a good discussion. Are you familiar with the concept of _reductio ad absurdum_? Or of analogies in general? ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2015, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/382 "2015-12-14T18:04:31Z")
I’m happy to see the Washington Post name, “Hands up, Don’t shoot” as one of their biggest lies of 2015. > **[The biggest Pinocchios of 2015](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2015/12/14/the-biggest-pinocchios-of-2015/)** > > Our annual roundup of the most outlandish claims of 2015. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2015, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/383 "2015-12-14T19:22:03Z")
> [@GloryDays](#): > > Yo, first of all calm down. I’m not a Nazi. He didn’t call you a Nazi, he pointed out that, by your logic you _could_ be called a Nazi. Which is why people should not follow your logic, because it leads to transparently ridiculous conclusions. > [@](#): > > I want to have a good discussion. Then you need to majorly step up your game, because you are signally failing at holding up your side. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2015, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/384 "2015-12-14T21:38:26Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > **GloryHole** logic (sic): > A: People support Black Lives Matter > B: Some random retarded leftist sect supports Black Lives Matter > C: Therefore all BLM supporters subscribe to said retarded leftist sect > > Let us apply this logic closer at hand: > A: **GloryHole** supports high military spending > B: The Nazis supported high military spending > C: Therefore **GloryHole** is a Nazi QSH, you should know better than to insult someone like this. Warning issued. Control yourself. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2016, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/385 "2016-03-20T04:58:53Z")
> [@orcenio](#): > > That’s the power of mass protesting. That why Chicago mayor Rahm Emanuel [is sacred enough to fire his police superintendent](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/02/us/chicago-police-rahm-emanuel-laquan-mcdonald.html) today. That’s why Cook County State’s Attorney Anita Alvarez’s political opponents [are circling her like sharks](http://www.nbcchicago.com/blogs/ward-room/Anita-Alvarez-Responds-to-Calls-for-Her-Resignation-359012851.html). > > For all the talk on how protesters’ would be more effective by taking no, little, or more passive actions they seem to be getting results. Update: State’s Attorney Anita Alvarez, the person who’s responsible for helping cover up Chicago police officer Jason Van Dyke’s shooting of Laquan McDonald for 13 months -then hurryingly charging Van Dyke with 1st degree murder hours before video of the shooting was forced public by a judge, lost her bid for re-election Tuesday to Kim Foxx. [By a factor of 2:1](http://www.chicagotribune.com/ct-cook-states-attorney-election-precinct-maps-20160317-htmlstory.html). [ [QUOTE=Chicago Tribune: Editorial Board] …But we might still be waiting for charges — Van Dyke might still be collecting a paycheck — if the video hadn’t been shaken loose. Voters found that lack of urgency unforgivable. [/QUOTE] ]([http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-alvarez-laquan-special-prosecutor-van-dyke-edit-0320-jm-20160318-story.html](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-alvarez-laquan-special-prosecutor-van-dyke-edit-0320-jm-20160318-story.html)) ---
**Author:** ![halfmut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@halfmut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/halfmut)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2016, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/386 "2016-03-21T00:36:29Z")
> [@](#): > > But I know that I’d also be the type to cringe during the protests of the 50s and 60s. I would have also been the little darkie cringing under the bed during slave rebellion. I cringe whenever people are angry enough to actually _do_ something. I much more prefer talking in abstracts and ideals in a calm voice rather than taking to the streets and getting dirty. > > History will judge me too. > > I know one thing. I don’t cringe when I hear or read about yet another black life needlessly murdered by the police. I feel a rage, but it eventually fades away because it’s not in my nature to sustain a emotion for longer than a few minutes. One day maybe it won’t be that way. Maybe one day I’ll be angry enough to join a protest and make someone else cringe for a change. I really appreciate your honesty here. I don’t think your fear is unwarranted. It’s hard taking a stand under any circumstance, even more so when the opponent could be likely to physically brutalize you. ---
**Author:** ![Kiante\_83](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9fc29f/32.png) [@Kiante\_83](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiante_83)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/387 "2016-03-22T18:27:07Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > Well, MLK seemed to have a lot more success with his polite, dignified, & peaceful protests after the rise of groups like the Blank Panther Party & black leaders like Stokely Carmichael. After that, it somehow seemed that MLK was the responsible black leader that they could reason with. > > This kind of good-cop, bad-cop scenario might be something useful for the BLM movement to consider. You must have forgotten that he got assassinated. ---
**Author:** ![mtomm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df788c/32.png) [@mtomm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mtomm)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/388 "2016-03-22T18:35:56Z")
Sorry, wrong thread. ---
**Author:** ![Kiante\_83](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9fc29f/32.png) [@Kiante\_83](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiante_83)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/389 "2016-03-22T18:51:02Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Well I was only looking at the college students who had issues and many of those were academic in nature like wanting more black faculty and students. I didnt read about any of them getting unequal treatment. Remember MU already has a black student union and the student body president is black. Nobody is being told to sit in the back of the bus or to vacate a lunch counter. > > But I will go back to my statement that if you want respect on a college campus, you get the best grades. You be the kind of students the professors like to work with. Heck, you be the kind of students others want to cheat off of. > > Achievement is the best way of giving the finger to those who dont like you. Like the respect President Obama gets from everybody? ---
**Author:** ![Kiante\_83](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9fc29f/32.png) [@Kiante\_83](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiante_83)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/390 "2016-03-22T18:59:42Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Their position rings hollow because it ignores the vast numbers of murders committed. I disagree with their tactics because it’s passive aggressive bullshit. It also spurs the kind of violence that has resulted in the murders of police officers. What does black on black violence have to do with police brutality? Hell you don’t even care that %84 of white murders are white on white violence. This again has nothing to do with the fact that they’re asking for equal treatment from the Police who are paid by American citizens because they take an oath to uphold the law in comparison to just regular citizens who don’t make any type of promise about how they’ll act. If you don’t care about unnecessary violence, which I doubt you do since you’re not on the sidelines fighting for bringing down white on white violence, why don’t you just stay out of debates when it comes to people who do care. Especially when you’re not even debating the actual issue. ---
**Author:** ![Kiante\_83](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9fc29f/32.png) [@Kiante\_83](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiante_83)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/391 "2016-03-22T19:06:00Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > From what I have read, I think shooting Laquan McDonald was morally justified. By attacking the police officer’s vehicle, he escalated the threat to the point where his surrender was the only acceptable course of action. Allowing someone armed with a deadly weapon and a willingness to use it to evade capture to keep running means accepting any injury or death he may cause once he gets close enough to someone else that carjacking or hostage taking seem like viable means of continuing to escape. So you think the Prosecutor that was voted into office and has an actual Law Degree was wrong in bringing up First Degree Murder Charges for the cop? Do you think the cop should have to face any consequences for lying on the police report that was shown to be a complete farce once the video was released? Does anybody other than dead black kid have to face responsibilities for their actions? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/392 "2016-03-22T19:38:59Z")
> [@Kiante\_83](#): > > So you think the Prosecutor that was voted into office and has an actual Law Degree was wrong in bringing up First Degree Murder Charges for the cop? Yes. It seems like overkill. > [@](#): > > Does anybody other than dead black kid have to face responsibilities for their actions? His mother seems to have fucked him up pretty badly - > [@](#): > > The ward was born to a 15-year-old mother who herself was a ward. The teen mother entered DCFS care at the age of 12 because of her mother’s extensive drug history, including giving birth to a substance-exposed (PCP) infant, her lack of participation in services, and her extensive criminal history for drug charges. By the age of 18 the teen ward lost custody of her then 3-year-old son and his younger sister after she left the children home alone and the younger sister suffered extensive burns which required hospitalization. The mother was indicated for inadequate supervision. The two children were placed with several relatives and were returned to the mother in 18 months under an order of protection. A year after they were returned to their mother, the then 5-year-old boy and his sister reentered DCFS custody because of physical abuse by the mother and her boyfriend. The boy reported that he often witnessed domestic violence between his mother and her boyfriend. His father was incarcerated. The mother, then 21 years old, did not participate in services, struggled with continued drug use and did not visit her children. [Cite](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laquan_McDonald). Perhaps she should face some consequences, not that it will do any good. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Kiante\_83](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9fc29f/32.png) [@Kiante\_83](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiante_83)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/393 "2016-03-22T19:49:33Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > The shooting was on August 9th. Demonstrations and unrest began that same day. The report and video of the robbery weren’t released until August 15th. And funny thing about the video is it’s not Michael Brown. In the video you can see that the kid is wearing flip flops. In the really long video showing Michael Brown’s body dead in the street you can see that he was wearing tennis shoes. Also the store owner stated there wasn’t any robbery that’s why he didn’t call the cops. This is also on video. Darren Wilson just happened to come across Michael Brown and basically killed him for not getting out of the middle of the street when he was driving by. They’ve also verified that Michael Brown was 148 feet away from Darren White when he was murdered as opposed to the 34 feet that was initially lied about in the report. You’d have to be one scared cookie when you need to kill somebody who is damn near half a football field away from you. And there is no truth to his statements about tussling with the officer near the vehicle otherwise he would have then had to been good enough to run over half a football field away from the officer, then for whatever reason change his mind and charge back for the officer only to get shot half a football field away. And that really doesn’t make sense. I don’t know why you’re so quick to believe the lying police, when they’ve been proven over and over to lie in their reports due to nobody fact checking them the majority of the time. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/394 "2016-03-22T20:00:58Z")
> [@Kiante\_83](#): > > And funny thing about the video is it’s not Michael Brown. In the video you can see that the kid is wearing flip flops. In the really long video showing Michael Brown’s body dead in the street you can see that he was wearing tennis shoes. [Brown’s body in the street](https://www.google.com/search?q=michael+brown+robbery&biw=1544&bih=817&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj18b2VidXLAhUDdD4KHUABCoYQ_AUICCgD&dpr=1#tbm=isch&q=michael+brown+body&imgrc=1eM7sGacqkgjhM%3A) [Brown in the store](https://www.google.com/search?q=michael+brown+robbery&biw=1544&bih=817&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj18b2VidXLAhUDdD4KHUABCoYQ_AUICCgD&dpr=1#tbm=isch&q=michael+brown+body&imgrc=mv8UwvAlEZVujM%3A) Those are the same shoes…and the same shirt, and the same shorts. If you respond in good faith, I’ll address your other points. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/395 "2016-03-22T20:05:46Z")
> [@Kiante\_83](#): > > Also the store owner stated there wasn’t any robbery that’s why he didn’t call the cops. This is also on video. How did he get the stolen cigars if he didn’t rob the store? > [@](#): > > And there is no truth to his statements about tussling with the officer near the vehicle… How did he get shot in the hand, and how did Brown’s DNA get on Wilson’s gun and the SUV, if they never struggled for the gun near the SUV? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/396 "2016-03-22T20:09:01Z")
> [@Kiante\_83](#): > > They’ve also verified that Michael Brown was 148 feet away from Darren White when he was murdered as opposed to the 34 feet that was initially lied about in the report. If Brown was 148 feet away from Wilson when he was shot, how did the casings from Wilson’s gun wind up next to Brown’s body and beyond it? Is it your belief that the shells flew 152 feet? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/397 "2016-03-22T20:17:07Z")
> [@](#): > > Also the store owner stated there wasn’t any robbery that’s why he didn’t call the cops. Somebody seems to have notified the police dispatcher of a theft in progress at the convenience store. They gave a description of the robber as a black male, acccompanied by another black male, wearing a white T-shirt, a red St. Louis Cardinals hat, yellow socks, and khaki shorts. By the merest coincidence, Brown just happened to be wearing a white T-shirt, a red baseball cap, and khaki shorts. He was in the company of another black male, Dorian Johnson, who, again by sheer coincidence, recounted how Brown had indeed stolen the cigars. > [@](#): > > In his testimony to the grand jury, Johnson said that he and Brown had walked to a convenience store to buy cigarillos, but Brown instead reached over the counter and took them and shoved a clerk on his way out the door (Same cite.) That certainly seems like strong-arm robbery to me. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/398 "2016-03-22T20:29:07Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > If Brown was 148 feet away from Wilson when he was shot, how did the casings from Wilson’s gun wind up next to Brown’s body and beyond it? Is it your belief that the shells flew 152 feet? > > Regards, > Shodan Michael Brown was a horrible icon to rally around, he committed robbery and he probably assaulted the police officer. But, how did the bullet casings fly 34 feet? I’ve never seen bullet casing fly that distance our of a gun and certainly not on a forward trajectory. Despite Michael Brown making for a horrible martyr, there are a LOT of issues in the St Louis area with racism, particularly within the police departments. ---
**Author:** ![Kiante\_83](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9fc29f/32.png) [@Kiante\_83](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiante_83)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/399 "2016-03-22T20:52:14Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It doesn’t make any difference. That Rice had a gun is not established by the video; it is established by the original complaint of someone waving a gun around in the park, the video showing Rice waving it around in the park, his mother’s later testimony that he had the gun, and by the fact that the fucking thing was found on him when he was shot. > > But apart from that - yes, there is no reason to believe he had a gun. > > Regards, > Shodan What you really mean is that it makes no difference what the facts are for every type of situation like this. You always give benefit to the cops, never even fathoming that the cops lie ever so it’s basically useless debating with you. To say that that the cops were justified in killing him in seconds because somebody reported there being a gun and them shooting him when he lowered his hand despite not announcing their presence is despicable. There are plenty of videos where the police are able to arrest white grown men who are actively pointing the gun at multiple officers when they have been notified that he is armed (just youtube armed white men getting arrested), even in cases where they have already been reported to have murdered people. Another the thing to take into consideration is Cleveland is an Open Carry state so even if he was found with a gun, it’s not reasonable to consider he was breaking any laws until a) they could verify it was a real gun and b) verify that he didn’t have a license for said fantasy “real” gun. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2016, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/400 "2016-03-22T21:08:55Z")
> [@Kiante\_83](#): > > What you really mean is that it makes no difference what the facts are for every type of situation like this. You always give benefit to the cops, never even fathoming that the cops lie ever so it’s basically useless debating with you. And yet, here you are. > [@](#): > > To say that that the cops were justified in killing him in seconds because somebody reported there being a gun and them shooting him when he lowered his hand despite not announcing their presence is despicable. You are kind of jumping around here. You have made a number of assertions about the Michael Brown shooting, not many of which are true. Would you care to respond to those, or shall we simply assume you have been refuted and then we can discuss Tamir Rice? Regards, Shodan [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278.md?page=21)