# Are the actions of BLM wise or foolish? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 22, 2015, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278 "2015-11-22T15:18:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/161 "2015-12-03T04:25:06Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > You can’t just post indefensible bullshit and expect other posters not to challenge it, though I agree you seem to be giving it a jolly good try. BLM is claiming the nuclear family is bad. Fine. If you agree with them then best of luck. I came from a whole school system where it worked nicely. Nobody dropped out. School was like a vacation compared to adult life. But BLM obviously has issues with it. They’re free to raise their children any way they feel. Blaming the nuclear family is nothing but an excuse. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/162 "2015-12-03T04:28:30Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > The result is also the top cop in Chi-town losing his job, the State’s Attorney in fear for her future employment, the Mayor himself on shaky ground, the Illinois Attorney General calling for the Federal investigation of the Chicago PD. So, yeah, foolish is entirely the wrong word to describe the movement. How does that advance their cause? Every person you mentioned just moves on to another cushy job. The rise in homicides on the other hand is the exact opposite of their goal. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/163 "2015-12-03T05:21:17Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > BLM is claiming the nuclear family is bad. No, they’re not, as you could see if you actually **read** that quote from their website that’s been re-quoted for your convenience like three or four times now. They are claiming that _“the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure **requirement** ”_ is bad. In other words, **BLM is not saying anything whatsoever against nuclear families**. What they are saying is that it’s bad to **require** that family structure **has** to be nuclear for **everybody**. I really don’t know how to explain this to you more clearly. It seems like a pretty straightforward distinction to grasp and I don’t see any other posters having trouble with it, but it’s been over two pages now and you’re still not getting it. [QUOTE=Magiver] I came from a whole school system where it worked nicely. […] School was like a vacation compared to adult life. [/QUOTE] I can well believe it. While I sympathize with your subsequent struggles in adapting to the more onerous cognitive demands of adulthood, I think your parents probably bear some of the responsibility for not sending you to a school that would actually teach you to read for comprehension. Still, good on them for successfully maintaining that nuclear family, though! Credit where it’s due, and all that. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/164 "2015-12-03T16:44:30Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > No, they’re not, as you could see if you actually **read** that quote from their website that’s been re-quoted for your convenience like three or four times now. > > They are claiming that _“the Western-prescribed nuclear family structure **requirement** ”_ is bad. > > In other words, **BLM is not saying anything whatsoever against nuclear families**. What they are saying is that it’s bad to **require** that family structure **has** to be nuclear for **everybody**. > > I really don’t know how to explain this to you more clearly. It seems like a pretty straightforward distinction to grasp and I don’t see any other posters having trouble with it, but it’s been over two pages now and you’re still not getting it. Wow. Really, just wow. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/165 "2015-12-03T17:05:40Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Wow. Really, just wow. Yes, **Magiver** , it’s bizarre but it’s the sort of thing you have to get used to on the SDMB. BLM has made its demands. You aren’t supposed to ask if they make sense - that’s white privilege. Just shut up, confess your racism, and hand over the money for the free tuition and financial advisors for illegal aliens, revise the speech codes so no one is allowed to disagree with whatever BLM says, rearrange the welfare system so unwed parents live a comfortable middle-class life, indite Darren Wilson for murder, and everything will be fine. Forget it, Jake - it’s Chinatown. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/166 "2015-12-03T17:10:32Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Yes, **Magiver** , it’s bizarre but it’s the sort of thing you have to get used to on the SDMB. > > BLM has made its demands. You aren’t supposed to ask if they make sense - that’s white privilege. Just shut up, confess your racism, and hand over the money for the free tuition and financial advisors for illegal aliens, revise the speech codes so no one is allowed to disagree with whatever BLM says, rearrange the welfare system so unwed parents live a comfortable middle-class life, indite Darren Wilson for murder, and everything will be fine. > > Forget it, Jake - it’s Chinatown. > > Regards, > Shodan I share your concern and disdain for this fantasy-version of BLM. Down with fantasy-BLM! Down with fantasy-BLM! ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/167 "2015-12-03T17:46:37Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > [Why violent crime increased in the first 6 months of 2015 | Vox](http://www.vox.com/2015/9/8/9273139/murder-rates-rising-sharply) > > The idea that this is somehow demonstrated to be causative is nonsense. Even the claim that it’s statistically significant has come under fire. This wasn’t a random claim and the numbers are up. No amount of statistical game playing changes the actual and dramatic rise in homicides. FBI Director James Comey discussing [Ferguson effect](http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/26/politics/fbi-comey-crime-police/). [The Baltimore Chief of Police was fired over it.](http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/baltimore-city/bs-md-ci-batts-fired-20150708-story.html) [NPR’s discussion of it:](http://www.npr.org/2015/09/05/437768139/murders-on-the-rise-in-major-u-s-cities) If I made the claim that sharp rise in black homicides was meaningless statistical hogwash the vitriol that flowed in response would be substantial. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/168 "2015-12-03T17:47:18Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I share your concern and disdain for this fantasy-version of BLM. Down with fantasy-BLM! Down with fantasy-BLM! What fantasy version did you think you were talking about? > [@](#): > > We demand that University of Missouri System President, Tim Wolfe, writes a hand-written apology to Concerned Student 1-9-5-0 demonstrators and holds a press conference in the Mizzou Student Center reading the letter. In the letter and at the press conference, [Cite](http://www.missourinet.com/2015/11/08/list-of-demands-calls-for-university-president-wolfe-to-apologize-and-resign/). > [@](#): > > Eight financial aid consultants who are trained to deal specifically with financial aid application processes of international and undocumented students [Cite](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2015/11/13/minority-students-at-yale-give-list-of-demands-to-university-president/). Etc. I won’t bother with citing the rest. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/169 "2015-12-03T17:53:42Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Etc. I won’t bother with citing the rest. I thought you were talking about the fantasy-version of BLM, that demands everyone “Just shut up, confess your racism, and hand over the money for the free tuition and financial advisors for illegal aliens, revise the speech codes so no one is allowed to disagree with whatever BLM says, rearrange the welfare system so unwed parents live a comfortable middle-class life, indite Darren Wilson for murder, and everything will be fine”? If you’re just switching back and forth between real-world and fantasy versions of BLM, it’d be helpful for you to label which posts, or which sentences (or even which phrases!) are dealing with which. Maybe use a different font? Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/170 "2015-12-03T18:00:35Z")
That’s mostly why I realized I didn’t need to bother with cites. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/171 "2015-12-03T18:12:03Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > That’s mostly why I realized I didn’t need to bother with cites. > > Regards, > Shodan You can use fantasy-cites for your claims about the fantasy-BLM, and real cites for claims about the real BLM. Success! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/172 "2015-12-03T18:39:10Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Yes, **Magiver** , it’s bizarre but it’s the sort of thing you have to get used to on the SDMB. > > BLM has made its demands. You aren’t supposed to ask if they make sense - that’s white privilege. Just shut up, confess your racism, and hand over the money for the free tuition and financial advisors for illegal aliens, revise the speech codes so no one is allowed to disagree with whatever BLM says, rearrange the welfare system so unwed parents live a comfortable middle-class life, indite Darren Wilson for murder, and everything will be fine. > > Forget it, Jake - it’s Chinatown. > > Regards, > Shodan yes, BLM has made it’s demands. They’ve shut down markets and intimidated police. And the police have responded with the only thing that makes sense and that’s to stand back and watch it all burn to the ground. How many officers have been shot this year? 34. Nobody marching and shutting down businesses for them. How many were shot in cold blood? Did Ricardo Galvez make the news when a group of 3 walked up to him in his car and started shooting? Make no mistake, there is no law on the books that says they need to flush out drug dealers or thieves or any other criminal. They can just as easily drive around listening to tunes for 8 hrs waiting on the next call to fill out paperwork on a corpse. If a 5 year dies in the crossfire it’s just another sheet of paper to fill out. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/173 "2015-12-03T20:25:48Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > yes, BLM has made it’s demands. They’ve shut down markets and intimidated police. And the police have responded with the only thing that makes sense and that’s to stand back and watch it all burn to the ground. How many officers have been shot this year? 34. Nobody marching and shutting down businesses for them. How many were shot in cold blood? Did Ricardo Galvez make the news when a group of 3 walked up to him in his car and started shooting? > > Make no mistake, there is no law on the books that says they need to flush out drug dealers or thieves or any other criminal. They can just as easily drive around listening to tunes for 8 hrs waiting on the next call to fill out paperwork on a corpse. If a 5 year dies in the crossfire it’s just another sheet of paper to fill out. So _South Park_ had it right - we as a society have to make a deal, where the police are allowed to brutalize minorities in exchange for doing their jobs, because that’s why they became police in the first place? Sobering stuff, there. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/174 "2015-12-03T21:47:41Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > [Cite](http://www.missourinet.com/2015/11/08/list-of-demands-calls-for-university-president-wolfe-to-apologize-and-resign/). > [Cite](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2015/11/13/minority-students-at-yale-give-list-of-demands-to-university-president/). Legion of Black Collegians and Next Yale. Neither article says a word about BLM. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/175 "2015-12-03T22:20:07Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > So _South Park_ had it right - we as a society have to make a deal, where the police are allowed to brutalize minorities in exchange for doing their jobs, because that’s why they became police in the first place? Sobering stuff, there. :rolleyes: What’s sobering is the lack of parenting and disregard for education. 34 officers died this year alone yet the focus is on a handful of cases that are already going to court. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/176 "2015-12-03T22:25:06Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > yes, BLM has made it’s demands. They’ve shut down markets and intimidated police. And the police have responded with the only thing that makes sense and that’s to stand back and watch it all burn to the ground. How many officers have been shot this year? 34. Nobody marching and shutting down businesses for them. How many were shot in cold blood? Did Ricardo Galvez make the news when a group of 3 walked up to him in his car and started shooting? > > Make no mistake, there is no law on the books that says they need to flush out drug dealers or thieves or any other criminal. They can just as easily drive around listening to tunes for 8 hrs waiting on the next call to fill out paperwork on a corpse. If a 5 year dies in the crossfire it’s just another sheet of paper to fill out. There is no law that says police have to do their actual jobs? They cam just drive around and listen to music for 8 hours instead? I went into the wrong field, clearly. ---
**Author:** ![Kevbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e47774/32.png) [@Kevbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kevbo)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/177 "2015-12-03T22:38:39Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > 34 officers died this year alone yet the focus is on a handful of cases that are already going to court. In how many of those 34 cases is the identity and whereabouts of the person who pulled the trigger known, yet no charges have been filed? When a man (black or white) shoots a cop, he gets shot, life in prison, or a death sentence. When a cop shoots a black man, he gets a paid vacation. Yet somehow you translate this into a lack of concern of slain police officers. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [December 3, 2015, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/178 "2015-12-03T23:09:51Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Wow. Really, just wow. So you’re saying you really don’t understand the difference between attacking nuclear families and objecting to a **requirement** that families have to be nuclear? Do you also not understand, for example, the difference between attacking churchgoers and attacking the presumption that good people **have** to be churchgoers? Because that’s the level of cluelessness you’re projecting here. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/179 "2015-12-04T13:53:33Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > :rolleyes: What’s sobering is the lack of parenting and disregard for education. > > 34 officers died this year alone yet the focus is on a handful of cases that are already going to court. People who murder police officers are prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Some states, like [New York](http://ypdcrime.com/penal.law/article125.htm), even have separate statutes for the crime of killing a police officer. Police officers who murder people, on the other hand? It’s a mixed bag. Sometimes they’re prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, sometimes the DA takes a dive due to the inherent conflict of interest in prosecuting people her or she relies on to do their job, sometimes charges are never filed. When they are, juries are reluctant to actually convict, possibly related to the DA conflict, possibly because they value police officers more than black people. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278/180 "2015-12-04T15:01:55Z")
Or possibly because their guilt has not been proven beyond a reasonable doubt, under the same standard applied when someone murders a police officer. Regards, Shodan [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-actions-of-blm-wise-or-foolish/738278.md?page=10)