# Are the muppets the reason names like Kermit and Grover have become archaic? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 12, 2026, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219 "2026-04-12T15:40:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/121 "2026-05-01T00:10:56Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > I wouldn’t say it’s common, but it’s not unusual. Sometimes it’s short for Terrance and sometimes it’s short for Salvatore. So instead of “Terry” you can call a guy “Sally”? I can imagine what he would have gone through by the time he finished school. 🤭 ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/122 "2026-05-01T00:16:34Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Has “Terry” ever been that common a name? Yes, but it peaked in popularity in 1957. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/123 "2026-05-01T00:23:33Z")
I was born in 1955, so other post-WWII mothers must have liked the comic strip too. My older brother, who was a rabid Germanophile, once told me that if he ever had a son, he’d want to name him “Gniesenau.” I shudder to think of all the teasing that kid would have been subjected to at school: _“Hey, Knees-now! How are your knees now?”_🤣 ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/124 "2026-05-01T00:28:14Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Has “Terry” ever been that common a name? It’s 33% of Monty Python, and also cross-Atlantic. It’s a good name for a young boy comic book character because eventually you have to stop using Johnny or Tommy all the time. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/125 "2026-05-01T00:32:11Z")
> [@Shakester](#): > > I knew an Ebenezer back in the 80s. He’d have been born around 1970. I read somewhere that the name “Ebenezer” was invented by Charles Dickens specifically for the character of Scrooge in _ **A Christmas Carol** _. I guess it just sounded … appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/126 "2026-05-01T00:37:34Z")
OTOH, apropos of the OP, I’ve never met a Herry. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/127 "2026-05-01T00:38:07Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > > [@Shakester](#): > > > > I knew an Ebenezer back in the 80s. He’d have been born around 1970. > > I read somewhere that the name “Ebenezer” was invented by Charles Dickens specifically for the character of Scrooge in _ **A Christmas Carol** _. Nah, it’s a Hebrew name. > **[Hello, My Name Is: EBENEZER](https://bam.sites.uiowa.edu/hello/ebenezer)** > > The name Ebenezer is actually a blend of two Hebrew words: אבן (ʾeben, pronounced EH-ven), meaning "stone," and עזר (ʿezer, pronounced EH-zer), meaning "to help." Thus, the name Ebenezer literally means "stone of help." The name is explained in 1... > [@](#): > > The name is explained in 1 Samuel 7:12: “Then Samuel took a stone and set it up between Mizpah and Jeshanah, and named it Ebenezer; for he said, ‘Thus far the LORD has helped us’.” However, the name became famous in the English speaking world when Charles Dickens named the protagonist of his 1843 classic, A Christmas Carol, Ebenezer Scrooge. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/128 "2026-05-01T00:40:19Z")
Yeah, “Terry” does suit two of the Pythons. I also think it sounds cool when spoken with a British accent, which makes me feel a little better. (And yes, I do know that Terry Gilliam is from the US.) I wonder if their given names were “Terry,” though. Or were they diminutives? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/129 "2026-05-01T00:42:02Z")
Yeah, I suspected it went back farther than 1843. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/130 "2026-05-01T00:44:31Z")
> [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](#): > > OTOH, apropos of the OP, I’ve never met a Herry. That would be a diminutive of … what? 🤨 ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/131 "2026-05-01T00:57:50Z")
No idea, but [he apparently has a sister named Herriet](https://muppet.fandom.com/wiki/Herry%27s_family). ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/132 "2026-05-01T01:03:04Z")
Well, hit me on the side of the head and call me stupid! It’s clearly been too long since I’ve watched the Muppets! 😖 ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/133 "2026-05-01T05:17:40Z")
I looked up “Hilary” in the Social Security Baby Name database. It first shows up in 1949 as the 966th most popular girl’s name. It gradually climbed to 234th most popular in 1992. In 1993 it dropped to 647th, and since then it hasn’t shown up in the top 1,000. The alternative spelling “Hillary” first shows up in 1963 as the 862nd most popular girl’s name. It hit a peak at 132nd most popular in 1992, and then started to fall. It hit a low at 983rd in 2006, then climbed to 772nd in 2008. Since then it hasn’t been in the top 1,000. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/134 "2026-05-01T05:24:33Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > I wonder if their given names were “Terry,” though. Or were they diminutives? Terry Jones was a Terence. Terry Gilliam is a Terrence. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/135 "2026-05-01T05:27:23Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Terry Jones was a Terence. Terry Gilliam is a Terrence. So there are three different spellings: Terence, Terrence, and Terrance. You learn something new every day… ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2026, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/136 "2026-05-01T09:14:06Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > > [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](#): > > > > OTOH, apropos of the OP, I’ve never met a Herry. > > That would be a diminutive of … what? 🤨 Is it the same as Harry (= Henry)? ---
**Author:** ![Kron](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kron/32/12444_2.png) [@Kron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kron)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2026, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/137 "2026-05-04T14:30:50Z")
> [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > The alternative spelling “Hillary” first shows up in 1963 as the 862nd most popular girl’s name. It hit a peak at 132nd most popular in 1992, and then started to fall. By my reckoning, Hillary hit the peak in 1953. Thanks, I’ll be here all week. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2026, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/138 "2026-07-22T23:31:00Z")
> [@digs](#): > > Older man, and such an academic that I wondered “If I say _‘Like Kermeet thee Froggg?’_ in Kermit’s voice, would it be a tired joke, or a confusing one?” … because I could imagine him never having watched a kids’ show. _Excuse me, gentlemen; it’s time for Beanie._ — A. Einstein [quote=eburacum45, post:37, topic:1029219"]In some locations it was the usual practice to name the firstborn son after the mother’s family. [/quote] That explains my big brother Kranzke… ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2026, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/139 "2026-07-22T23:42:43Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > Orleans which is French, making him Kermit the Frog. Does not compute; the French for frog is grenouille. Crapaud for toad. The House of Orleans was named for the Roman Governor Aurelanius. I can’t find any reference at all to frogs connected to it. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2026, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219/140 "2026-07-23T00:03:59Z")
Just in case this is not a whoosh, you’re looking at the wrong word. The focus is on “French”, not “Orleans”. “Frog” is a mildly pejorative English word for French people. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-the-muppets-the-reason-names-like-kermit-and-grover-have-become-archaic/1029219.md?page=8)