# Are there any examples of professional boxers getting into fights with regular people? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [January 25, 2011, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929 "2011-01-25T16:14:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/61 "2011-01-26T16:58:07Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I’ll take the trained fighter every time. Even a sucker punch isn’t going to affect them that much, and they have conditioned reflexes that would let them sense it coming anyway. Don’t be so sure it could even get landed. Ever been sucker punched? I used to fight full contact Karate, and in that environment I was pretty good, and a punch to the head didn’t bother me all that much. You’re mentally prepared, you expect to get hit, and you’ve practiced sparring enough that it doesn’t surprise you. I’ve also been sucker punched in a bar. Totally different thing. The main problem is that you just can’t sort out what just happened. Does not compute. At least not for a second or two. You don’t know if you were punched, or if something hit you, or if the damn bar exploded. All you know is that your bell just got rung. It takes a second to sort out what just happened. And by then, if the other guy is mean enough, it’ll probably be too late, because the guy who sucker punched you had the initiative and therefore already knew how he was going to follow up. He won’t sucker punch you and then stand back and wait for you to recover - he’ll sucker punch you as the first step towards pushing you over the table you’re standing beside, or slamming your head into the bar. ---
**Author:** ![Spit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/76d3ee/32.png) [@Spit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spit)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/62 "2011-01-26T17:23:20Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > What kind of bars are you hanging out in, that people are attacking strangers from behind for no reason? A bar in Guam that catered to naval guys. Someone else sitting at the bar was talking with a woman, who was apparently the girlfriend of one of the Navy guys. Three of them walked in, dragged the guy off his stool, threw him in the floor and commenced to beating the crap out of him before any of the rest of us could react. By the time the melee of people trying to pull them off cleared, the victim was unconcious with something that resembled a face. I had a minor scuffle during the clear-out when someone made comments about my kilt. A few bruises. My local bar. One of the regulars apparently owed someone some money- Or at least that was what the guy who broke the beer bottle over his head was yelling when he ran out of the door. Slippery little guy. Some dive in Amarillo, TX, and I was the cause. I learned that Cowboys are not romantic figures riding range- Many are ex-criminals and other assorted gems of society. I also learned that you should never cheer your beloved Washington Redskins when they make a miracle comeback in the last 4 minutes of the game on Monday Night Football against the Dallas Cowboys when you are drinking in a dive bar in Amarillo, TX filled with ex-criminals and other gems of society. That one hurt. The best part was after the bartender loudly announced he was calling the cops, and everyone beat on each other to get out of the door. I was running across the parking lot to my car, when I hear the guy who originally hit me yell, "Hey Buddy! No hard feelin’s a’ight?. Various other bars around the country. I travel a lot for work, and I have found that the local dive bar is usually a neat way to meet the locals. People drink, stuff happens. I certainly don’t seek out trouble, and I am a firm believer in turning the other cheek. ---
**Author:** ![Spit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/76d3ee/32.png) [@Spit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spit)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/63 "2011-01-26T17:25:13Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I’ve also been sucker punched in a bar. Totally different thing. The main problem is that you just can’t sort out what just happened. Does not compute. At least not for a second or two. You don’t know if you were punched, or if something hit you, or if the damn bar exploded. All you know is that your bell just got rung. It takes a second to sort out what just happened. And by then, if the other guy is mean enough, it’ll probably be too late, because the guy who sucker punched you had the initiative and therefore already knew how he was going to follow up. He won’t sucker punch you and then stand back and wait for you to recover - he’ll sucker punch you as the first step towards pushing you over the table you’re standing beside, or slamming your head into the bar. **This** is the perfect description of why the boxer would not immediately be declared the winner. ---
**Author:** ![brocks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7feea3/32.png) [@brocks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brocks)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/64 "2011-01-26T17:29:46Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Has anyone seen the show called “Bully Beatdown?” I hadn’t before a few minutes ago, so thanks for the tip. I watched a full episode where a gym rat went against an MMA fighter, and was destroyed, but I’m not sure it resolved this question. For one thing, the MMA fighter was actually taller and heavier than the gym rat. For another, he didn’t throw a single punch. The first round he beat him with grappling, and the second round he beat him with kicks. But it was very entertaining, and I’ll look for it on TV from now on. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/65 "2011-01-26T17:35:12Z")
> [@Spit](#): > > A bar in Guam that catered to naval guys. Someone else sitting at the bar was talking with a woman, who was apparently the girlfriend of one of the Navy guys. Three of them walked in, dragged the guy off his stool, threw him in the floor and commenced to beating the crap out of him before any of the rest of us could react. By the time the melee of people trying to pull them off cleared, the victim was unconcious with something that resembled a face. I had a minor scuffle during the clear-out when someone made comments about my kilt. A few bruises. > > My local bar. One of the regulars apparently owed someone some money- Or at least that was what the guy who broke the beer bottle over his head was yelling when he ran out of the door. Slippery little guy. > > Some dive in Amarillo, TX, and I was the cause. I learned that Cowboys are not romantic figures riding range- Many are ex-criminals and other assorted gems of society. I also learned that you should never cheer your beloved Washington Redskins when they make a miracle comeback in the last 4 minutes of the game on Monday Night Football against the Dallas Cowboys when you are drinking in a dive bar in Amarillo, TX filled with ex-criminals and other gems of society. > > That one hurt. The best part was after the bartender loudly announced he was calling the cops, and everyone beat on each other to get out of the door. I was running across the parking lot to my car, when I hear the guy who originally hit me yell, "Hey Buddy! No hard feelin’s a’ight?. > > Various other bars around the country. I travel a lot for work, and I have found that the local dive bar is usually a neat way to meet the locals. People drink, stuff happens. I certainly don’t seek out trouble, and I am a firm believer in turning the other cheek. I’m thinking of the little wiry guy from _Trainspotting_… Some guys are just irrationally inclined to pick a fight and have a vicious disregard for the other person’s injuries once started. Someone who took a women’s self defence class mentioned that the teacher’s first lesson was - most people, especially women, are too unwilling to inflict real harm on their opponent. This just gives the other person a serious edge. My bet is that a pro fighter does not pull their punches, but yes, the ability to survive a surprise attack and come up fighting isprobably the key to winning. However, how may people in a bar are totaly unaware of the possibility that they may be attacked? I guess it depends on the ambiance of the bar. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/66 "2011-01-26T17:38:43Z")
> [@Spit](#): > > I also learned that you should never cheer your beloved Washington Redskins when they make a miracle comeback in the last 4 minutes of the game on Monday Night Football against the Dallas Cowboys when you are drinking in a dive bar in Amarillo, TX filled with ex-criminals and other gems of society. Well, that doesn’t sound like an out-of-the-blue situation. Surely you don’t mean that you gave _one_ cheer for the Redskins, having _no_ idea it might piss anybody off, and were _instantly_ sucker-punched for it? ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/67 "2011-01-26T17:41:18Z")
> [@brocks](#): > > I’m well aware of them. The topic is boxer vs. regular guy, not all-time greats against regular guy. > > But thanks for the snark. Yet the OP was talking about Mayweather and Pacquio against a regular guy. Maybe they are just journeymen boxers, I wouldnt really be sure. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/68 "2011-01-26T17:42:09Z")
[Boxer Killed Trying To Calm NYC Bar Fight](http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxingforum/19553-boxer-killed-trying-calm-nyc-bar-fight.html) - > [@](#): > > NEW YORK – Kemal Kolenovic was a boxer with five knockouts to his name, but he wasn’t looking for a fight when he was killed outside a Bronx bar, police and witnesses said. Instead, he was run over after trying to break one up, police and witnesses said. [SNIP] But then one of the men involved in the quarrel got into a sport-utility vehicle and drove it onto the sidewalk, hitting Kolenovic, witnesses and police said. [Cook gets life back after fatal bar fight](http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=2842293) - > [@](#): > > LAPORTE, Ind. – A former Golden Gloves champion who killed a man in a bar fight six years ago will make his professional boxing debut Friday night. [SNIP] Cook got into a fight with Stephen Lake outside a LaPorte bar on May 20, 2001, and one good punch snapped Lake’s neck, said attorney Kim DeWitt, who prosecuted the case. Like I said in an earlier post this could go either way in every case for lack of any sense of ground rules for the purpose of the question. If the boxer is hit by a car in the fight, he probably won’t win. If he lands a punch to the head of his opponent, the opponent probably will not walk away under his own power. If we assume a fair start which is not likely the case in a bar brawl the boxer has the indisputable advantage over the amateur no matter how big, strong, or downright mean the amateur might be. If either one gets sucker punched and then clobbered with a chair or bottle to the head that will probably be the beginning and end of the fight. If weapons, chairs, broken bottles, etc. are involved it pretty much comes down to who hits first and/or who sees it coming. We also have to remember outside of the ring the boxer doesn’t have to fight fair either. He is perfectly free to use a weapon, gouge eyes with his thumbs, or initiate the fight himself with a sucker punch or bar stool over the head. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/69 "2011-01-26T17:45:59Z")
Thanks for that. We were all wondering if a trained boxer could survive being hit by a truck. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/70 "2011-01-26T17:47:47Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > Thanks for that. We were all wondering if a trained boxer could survive being hit by a truck. You’re welcome. The point is that ‘bar fight’ means anything goes. The vehicle was used as a weapon during a bar fight. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/71 "2011-01-26T18:04:23Z")
I’m pretty sure that hitting someone with a motor vehicle is not what the OP had in mind when asking who would be more likely to win such a fight. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/72 "2011-01-26T18:15:01Z")
> [@acsenray](#): > > I’m pretty sure that hitting someone with a motor vehicle is not what the OP had in mind when asking who would be more likely to win such a fight. Your contributions to this thread so far are below. None of them have had any bearing on the OP or the conversation that has developed since, as they often do. My contributions to this thread have been relevant including some of the only actual cites of known professional boxers winning or losing bar fights. If you can manage to get past the idea of it being a vehicle, and imagine it being a heavy oak chair, or a cinder block picked up off the ground, and do your best to understand that I am illustrating that there is no way to predict who would win if large heavy objects and sucker punching are allowed in the question, then you might be able to attain some comprehension of the relevance of my post. But either way thank you for trying to set me straight by adding a totally irrelevant post to the others before it. > [@acsenray](#): > > If _Raging Bull_ is faithful to the truth, then boxer Jake La Motta often delivered beatings on regular people, including members of his family. > [@acsenray](#): > > I know of at least one situation in which a blow with a bottle to the back of the head in a bar resulted in death. Are there that many people out there willing to risk committing homicide? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/73 "2011-01-26T18:23:26Z")
You might consider my contributions irrelevant, but at least they have so far not been ad hominem. I think it’s pretty clear that the OP is not asking whether a professional boxer would prevail in a fight against someone who’s willing to run him over in a truck. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/74 "2011-01-26T18:27:53Z")
**acsenray** , it is clear that you just don’t get it. Reread my last reply to you in regard to the truck. With respect to the OP and other participants in the thread, I suggest we agree to disagree and let readers decide for themselves which posts are relevant to the OP and the current discussion. These certainly are not. ---
**Author:** ![Spit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/76d3ee/32.png) [@Spit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spit)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/75 "2011-01-26T18:35:45Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > Well, that doesn’t sound like an out-of-the-blue situation. Surely you don’t mean that you gave _one_ cheer for the Redskins, having _no_ idea it might piss anybody off, and were _instantly_ sucker-punched for it? Sorry, I did not clarify- your initial post stated “attacked for no reason”, and I meant to add that there are no bar fights “For no reason”. There is always some ridiculous purpose to the madness that made perfect sense at the time. No, while I was sitting there talking with my coworker in the last quarter of a football game, after traveling all day (with meetings in multiple states) I was not really thinking about how he and I rooting would later get me punched in the face. I can give you the whole scenario if you would like, but I can assure you- there were no antagonizing comments made, or conversation of any kind with the guy that set it all off. I had less than a second of notification. Like I said, it was an important life lesson learned. When I was in an Eagles bar in Philly, I did not make the same mistake twice. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2011, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/76 "2011-01-26T19:34:51Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > My google-fu failed me, but didn’t Jack Dempsey beat the shit out of two muggers when he was in his 70s? That’s what I came here to post–in fact, Dempsey was able to hold them there until the cops arrived. Training obviously has a huge impact on fighting. **I Love Me, Vol. I** is vastly overstating the case, though. Even a skilled boxer will have a hard time keeping a barfight standing up, and that’s been demonstrated many times. ---
**Author:** ![isaiahrobinson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/85e7bf/32.png) [@isaiahrobinson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/isaiahrobinson)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/77 "2011-01-27T00:28:58Z")
> [@StusBlues](#): > > That’s what I came here to post–in fact, Dempsey was able to hold them there until the cops arrived. Nice. I’ve read that Dempsey got into a lot of bar fights. I’m interested in all the stories about boxers - even the one involving one getting hit by a car! - because for whatever reason it doesn’t seem like there’s a whole lot of evidence of these kind of fights going down. Which does surprise me. If anyone has any more examples I’d still be interested, because without them this is all just academic. When I was imagining the original scenario, I didn’t think of it as a surprise attack or involving weapons. Obviously if a big guy smashes Mayweather in the back of the head with a beer bottle for no reason all the training in the world isn’t going to prepare him for that! We imagined two guys squaring up face-to-face in a bar, in a very confined space, ie. with no real room to move their feet. The big guy knows he’s a pro boxer and tries to fight accordingly, and neither of them is drunk (or both of them are equally drunk, whichever you prefer). And bear in mind the big guy has a truly overwhelming size advantage - 70lbs heavier, arms twice as long, more than a head taller, muscles twice the size, etc. But he’s still athletic, in good shape and likes a fight. So I guess the question is: would the pro boxers’ close-range snap punches cripple him, or would he get wrapped up by the bear arms, taken to the ground and beaten on before he could do any real damage? I wish Ricky Hatton had taken on one of those pub challengers, maybe we could have an answer. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Susanann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ab992/32.png) [@Susanann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Susanann)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/78 "2011-01-27T01:09:01Z")
> [@wheresgeorge04](#): > > I can’t imagine a “civilian” taking a few Pacquiao body shots in a second or two and not keeling over. I would have put my money on Muhammad Ali against anyone in any fight. ---
**Author:** ![Miltonyz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Miltonyz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miltonyz)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/79 "2011-01-27T01:26:02Z")
> [@](#): > > Not too long ago a UFC fighter was filmed in a street fight, IIRC. This guy was beating on a girl and the UFC fighter came to the girls aid. It was a few months ago, so my memory might be fuzzy. > > There’s also the ‘story’ of Van Damme being laid out by the former hell’s angel guy. Roger Huerta. He fights in the 155 pound division for Bellator now. Supposedly the man he stomped was significantly bigger then him but not sure how much larger. ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2011, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929/80 "2011-01-27T01:42:21Z")
> [@brocks](#): > > I’m well aware of them. The topic is boxer vs. regular guy, not all-time greats against regular guy. > > But thanks for the snark. My pleasure 😃 Especially considering you were prattling on about people moving up or down 5 pounds when Leonard fought in what? FIVE different weight classes? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-examples-of-professional-boxers-getting-into-fights-with-regular-people/568929.md?page=5)