# Are there any figures once thought to be mythical, whose historicity was later proved? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 30, 2015, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382 "2015-01-30T23:31:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 8:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/61 "2015-02-03T08:16:48Z")
Pontius Pilate had no evidence outside the Bible corroborating his existence, until 1961 when [this stone](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilate_Stone) was found. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/62 "2015-02-03T08:52:27Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#): > > Pontius Pilate had no evidence outside the Bible corroborating his existence, until 1961 when [this stone](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilate_Stone) was found. Pilate is mentioned by Tacitus, by Josephus and by Philo of Alexandria, all writing in the first century, and by Eusebius, in the third century. Many of their references to him do not relate to anything in the scriptural accounts - e.g. Philo tells of Pilate erecting imperial symbols in Herod’s palace, of the Jewish authorities complaining to Rome about this, and of Pilate being disciplined by the Emperor Tiberius. The Pilate Stone was the first _physical_ evidence for Pilate, but there was certainly extra-scriptural evidence for him right back to the first century, and of course the office which he was said to have filled certainly existed. I don’t think he was ever regarded as mythical. ---
**Author:** ![eburacum45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eburacum45/32/8690_2.png) [@eburacum45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eburacum45)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/63 "2015-02-03T09:23:28Z")
There is an ancient stone in Cornwall, with inscriptions tentatively dated to the 6th century, that gives some support to the existence of Tristan [http://www.kingarthursknights.com/structures/tristanstone.asp](http://www.kingarthursknights.com/structures/tristanstone.asp) according to 16th c antiquarian John Leland, it also mentioned Iselde at time. > **[Tristan and Iseult](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tristan_and_Iseult#The_Tristan_Stone)** > > Tristan and Iseult, also known as Tristan and Isolde and other names, is a medieval chivalric romance told in numerous variations since the 12th century. Based on a Celtic legend and possibly other sources, the tale is a tragedy about the illicit love between the Cornish knight Tristan and the Irish princess Iseult. It depicts Tristan's mission to escort Iseult from Ireland to marry his uncle, King Mark of Cornwall. On the journey, Tristan and Iseult ingest a love potion, instigating a forbidd Th... Of course this may simply mean that these names were familiar or common at that time. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/64 "2015-02-03T10:32:40Z")
I think the highland gorilla was once considered a myth. A story brought back by early African explorers. Later some live ones were captured and brought back. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/65 "2015-02-03T16:18:41Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > The Bible makes no such claim. It expressly states that they built the garrison cities of Pithom and Ramses. Which were infact built around the time that the Hebrews are supposed to have been in Egypt. You’re right. I keep using pyramids as a shorthand because that’s the cultural myth we’re trying to overturn, but I should note that I’m using it in that sense. The myth is pervasive and very old. It comes from Josephus. The [Answers in Genesis crowd](https://answersingenesis.org/archaeology/ancient-egypt/the-pyramids-of-ancient-egypt/) use their imaginary chronology to redo time to have the Israelites build some of the later mud-brick pyramids. Menachem Begin of all people went to Egypt in 1977 and said “We built the pyramids” for I guess political reasons. The point remains that absolutely none of it is true. Cosmopolitan Egypt certainly must have seen some visitors who were what we would today consider to be Jews but not a word of the Exodus story has any backup at all. Many people desperately want the events depicted in the Old and New Testament to be true so they jump on the most tenuous connections and turn them into bricks and mortar and construct edifices on top of nothingness. Unless some radical new evidence appears, however, it’s all myth from start to end. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/66 "2015-02-03T16:24:47Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Still skeptical, because the people who brought us the word “elephant” and who regularly butchered animals were unlikely to be severly confused by a mammoth skull. You seem to be assuming that (1) mammoth skulls are found in a state of perfect preservation, and (2) that the Greeks regularly butchered elephants. Neither is likely to be true. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/67 "2015-02-03T18:39:29Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > The point remains that absolutely none of it is true. Cosmopolitan Egypt certainly must have seen some visitors who were what we would today consider to be Jews but not a word of the Exodus story has any backup at all. Many people desperately want the events depicted in the Old and New Testament to be true so they jump on the most tenuous connections and turn them into bricks and mortar and construct edifices on top of nothingness. Unless some radical new evidence appears, however, it’s all myth from start to end. That is also not true. There are lot of things in Exodus which are in consonance with history. The Egyptians did in fact use foreign slaves, including from the Canaan, which they ruled for hundreds of years. They did take sons of foreign princes as [del]hostages[/del] honoured guests, and raise them Egyptian ways. They did have foreigners rise high in Egyptian society, Ramses’s dynasty is now thought to have been of foreign origin. The Egyptians also had no problem in erasing the records of now disliked Pharaohs or military setbacks. Its in short like Troy. Probably accurate in its general strokes and more so than expected. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/68 "2015-02-03T19:22:49Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > You seem to be assuming that (1) mammoth skulls are found in a state of perfect preservation, and (2) that the Greeks regularly butchered elephants. Neither is likely to be true. For (2), no; I’m just assuming that a large and oddly-placed nose hole (the technical term) would be recognized by people who regularly butchered swine and cattle and who also traded in ivory. The point about imperfect preservation, on the other hand, gives me more pause. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/69 "2015-02-03T20:49:20Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > That is also not true. There are lot of things in Exodus which are in consonance with history. The Egyptians did in fact use foreign slaves, including from the Canaan, which they ruled for hundreds of years. They did take sons of foreign princes as [del]hostages[/del] honoured guests, and raise them Egyptian ways. They did have foreigners rise high in Egyptian society, Ramses’s dynasty is now thought to have been of foreign origin. The Egyptians also had no problem in erasing the records of now disliked Pharaohs or military setbacks. > > Its in short like Troy. Probably accurate in its general strokes and more so than expected. I agree there’s a kernel of truth in those legends, no doubt. However, the numbers and dates are past any possible credulity. No way the Exodus involved 600000 adult males (meaning around 2MM total). Not even a tenth of that. ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a8b319/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_wuzzy)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/70 "2015-02-03T22:15:56Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Not a hunchback at all. > > [http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2643056/Richard-III-wasnt-hunchback-did-scoliosis-scans-reveal.html](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2643056/Richard-III-wasnt-hunchback-did-scoliosis-scans-reveal.html) > \*Richard III may be the most famous hunchback in history but it appears his deformity was mightily exaggerated by Shakespeare. > Scans of his skeleton show he only had a slight deformity that would have barely affected his appearance or prowess on the field of battle, say scientists. > The notorious description by Shakespeare of a ‘hunchback toad’, a Machiavellian villain suffering a twisted body, a limp and withered arm, was almost certainly an attempt to blacken his reputation, claim experts. > \* It’s kinda cheating(im not saying you are) to “defend” Richard III by pointing out flaws in Shakespeare’s play. Far too many of Richard’s apologists point out the flaws in the Play. The play is meant as fiction, a fiction with some historical merit but fiction nonetheless. From what I remember Richard was not called a hunchback by his peers, or those who talked to his peers years afterwards. More for instance described him as a crooke back. ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/71 "2015-02-03T22:37:45Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > That’s I think the full weight of historical support for a leader who might be Arthur. But Historia Brittonum is a book written 300 years later, based on almost no written histories or decent evidence and which thus probably was telling the best known oral legends that still existed from that time–perhaps a grain of truth was in them (hey, there was a grain of truth to the Iliad.) So little is verifiable in all of this that it should be noted there is no evidence at all the battle itself ever happened, let alone that a great warrior named Arthur was the leader of the Britons. So a bit like Jesus then? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2015, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382/72 "2015-02-03T23:54:34Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > That is also not true. There are lot of things in Exodus which are in consonance with history. The Egyptians did in fact use foreign slaves, including from the Canaan, which they ruled for hundreds of years. They did take sons of foreign princes as [del]hostages[/del] honoured guests, and raise them Egyptian ways. They did have foreigners rise high in Egyptian society, Ramses’s dynasty is now thought to have been of foreign origin. The Egyptians also had no problem in erasing the records of now disliked Pharaohs or military setbacks. > > Its in short like Troy. Probably accurate in its general strokes and more so than expected. The legends about King Arthur are in consonance with history. That’s hardly surprising. People living in a part of the world are probably familiar with the general tenor of its history and culture. What’s needed for history is evidence and details and specifics. Of which there are none for this subject. Literally none. [Slavery in ancient Egypt](http://www.reshafim.org.il/ad/egypt/timelines/topics/slavery.htm) gives a fascinating account of the many forms and complexities of slavery in the country. And talk about antiquity! > [@](#): > > For best results save the whole web page (pictures included) onto your hard disk, open the page with Word 97 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-figures-once-thought-to-be-mythical-whose-historicity-was-later-proved/711382.md?page=3)