# Are there any "reverse" super heroes?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [November 29, 2007, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213 "2007-11-29T19:43:01Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/1 "2007-11-29T19:43:01Z")
That is, are there any comic books where the protagonist is a guy with Superman’s powers (or Spiderman or Batman), but he’s evil?
Maybe each episode, a new “good” guy comes along to try to stop him, but the good guy is always foiled?
I’d imagine this guy is always raping women, and making famous chefs cook really good food for him, and doing really good drugs. Maybe he lives in a different guy’s house each week, and the cops are like “what can we do?”
I don’t think Bizarro is quite what I’m looking for but I don’t know enough about him.
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### Author:  [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/2 "2007-11-29T20:00:21Z")
“Saviour” by Mark Millar, Trident Comics, 1989-90. The antichrist impersonates a flashy British superhero.
Lots of villains have carried a comic book, including Dr. Doom, Joker, Luthor, Kobra, Bomb Queen, Yellow Claw and Dracula.
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### Author:  [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/3 "2007-11-29T20:24:48Z")
[Evil Ernie](http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/e/evilern.htm).
[Wikipedia on Evil Ernie](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_Ernie).
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### Author:  [@xnylder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xnylder)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/4 "2007-11-29T20:28:03Z")
Just to get this out of the way: [List of anti-heroes from comic books.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fictional_anti-heroes#Comic_books)
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### Author:  [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/5 "2007-11-29T20:33:13Z")
[QUOTE=Trunk]
That is, are there any comic books where the protagonist is a guy with Superman’s powers (or Spiderman or Batman), but he’s evil?
Maybe each episode, a new “good” guy comes along to try to stop him, but the good guy is always foiled?
[/QUOTE]
Some might call The Punisher evil, a point of view that you may or may not agree with. And it doesn’t happen every issue, but he frequently outsmarts cops and superheroes that come to arrest him.
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### Author:  [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/6 "2007-11-29T20:49:27Z")
In Green Lantern, Guy Gardner was pretty much a jerk. Not evil, but his style of Lanterning was not very nice. Some people liked him, some didn’t. Some of the other GLs in the universe were are a bit harsh.
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### Author:  [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/7 "2007-11-29T20:57:07Z")
In addition to Krokodil’s list, Eclipso, Catwoman and Harley Quinn have had their own series, and Mephisto had a four-issue limited series. In the 70’s, Marvel published a comic book called “Super-Villain Team-Up” and DC a comic called “Secret Society of Super-Villains,” both of which were pretty similar to the premise in your original post.
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### Author:  [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/8 "2007-11-29T21:05:39Z")
[Lobo](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lobo_(DC_Comics)).
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### Author:  [@Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hey_It_s_That_Guy)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/9 "2007-11-29T21:12:01Z")
There was a miniseries called Wanted, about a world where the villains killed all the heroes and took over. The protagonist was a nebbishy guy named Wesley who became an completely amoral assassin known as The Killer. A movie is due out early next year, but apparently it changed a lot from the comic.
Thunderbolts was originally about a team of villains masquerading as heroes, but some of them started to like it and became actual heroes as time went on. The current Thunderbolts are mostly villains (and brutal, evil ones at that), but they work for the government pursuing “rogue” heroes who refused to register and reveal their secret identities. (That’s a major issue pervading the entire Marvel Universe right now.) Of course, mayhem ensues, and a lot of small-time heroes made up for the stories end up maimed or dead.
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### Author:  [@Don\_Draper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_Draper)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/10 "2007-11-29T21:16:59Z")
Interestingly enough, Jerry Siegel & Joe Schuster originally conceived Superman as a villain, one with a bald head who had more than a passing resemblance to Lex Luthor (who would not be on the scene for another few years). There was a ‘regular Joe’ type hero who would be his recurring adversary and constantly thwart the fiendish plans of the Superman to conquer the world.
No cite handy, but it’s pretty well documented.
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### Author:  [@ArizonaTeach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArizonaTeach)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/11 "2007-11-29T21:57:13Z")
Mark Waid and Barry Kitson’s [Empire](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire_%28comics%29). In a nutshell, it’s the world situation after Doctor Doom wins.
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### Author:  [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/12 "2007-11-29T21:57:26Z")
[**Empire**](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire_%28comics%29) was a 6-issue miniseries which depicted an Earth ruled by the supervillain Golgoth (a Dr. Doom-analogue) and his minions of darkness. However, I maintain that the true villain was the writer, Mark Waid, who kept me waiting for four goddamn years only to deliver the sorriest series wrapup ever.
[**The Authority**](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Authority) is one of several teams in DC’s WildStorm universe who have been known to viciously torture and murder their opponents on occasion. WildStorm was founded during the height of the Spawn-driven “Grit Age” of the early '90s, so it has often taken pains to denounce classically superheroic themes of “Good vs. Evil” in favor of “unpleasant characters doing horrible things to other unpleasant characters.”
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### Author:  [@Lucky\_13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucky_13)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/13 "2007-11-29T22:42:14Z")
Somewhere among my stuff there is a graphic novel called Brat Pack. It concerns four ordinary teenagers drafted as sidekicks to superheroes who aren’t really all that heroic. The moral conscience of the book, IIRC, was the nominal villain, Dr. Blasphemy.
I once briefly dated a guy who owned at least one issue of a manga called “Rapeman.” Yes, the title pretty much describes it. :eek:
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/14 "2007-11-29T23:09:34Z")
[QUOTE=The New and Improved Superman]
Interestingly enough, Jerry Siegel & Joe Schuster originally conceived Superman as a villain, one with a bald head who had more than a passing resemblance to Lex Luthor (who would not be on the scene for another few years). There was a ‘regular Joe’ type hero who would be his recurring adversary and constantly thwart the fiendish plans of the Superman to conquer the world.
No cite handy, but it’s pretty well documented.
[/QUOTE]
That’d be from their _Reign of the Superman_ story, 1933. Aside from the name, it had little resemblance to the later character.
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### Author:  [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/15 "2007-11-29T23:16:18Z")
[QUOTE=Lucky 13]
I once briefly dated a guy who owned at least one issue of a manga called “Rapeman.” Yes, the title pretty much describes it. :eek:
[/QUOTE]
I can see how such a discovery might result in fewer dates with that guy.
Me, I make a point of hiding my copies of “Rapeman” before having guests over. I’m genteel that way.
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### Author:  [@I\_m\_No\_Saint](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_m_No_Saint)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2007, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/16 "2007-11-29T23:42:59Z")
The recently cancelled **Irredeemable Ant-Man** had a thoroughly unlikeable main star.
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### Author:  [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)
#### Post date: [November 30, 2007, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/17 "2007-11-30T12:59:50Z")
Thanks for some of the ideas.
I’d love to see a bad superhero just fly around mess with stuff. . .like drop in on the Superbowl and take all the balls.
“Rapeman” sounds pretty interesting. Maybe I’ll try walking into my local shop and asking for a copy of Rapeman.
I wonder if he pronounces it “Rapp-a-men” like Dr. Spatchemen (Spaceman) on 30 Rock.
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### Author:  [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)
#### Post date: [November 30, 2007, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/18 "2007-11-30T18:12:11Z")
[QUOTE=pravnik]
[Evil Ernie](http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/e/evilern.htm).
[Wikipedia on Evil Ernie](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_Ernie).
[/QUOTE]
I am guessing that [Evil Bert](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evil_Bert) is his sidekick?
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### Author:  [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)
#### Post date: [November 30, 2007, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/19 "2007-11-30T18:27:50Z")
[QUOTE=Lucky 13]
I once briefly dated a guy who owned at least one issue of a manga called “Rapeman.” Yes, the title pretty much describes it. :eek:
[/QUOTE]
I was having difficulty with this concept, so I decided to look it up on Wikipedia.
> [@Wikipedia article](#):
>
> The business’ motto is “Righting wrongs through penetration”.
I know I’m wrong, but that’s funny as hell!
But then I read that there was a successful live-action movie made of the comic? :eek:
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### Author:  [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)
#### Post date: [November 30, 2007, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-reverse-super-heroes/428213/20 "2007-11-30T18:37:21Z")
I recall an old DC comic – I read it as a reprint in the '70s so the original probably was published in the '60s – where the Justice League went up against an alternate version of itself from a parallel Earth where superheroes were unheard of; all superpowered adventurers were criminals. In the story, every JL member had an evil analogue with the same powers.
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