# Are there any social conservatives here? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 21, 2004, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903 "2004-08-21T23:05:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/1 "2004-08-21T23:05:44Z")
Seems like even the most hard-core Republicans here are not conservative on social issues. Are there any social conservatives here? Hold off that reflexive "Define ‘social conservatism’ " post Skippy, I got it right [here](http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Social_conservatism). > [@](#): > > Social conservatism is a belief in traditional morality and social mores and the desire to preserve these in present day society. It is anti-ideological in the sense that social change based on new “ideas” is generally regarded as suspect, while social values based on tradition are generally regarded as tried, tested and true. It is a view commonly associated with conservative religious groups, militarism and nationalism. > [@](#): > > Although there is no set of beliefs and positions inherant in social conservatism, there are many views which are commonly associated with it, including: > > ``` > * Opposed to abortion > * Opposed to euthanasia > * Supportive of capital punishment > * Opposed to same-sex marriage > * Opposed to affirmative action > > ``` ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/2 "2004-08-21T23:14:02Z")
I’m sure there are a few around here who’d fit your profile. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/3 "2004-08-21T23:18:07Z")
I doubt it. Most of them that I recall got themselves banned. The majority of the ‘conservatives’ on this board are fiscally conservative by not socially. Maybe I’ll be proved wrong. For myself, from the OP’s list the only one I’d be ‘socially conservative’ on would be capital punishment. I don’t have strong feelings about it one way or the other, which I’m sure would make me socially conservative on that topic. BTW, what about gun rights? Would that be socially conservative? -XT ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/4 "2004-08-21T23:20:54Z")
I’m sure that there a lot of posters who would fit **part** of the definition. For example, I consider myself to be fairly Conservative, but I am liberal when it comes to social matters. I support a woman’s Right To Choose, Same-Sex marriage, and don’t feel comfortable with most Capital Punishment. But I oppose Affirmative Action. Does it have to be an “all-or-none” definition? ---
**Author:** ![Abbie\_Carmichael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/49beb7/32.png) [@Abbie\_Carmichael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Abbie_Carmichael)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/5 "2004-08-21T23:21:16Z")
- Opposed to abortion - in most cases, yes - Opposed to euthanasia - yes - Supportive of capital punishment - yes - Opposed to same-sex marriage - yes - Opposed to affirmative action - yes So yeah. Guess I am one. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2004, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/6 "2004-08-21T23:37:02Z")
**Revtim,** are submitting any of the social-conservative positions for debate, or are you just taking a poll of the SDMB community? (Polls belong in IMHO.) ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/7 "2004-08-22T00:06:10Z")
- **Opposed** to abortion - **Opposed** to euthanasia - **Supportive** of capital punishment - **Opposed** to same-sex marriage - **_Not_ Opposed** to affirmative action Well…based on that criteria…count me in… ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/8 "2004-08-22T00:21:15Z")
**Abbie Carmichael** and **the raindog** : regarding the abortion, euthanasia, and same-sex marriage issues, are you simply against them personally, or do you believe these things should be against the law and nobody should take part in them? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/9 "2004-08-22T00:39:45Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > **Abbie Carmichael** and **the raindog** : > > regarding the abortion, euthanasia, and same-sex marriage issues, are you simply against them personally, or do you believe these things should be against the law and nobody should take part in them? If I might answer this as well: I personally feel abortion is repugnant, but I also feel that as a male I am not really entitled to an opinion, and I am well aware that my personal opinion might not make good Public Policy. I have mixed feelings on euthanasia, as I feel there is a slippery-slope there. I have absolutely zero problems with same-sex marriages, and if the Government is going to allow special privileges for married couples, they have to allow them for all married couples, regardless of gender. I feel Capital Punishment is not the responsibility of the State, although I have absolutely no problem with administering said punishment myself, if I feel it is warranted. I oppose Affirmative Action, because I feel it does nothing but permanently relegate selected groups to second-class citizenship. I am adamantly opposed to virtually any form of Gun Control, and I feel that taking money from hard-working people to fund some do-gooders new plan to “help” is idiotic, to say the least. I am opposed on general principles to overseas adventure-ism, but I also understand the need for the only remaining Super-power to exert influence where it is needed. I think Bush and company are idiots, but I do not trust the Dems in any way, shape, or form. What can I say? I am large…I contain multitudes! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Abbie\_Carmichael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/49beb7/32.png) [@Abbie\_Carmichael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Abbie_Carmichael)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/10 "2004-08-22T01:13:45Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > **Abbie Carmichael** and **the raindog** : > > regarding the abortion, euthanasia, and same-sex marriage issues, are you simply against them personally, or do you believe these things should be against the law and nobody should take part in them? The latter, of course. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Asbestos_Mango)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/11 "2004-08-22T01:24:37Z")
> [@the raindog](#): > > - **Opposed** to abortion > - **Opposed** to euthanasia > - **Supportive** of capital punishment > - **Opposed** to same-sex marriage > - **_Not_ Opposed** to affirmative action > > Well…based on that criteria…count me in… I’m in this camp as well, so I guess, yeah, I’m a social conservative. One issue I don’t see listed but which I have very strong feelings about is the legalization of marijuana. I’m definitely in favor of it. Does that mean I can’t be a social conservative anymore? ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/12 "2004-08-22T01:49:40Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > **Abbie Carmichael** and **the raindog** : > > regarding the abortion, euthanasia, and same-sex marriage issues, are you simply against them personally, or do you believe these things should be against the law and nobody should take part in them? Well…an excellent question…I would caution you that you have 5 rather weighty issues, and any one of them could be it’s own thread. This thread could be become splintered fairly quickly. Since you have 3 issues rolled into one, I’ll give you a thumbnail answer. Any one of them could be explored in much greater detail. As to **abortion** and **euthanasia** , it seems to me that the state (read:state or feds) has an interest in protecting all of the rights of it’s citizens. From in intellectual POV, it is my opinion that life begins at conception, and that the state has **some** interest in protecting those rights, all the way through the dying process. As to **abortion** specifically, I’ve yet to see a satisfactory explanation of what constitutes the beginning of life. (One that refutes the notion that life begins at conception) Further, there has never been unanimity among intellectuals and the medical/political crowd as to the definition. It doesn’t help that there is a seeming conflict between the legality of abortion, and the charge of murder for those who essentially abort an unborn child, through violence, negligence etc. There is no bright line that delineates the point at which “non-vital tissue matter” becomes a human being (read: citizen) with all of the attendent rights that a citizen enjoys. While a woman has a right to privacy, and a right to choose, if that “non-vital tissue matter” is actually a human being those rights cannot be more compelling than the child’s right to live, and the woman’s rights must be subordinated. That different"rights" may be in conflict is well known, and it is common for the law to recognize that there must sometimes be a hierarchy of rights----that some rights may necessarily “trump’” another right, and in the absence of that conflict the right being “trumped” may still be fully asserted. (in a differnt context) Nonetheless, I believe in **personal responsibility.** Sexual intercourse produces children. If you _choose_ to have sex, and produce a human being in the process, you must accept the responsibility. (that goes for the man too, right? the states are getting better and better at forcing men to pay child support for example) As to **euthanasia** I believe that we all enjoy the right of self determination, and the right to reject medical care,even if results in death. It’s another thing entirely to allow someone else to have that right for me. Not long ago a woman rejected urgent pleas from her doctors for a C-section and she rejected the pleas because the scars may keep her from wearing a bikini. (her unborn child subsequently died) I fear that someone may euthanize a child who is born with birth defects (even severe ones), or wish to euthanize an elderly parent who is infirmed. That’s not to say that a family can’t disconnect a feeding tube, after consulting with their doctors, clergy. But I’m not talking about disconnecting a feeding tube. I’m talking about euthanizing a 3 day old baby with birth defects, or an elderly parent who is a burden. I think the state has a limited, but complelling, interest in defending the rights of those human beings. To be honest, I have not given the thought of **same sex marriage** much thought at all, from a _secular_POV. I’ve heard snippets of some of the arguments about social fabric etc from those who wish to ban them, or form a constitutional amendment to ban them. While I am sympathetic to their arguments, and support them in principle, the basis of my feelings are rooted more in my religious convictions. I have not spent much thought on the ramifications of allowing SSM. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/13 "2004-08-22T03:05:42Z")
Social Conservative (Libertarian) here. I don’t want the government telling me what the heck to do. Period. If you ask me if any specific thing should be legal, I’ll generally say, hell yes. Ask me if I like it… different question entirely. Abortion? Legal. Euthenasia? Legal. Suicide? Legal. Death Penalty? Legal. Same sex marriage? Legal. Not the government’s business to decide on marriages, as long as they’re consenting adults and not abusing each other. Polygamy? Legal. Same damn reason. I get this attitude honestly, from my father, and his father, and his father. Conneticut Yankees, farmers. Kind to those they knew, merciful to those in need, and pissed as hell at the revenue agent. ---
**Author:** ![divemaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/divemaster/32/78_2.png) [@divemaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/divemaster)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/14 "2004-08-22T05:00:17Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > If I might answer this as well: I personally feel abortion is repugnant, but I also feel that as a male I am not really entitled to an opinion… I’ve heard this argument before and don’t buy it. By this logic a woman can have no opinion on homosexual rape, or a non-veteran can have no opinion on the war in Iraq. Personal beliefs do not depend on a shared experience, although such an experience can certainly have great influence. As far as the poll goes: Opposed to abortion? Opposed to euthanasia? Supportive of capital punishment? Opposed to same-sex marriage? Opposed to affirmative action? Yes on all counts. As a matter of personal belief, as well as for legislation. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/15 "2004-08-22T05:02:12Z")
I’m pretty socially conservative. I’m pro-life and anti-euthanasia. I oppose affirmative action and traditional welfare, preferring a more work-based approach. I’m pro-gun rights as well. I do support civil unions, though. And I struggle with the death penalty issue. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/16 "2004-08-22T06:53:30Z")
> [@divemaster](#): > > As far as the poll goes: > > Opposed to abortion? > Opposed to euthanasia? > Supportive of capital punishment? > Opposed to same-sex marriage? > Opposed to affirmative action? > > Yes on all counts. As a matter of personal belief, as well as for legislation. You support capitol punishment, yet oppose euthanasia? How about we reach a compromise on this. Make the penalty for attempting suicide be death. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![PaulFitzroy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/2acd7d/32.png) [@PaulFitzroy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulFitzroy)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/17 "2004-08-22T07:29:16Z")
I oppose Affirmative Action. What if I petitioned for the Indiana Pacers to let me play for them and give me a 2.5 million dollar contract simply because there aren’t enough 5’8" white guys with no basketball skills whatsoever on the team? Sound ridiculous? So does giving someone 20 college admission points because he’s black or Hispanic. I support abortion. There are too many damn babies being borth in this country to begin with. In fact, I even support retroactive abortion. There are thousands of stupid people out there who should be aborted right now. I support gay marriage, although I think it’s ridiculous to be gay-married in a religious service (your religion hates you!) I am a supporter of the death penalty. In fact, I think that the death penalty should be carried out directly by the family of the murderer’s victim. By whatever method they choose, as long as it’s not cruel or unusual. I’m a strong supporter of euthanasia, naturally. Right now the youth in Asia are being opressed by the communist war machine. Power to Asian youth! I believe every man has the right to own as many damn firearms as he pleases, in whatever damn state he pleases, of whatever damn calibre and rate-of-fire he pleases! And, finally, I am a strong supporter of medicinal marijuana. Laughter is, after all, the best medicine, and what better way to induce laughter than to toke up? That said, I’m also a supporter of non-medicinal marijuana. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/18 "2004-08-22T07:46:11Z")
> [@divemaster](#): > > I’ve heard this argument before and don’t buy it. By this logic a woman can have no opinion on homosexual rape, or a non-veteran can have no opinion on the war in Iraq. > > Personal beliefs do not depend on a shared experience, although such an experience can certainly have great influence. > > As far as the poll goes: > > Opposed to abortion? > Opposed to euthanasia? > Supportive of capital punishment? > Opposed to same-sex marriage? > Opposed to affirmative action? > > Yes on all counts. As a matter of personal belief, as well as for legislation. You miss the point. The consequences of a man’s having a say in abortion rights are 100% not his to bear. A man expressing a political opinion–i.e. voting–on abortion rights is the same thing as an Islamist state dictating a woman’s dress. Abortion rights should not be subject to state interference; should not be within the jurisdiction of the government at all. It should be a private decision between a woman and her doctor; no man but the father of the child should have any voice in the matter whatsoever. The alternative, if you want to talk about slippery slopes, is chaining a woman to a hospital bed and dictating the use of her body against her will. ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/19 "2004-08-22T08:24:01Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > You miss the point. The consequences of a man’s having a say in abortion rights are 100% not his to bear. . I assume you supprot the right of a father to disavow the child and therefore be off the hook for child support? I mean, according to your argument, there is only one responsible parent in this, right? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2004, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903/20 "2004-08-22T11:34:51Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Social Conservative (Libertarian) here. I don’t want the government telling me what the heck to do. Period. If you ask me if any specific thing should be legal, I’ll generally say, hell yes. Ask me if I like it… different question entirely. > Abortion? Legal. Euthenasia? Legal. Suicide? Legal. Death Penalty? Legal. Same sex marriage? Legal. Not the government’s business to decide on marriages, as long as they’re consenting adults and not abusing each other. Polygamy? Legal. Same damn reason. > > I get this attitude honestly, from my father, and his father, and his father. Conneticut Yankees, farmers. Kind to those they knew, merciful to those in need, and pissed as hell at the revenue agent. I think that would make you socially liberal, rather than socially conservative. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-any-social-conservatives-here/260903.md?page=2)