# Are There IMMORTALS Among Us? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 8, 2003, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811 "2003-08-08T12:37:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/1 "2003-08-08T12:37:58Z")
In the 18th century, several charlatans claimed to have lived for hundreds of years…these people (like Cagliostro and the Count de St.-Germain) enetertained the nobility of the day with their tales of having been around for the fall of Rome, for example. Later, Heinlen in his novel (“METHUSELA’s CHILDREN”) explored the possibility of extraordinarily long human lives. Bacjk to reality…actuariesknowthat human life is limited…ourcurrent statistics predic that almost zero probablility of anyone living beyond around 120 years…however, is it possible that somebody has a DNA mutation that has destroyed his bodie’s ageing process? Imagine what it would be like to live for 300-500 years…your perspective would be quite different! Of course, any such persons would have to be very careful…as heinlein pointed out, the hatred and envy that others would feel forthem wouldbe terrible! Suppose you were 200 years old…howwould you adjust to the fact that all of your childhood friends are long dead and buried? Now: is there any chance that a human couldlive for such a ong time? Have gerontologists discover anything unusual aboutpeople who live past 100? ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/2 "2003-08-08T12:52:05Z")
There is an old Hebrew tradition that teaches that there are a limited number of Good Men, who live forever by Divine decree, trying to improve Mankind’s lot in this world. I don’t know much about them. ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/3 "2003-08-08T12:58:57Z")
I’d say that 120 is the basic maximum, as you’ve pointed out. I’d find it incredible if someone was 130 or 140. Anything past that though, I seriously doubt would be possible. In addition, 120 year olds aren’t exactly (in my mind) in the best shape, so even if it were possible to somehow make it to 200-what would the quality of life be? ---
**Author:** ![biqu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7feea3/32.png) [@biqu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/biqu)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/4 "2003-08-08T13:11:43Z")
[Here](http://home.earthlink.net/~mrob/pub/math/numbers-11.html#l_p1_1000e36) is the approximate number giving the odds against a person living at least 1000 years. One estimate of the [number of particles in the universe](http://home.earthlink.net/~mrob/pub/math/numbers-9.html#eddington) is even smaller. The [number of people who have ever lived](http://www.prb.org/Content/ContentGroups/PTarticle/0ct-Dec02/How_Many_People_Have_Ever_Lived_on_Earth_.htm) is smaller still. It is extremely unlikely that there has ever been anyone who has lived at least 1000 years, so the existence of an immortal person is pretty much out of the question. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/5 "2003-08-08T13:17:07Z")
Besides, There can be only one! ---
**Author:** ![lawoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/35a633/32.png) [@lawoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawoot)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/6 "2003-08-08T13:18:02Z")
What - you’ve never heard of the [2000 year old man](http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0000032UD/qid=1060349030/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/002-2251728-6012042?v=glance&s=music) ? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![starman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8c91f0/32.png) [@starman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/starman)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/7 "2003-08-08T13:57:25Z")
I believe there is a particular mutant species of Drosphila (the fruit fly) which can live for something like three times a normal lifespan. Don’t know whether a similar mutation would be possible in humans though. It all has to do with telomeres. -Oli ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/8 "2003-08-08T13:59:57Z")
No, of course there are no immortals living among us. I once had this very conversation with Ponce de Leon. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/9 "2003-08-08T14:18:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lost4life \* > \*\*I once had this very conversation with Ponce de Leon. \*\* How were his _knees_ holding up ? ---
**Author:** ![Enola\_Straight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dec6dc/32.png) [@Enola\_Straight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enola_Straight)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/10 "2003-08-08T14:48:14Z")
As someone pointed out, anyone who did as much shit as Keith Richards and still lives must be immortal! ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/11 "2003-08-08T14:52:48Z")
In dog years, I am now … let’s see… 164. (Or 217; it depends how you calculate dog years.) ---
**Author:** ![RedNaxela](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ad7895/32.png) [@RedNaxela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedNaxela)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/12 "2003-08-08T15:05:42Z")
**Bosda** , I’m not familiar with a tradition such as you mention; if you could provide a cite, I’d greatly appreciate it (always looking to expand my knowledge). There are a couple of similar ideas in Jewish literature; is it possible that you’re thinking of one of them?[list=1][li]There are at least 36 “hidden” righteous people (who appear outwardly as simple people) in every generation, and it’s in their merit that the universe continues to exist. (However, there’s no indication that these are the same 36 from one generation to the next, just that before one of them dies there’s someone else available to take his or her place.)[/li]There are a select few (different versions of this tradition list, IIRC, between seven and eleven) who didn’t die but rather entered Paradise alive. AFAIK, the only one of these who is said to return to earth on occasion - and therefore could be considered “an immortal among us” - is the prophet Elijah.[/list=1] ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/13 "2003-08-08T15:07:32Z")
Sure. In fact, I’ll be celebrating my… Uh, never mind. ---
**Author:** ![av8rmike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@av8rmike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/av8rmike)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/14 "2003-08-08T15:17:42Z")
Aren’t you forgetting Dick Clark? I’m also not familiar with the tradition **Bosda** mentions, but it sounds suspiciously like the conspiracy-nutjob drivel about the world being run by Zionist elders. ---
**Author:** ![Crispy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@Crispy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crispy)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/15 "2003-08-08T15:30:03Z")
**RedNaxela** , Are those 36 from each generation connected in any way to the belief in some religions that there will be only 144,000 righteous who truly live with God in the afterlife? Just curious. [/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![photopat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e95f7d/32.png) [@photopat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/photopat)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/16 "2003-08-08T15:59:07Z")
Of course, if there were immortals how would the rest of us know? I mean, they would probably be good at keeping their status hidden, right? Heck I remember talking to Ben Franklin and he said… ummm… nuts. ---
**Author:** ![WeRSauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f19dbf/32.png) [@WeRSauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WeRSauron)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/17 "2003-08-08T16:25:56Z")
According to Muslim tradition (at least South Asian Muslim tradition), Hazrat Khizr (a saint of some sort) is immortal and often visits people. We were taught to be kind to all people in case some stranger we met was actually Hazrat Khizr. According to Latter-day Saint tradition, there are four immortal people: John the Divine, according to section 7 of _Doctrine and Covenants_, which can be found at [http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/7;](http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/7;) and the Three Nephites, who are unnamed (“Nephites” means a descendant of Nephi who was a member of a family that came to the American continent on the order of God). The Three Nephites’ immortality is according to chapter 28 of 3 Nephi, which can be found at [http://scriptures.lds.org/3\_ne/28](http://scriptures.lds.org/3_ne/28). WRS ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/18 "2003-08-08T16:31:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Crispy \* > \*\ ***RedNaxela** , > Are those 36 from each generation connected in any way to the belief in some religions that there will be only 144,000 righteous who truly live with God in the afterlife? > Just curious. > > [/hijack] \*\* I am not privy to the interior mental processes of particular religious… well, the word I started to put was “nutjobs,” but that may be too much of a flame for GQ … but I’d say that my firm opinion is that they’re unconnected. The 36 righteous men is a product of Medieval Jewish thought – **RedNaxela** can no doubt give more specifics; my WAG is that it’s connected to Kabbalistic doctrine. The 144,000 is derived from a carefully selective reading of Revelation 7:4-8 (note that this is a New Testament, specifically Christian book, written somewhere around 100 AD, well before the Jewish doctrine evolved). Note, if you please, that these are 144,000 righteous _Jews_; the number of Gentiles is “huge…impossible to count” (see Rev. 7:9, immediately after this passage). Early Jehovah’s Witness doctrine considered the number to be _saved_ at all to be 144,000 – until the number of JWs grew beyond 144,000, when this was re-interpreted. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/19 "2003-08-08T17:49:14Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by RedNaxela \* \*\ ***Bosda** , I’m not familiar with a tradition such as you mention; if you could provide a cite, I’d greatly appreciate it (always looking to expand my knowledge). There are a couple of similar ideas in Jewish literature; is it possible that you’re thinking of one of them?[list=1][li]There are at least 36 “hidden” righteous people (who appear outwardly as simple people) in every generation, and it’s in their merit that the universe continues to exist. (However, there’s no indication that these are the same 36 from one generation to the next, just that before one of them dies there’s someone else available to take his or her place.)[/li][li]There are a select few (different versions of this tradition list, IIRC, between seven and eleven) who didn’t die but rather entered Paradise alive. AFAIK, the only one of these who is said to return to earth on occasion - and therefore could be considered “an immortal among us” - is the prophet Elijah.[/list=1] \*\*[/li][/QUOTE] I seem to have scrambled the two. Many apologies. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2003, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811/20 "2003-08-08T17:52:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by av8rmike \* > \*\*Aren’t you forgetting Dick Clark? > > I’m also not familiar with the tradition **Bosda** mentions, but it sounds suspiciously like the conspiracy-nutjob drivel about the world being run by Zionist elders. \*\* Your remark is more than slightly insulting. [list=1] [li]I am not an anti-Semite.[/li][li]I am not stupid enough to buy into their cr#p.[/li][li]Do not make these insinuations again, outside of the Pit.[/li][li]If you do make them in the Pit, you’d better be prepared to back them up with something better than this claptrap.[/li][/list=1] :mad: [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-there-immortals-among-us/193811.md?page=2)