# Are these shitty cryptic clues? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [October 7, 2017, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252 "2017-10-07T19:44:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![K364](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k364/32/5_2.png) [@K364](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/K364)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/1 "2017-10-07T19:44:37Z")
Or do I just not get them? 1. No one is missing full board and lodging (3,5) ALL FOUND 1. Partition between pigs and birds (8) SWALLOWS 1. A touching article or tract (4) AREA ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/2 "2017-10-07T22:27:09Z")
I don’t really get 1 (the answer is not an expression I’m familiar with) but 2 is “wall” (the partition) in the middle of “sows” (the pigs), so I think that works fine.. I’m not quite there on 3 but I think the first letter of the clue is the first letter of the answer, the “article” in the clue is the other “a” in the answer, and I suppose “touching” could loosely be “re”, as in “touching on” (regarding). Then “tract” (of land) is “area”. On that basis I’d rate 1 as poor, 2 as good, and 3 as acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![Itself](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d07c76/32.png) [@Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Itself)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/3 "2017-10-07T23:25:16Z")
No, these are bad clues. (The second isn’t bad, actually, just completely unremarkable.) 1. Dbl def. Google tells me that “all found” is a dated British expression meaning that an employee’s wages also includes full board and lodging. 2. S(WALL)OWS. Sows = pigs, wall = partition, and ‘birds’ is the literal part. 3. A+RE+A. “Touching” for “re” is a bit of a stretch. ---
**Author:** ![steepone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/977dab/32.png) [@steepone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steepone)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/4 "2017-10-07T23:38:39Z")
I think the first two are ok, I probably would have got those, ALL FOUND is a common enough expression describing a job where food and lodging is provided and Dead Cat’s explanation of the second matches what I thought I get the third one after seeing Dead Cat’s explanation but I probably wouldn’t have got it on my own ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2017, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/5 "2017-10-08T16:38:40Z")
For the record, I didn’t get any of them on my own! With crosswords I usually need a few helping letters to get most of the clues. ---
**Author:** ![AppallingGael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9bd4f/32.png) [@AppallingGael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AppallingGael)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2017, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/6 "2017-10-09T04:52:59Z")
ALL FOUND is an anagram of “full” and “and”, plus an O. I don’t see where the O comes from, though, and I don’t see where the clue suggests an anagram. I just point it out to give a possible head start for anybody else trying to figure it. I also don’t agree that WALL is “between” pigs. It is merely within pigs. I agree that “touching” for “re” is a stretch, but of the three, it seems to me the least objectionable clue. ---
**Author:** ![Busy\_Scissors](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d78d45/32.png) [@Busy\_Scissors](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Busy_Scissors)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2017, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/7 "2017-10-09T10:39:36Z")
Decent clueing IMHO - not amazing, but certainly not shitty - a crossword will always have these sort of solid clues as a base for the more witty and entertaining ones. Plus unfamiliar expressions such as _all found_ are part and parcel of cryptics, or at least the ones I (try to) do. There’s almost always a clue or two with a bit of a stretched definition. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/8 "2017-10-12T11:16:04Z")
The first one seems not to fit the style of the other two. It’s not playing with words, but just a straightforward answer. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 9:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/9 "2017-10-13T09:32:45Z")
I just ran across a cryptic clue that I like quite a lot, and this seems as good a place as any to share it. “Matt plans stay with no limits somewhere in Georgia.” (7 letters) ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/10 "2017-10-13T14:25:44Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > The first one seems not to fit the style of the other two. It’s not playing with words, but just a straightforward answer. It’s a standard “double definition” by cryptic parlance. The answer, ALL FOUND, satisfies both ends of the clue: [No one is missing] [full board and lodging]. Cryptics have a whole variety of clue types, and this is one of the usual ones. ---
**Author:** ![K364](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k364/32/5_2.png) [@K364](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/K364)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/11 "2017-10-13T15:37:44Z")
I’ve never heard of ALL FOUND being a term used in lodging. Is this a common term anywhere, or just one of those crosswordism’s? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/12 "2017-10-13T16:15:19Z")
I’m guessing it was a lot more common in the Victorian era, when live-in servants were common. The term is rare now, I expect, mostly just because the situation it describes is rare. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/13 "2017-10-13T16:54:21Z")
> [@K364](#): > > I’ve never heard of ALL FOUND being a term used in lodging. Is this a common term anywhere, or just one of those crosswordism’s? From what I can tell, it seems to be a dated British phrase, but still somewhat in use. [This post from 2012](https://forum.wordreference.com/threads/all-found-deal.2460596/) references an oil career site that advertised one of their jobs as an “all found deal,” so it appears some people do still use it. I had an “all found” job when I worked in Scotland at a hotel restaurant about 20 years ago, but I don’t recall that specific term being used. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/14 "2017-10-13T17:02:19Z")
[Here’s another current usage of it that I found on a UK job site](https://www.indeed.co.uk/cmp/Butlins/reviews?ftopic=jobsecadv&fjobcat=management&lang=). It’s a review of a company that runs holiday camps. One of the reviewers says “Pros: All Found. Cons: Hard work but very rewarding.” ---
**Author:** ![K364](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k364/32/5_2.png) [@K364](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/K364)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/15 "2017-10-13T17:51:33Z")
Thanks pulykamell, but since the Cryptic was in Canada’s Globe and Mail newspaper I consider it a crosswordism ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2017, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/16 "2017-10-13T20:02:13Z")
> [@K364](#): > > Thanks pulykamell, but since the Cryptic was in Canada’s Globe and Mail newspaper I consider it a crosswordism Ah. I just assumed it being a cryptic, it was British. Never got any good at those things. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [October 14, 2017, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/17 "2017-10-14T18:19:47Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I just ran across a cryptic clue that I like quite a lot, and this seems as good a place as any to share it. > > “Matt plans stay with no limits somewhere in Georgia.” > > (7 letters) I quite like that one. mATt pLANs sTAy without the end letters of each word = ATLANTA ETA: 1 and 2 are unremarkable cryptic clues, but they are not poor. 3 is crappy. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2017, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/18 "2017-10-15T02:22:43Z")
So am I to understand that “cryptic” is supposed to mean “crossword puzzle”? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2017, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/19 "2017-10-15T02:51:18Z")
American crossword puzzles are different from British crossword puzzles. To distinguish them, Americans call the British style “cryptic crosswords”. In a British crossword, about half of the letters in each answer cross with other words, but the clues always have two parts, both of which must be satisfied by the answer (the trick being to figure out which part is which). If your answer matches the clue twice, then you can be certain that you got it correct. In an American crossword, while the clues might sometimes be a bit tricky, there’s only ever one clue for each answer, but every single square is part of both an Across and Down answer. So if your answer fits with all of the other words, you can be certain that you got it correct. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2017, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252/20 "2017-10-15T02:55:36Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > I quite like that one. Yes. I’ve been doing these for a while and I’ve never seen that particular sort of wordplay before. Thought it was interesting. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-these-shitty-cryptic-clues/798252.md?page=2)