# Are US Embassies armed? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 7, 2012, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082 "2012-03-07T23:43:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2012, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/41 "2012-03-16T04:53:25Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > The Iranian incident was an indictment of the Ambassador, CIA and political officer types who were posted there and never saw it coming. All the non-critical personnel (at the very least) should have been evacuated way before that happened. Well, I don’t want to overextend myself, but, when it happened everybody was amazed, because embassies are usually inviolate. The Iranian government was under sort of an obligation to force the mob to surrender the hostages, rather than aid them. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 16, 2012, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/42 "2012-03-16T17:01:42Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > Well, I don’t want to overextend myself, but, when it happened everybody was amazed, because embassies are usually inviolate. The Iranian government was under sort of an obligation to force the mob to surrender the hostages, rather than aid them. Embassies and diplomats are anything but inviolate. There is a history of embassy assaults going back to 1829 in Russia. The earliest US embassy attack I can find is in 1964 at Libreville, Gabon and there have been a total of 22, which doesn’t include attacks on individual mission members. The only person who has true diplomatic immunity is the ambassador, and even that is out the window when there is regime change. The idea that people with diplo passports can’t be arrested or ticketed is nonsense. The people at Embassy Tehran were mostly seasoned Middle-East officers who knew how volatile that area is. Treachery and lies are a way of life there. Regime change doesn’t just happen overnight and there had to have been signs that this was coming. They were just missed by key officers. The Iranian government at first said that the hostages would be released, but then decided to hold them and torture them. Why Iran was given a pass on this is beyond me. ---
**Author:** ![Kozmik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8dc957/32.png) [@Kozmik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kozmik)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/43 "2012-03-17T11:56:04Z")
And, if they are armed, I wonder if they would be ordered to disarm if the Secretary of State paid a visit. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/44 "2012-03-17T14:36:57Z")
> [@Kozmik](#): > > And, if they are armed, I wonder if they would be ordered to disarm if the Secretary of State paid a visit. What sort of statement is that? ---
**Author:** ![Kozmik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8dc957/32.png) [@Kozmik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kozmik)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/45 "2012-03-17T16:20:05Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > What sort of statement is that? [Lisa’s Nightmare](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treehouse_of_Horror_II). ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/46 "2012-03-17T17:06:08Z")
> [@Kozmik](#): > > [Lisa’s Nightmare](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treehouse_of_Horror_II). Ah, cultural references. We don’t get those around here. Or at least I don’t. ---
**Author:** ![mnemosyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/47 "2012-03-17T17:57:24Z")
> [@Ibanez](#): > > I think so. I’ve been in the US embassy in Ottawa a few times. Once you go through two metal detectors, heavy doors and then empty out your pockets, you’re then in a locked down lobby with a US Marine in an armour glass plated booth with a murder hole about waist high. Which is a little weird, given as you can walk right up to the Parliament buildings, explore the grounds, visit inside (though you do go through one metal detector and bags are x-rayed, and you can only go around on a guided tour). If visiting while the House is sitting, the only thing between you and them _might_ be an old window. There’s lots of bored-looking security guards all over, but they aren’t trying to intimidate you at all. Then you walk down the road and the US embassy is gated off with a fairly imposing fence, tons of video cameras, guards everywhere and barriers along the road preventing cars from getting too close (and reducing parking spaces even more!), etc. I’ve visited Ottawa fairly often, and whenever we walk by there, the conversation turns to just how _paranoid_ it looks. It’s rather unwelcoming. I’ve actually heard other groups of tourists say things like …“what’s that…oh, the US Embassy. Figures.” We understand the motivation (OMG! terrorists!) but there’s still something incongruous about it compared to the rest of the city of Ottawa - it stands out, and not in a nice way. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/48 "2012-03-17T18:34:36Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#): > > Which is a little weird, given as you can walk right up to the Parliament buildings, explore the grounds, visit inside (though you do go through one metal detector and bags are x-rayed, and you can only go around on a guided tour). If visiting while the House is sitting, the only thing between you and them _might_ be an old window. There’s lots of bored-looking security guards all over, but they aren’t trying to intimidate you at all. > > Then you walk down the road and the US embassy is gated off with a fairly imposing fence, tons of video cameras, guards everywhere and barriers along the road preventing cars from getting too close (and reducing parking spaces even more!), etc. I’ve visited Ottawa fairly often, and whenever we walk by there, the conversation turns to just how _paranoid_ it looks. It’s rather unwelcoming. I’ve actually heard other groups of tourists say things like …“what’s that…oh, the US Embassy. Figures.” We understand the motivation (OMG! terrorists!) but there’s still something incongruous about it compared to the rest of the city of Ottawa - it stands out, and not in a nice way. It only took a couple of bombings to realize that a large portion of the planet doesn’t like us. Seems like whenever we let down our guard, something like Nairobi (1998) happens. It’s not easy to harden a building without it being somewhat ugly. About the best that can be done are the large concrete barriers that are disguised as planters. ---
**Author:** ![mnemosyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/49 "2012-03-17T19:06:39Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > It only took a couple of bombings to realize that a large portion of the planet doesn’t like us. Seems like whenever we let down our guard, something like Nairobi (1998) happens. It’s not easy to harden a building without it being somewhat ugly. About the best that can be done are the large concrete barriers that are disguised as planters. Oh, I know - like I said, I understand the reasoning. Have you been to Ottawa, though? The whole armed fortress thing just doesn’t _fit_ in that area of town. A friend and I once stopped to look at the rather pretty flower garden that’s located at one end of the US Embassy property (enclosed in the fence). In the minute or two we were there to admire the flowers, two guards came out at different places and stared us down. They didn’t say or do anything, but they were suddenly on high alert because we’d stopped walking. Two white chicks in sundresses and flip flops, looking at flowers during the Tulip Festival - how threatening. 🆒 I know, I know, if we _were_ terrorists we might dress that way, yadda yadda. But the _vast_ majority of people aren’t terrorists, and so the guards just look like big paranoid assholes trying to threaten everyone and anyone, and then they go and wonder why no one likes them? Like I said, I get it. But I also think that particular building looks rather out of place and silly. Downtown Baghdad? Sure. Downtown Ottawa? Seriously? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2012, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/50 "2012-03-17T21:05:27Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#): > > Oh, I know - like I said, I understand the reasoning. > > Have you been to Ottawa, though? The whole armed fortress thing just doesn’t _fit_ in that area of town. > > A friend and I once stopped to look at the rather pretty flower garden that’s located at one end of the US Embassy property (enclosed in the fence). In the minute or two we were there to admire the flowers, two guards came out at different places and stared us down. They didn’t say or do anything, but they were suddenly on high alert because we’d stopped walking. Two white chicks in sundresses and flip flops, looking at flowers during the Tulip Festival - how threatening. 🆒 > > I know, I know, if we _were_ terrorists we might dress that way, yadda yadda. But the _vast_ majority of people aren’t terrorists, and so the guards just look like big paranoid assholes trying to threaten everyone and anyone, and then they go and wonder why no one likes them? > > Like I said, I get it. But I also think that particular building looks rather out of place and silly. Downtown Baghdad? Sure. Downtown Ottawa? Seriously? 😛 You never know when an enraged Canadian beaver trapper might run up and kick the building, eh? ---
**Author:** ![Ibanez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a4c791/32.png) [@Ibanez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibanez)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2012, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082/51 "2012-03-18T23:33:14Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#): > > Oh, I know - like I said, I understand the reasoning. > > Have you been to Ottawa, though? The whole armed fortress thing just doesn’t _fit_ in that area of town. > > A friend and I once stopped to look at the rather pretty flower garden that’s located at one end of the US Embassy property (enclosed in the fence). In the minute or two we were there to admire the flowers, two guards came out at different places and stared us down. They didn’t say or do anything, but they were suddenly on high alert because we’d stopped walking. Two white chicks in sundresses and flip flops, looking at flowers during the Tulip Festival - how threatening. 🆒 > > I know, I know, if we _were_ terrorists we might dress that way, yadda yadda. But the _vast_ majority of people aren’t terrorists, and so the guards just look like big paranoid assholes trying to threaten everyone and anyone, and then they go and wonder why no one likes them? > > Like I said, I get it. But I also think that particular building looks rather out of place and silly. Downtown Baghdad? Sure. Downtown Ottawa? Seriously? 😛 It looks like a building to me that sticks out no more than any other in the area. I know a lane is taken in front of it is lined with enforced security posts (to slow down truck bombs) but with the flower pots next to them, it doesn’t look that odd too me. The U.S. embassy in Ottawa isn’t the only one with cement barriers with iron gate surrounding it either, most of them in Ottawa have that. Maybe the thing that bothers you is that not because it looks like a fortress but because Americans treat it like a fortress and rightly should as pointed out. Just because we haven’t had a terrorist attack yet here doesn’t mean it will never happen. We stopped a few in the past since 911. Also a lot of the guards that work there are contracted Canadian commissionaires. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-us-embassies-armed/615082.md?page=2)