# Are we "Lambs heading to Slaughter" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 27, 2012, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077 "2012-10-27T22:32:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/21 "2012-10-28T00:57:57Z")
Well, so far you haven’t attempted to defend your OP, but prefer to engage in the personality issues with members who have been here far, far, far longer than you. At this rate the only blood that [del]may[/del] will be spilled will belong to you. As this is your very first thread (Welcome, BTW!) you may want to concentrate on defending your view and let the personality crap just flow by. Otherwise, your time here will be just another fart in the wind. ---
**Author:** ![Back\_to\_basics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Back\_to\_basics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Back_to_basics)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/22 "2012-10-28T01:00:01Z")
Never said that at all…! But the sky is falling! ---
**Author:** ![Crab\_Rangoon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Crab\_Rangoon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crab_Rangoon)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/23 "2012-10-28T01:07:54Z")
I call tomorrow at high noon. ---
**Author:** ![Back\_to\_basics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Back\_to\_basics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Back_to_basics)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/24 "2012-10-28T01:12:59Z")
Duckster, you are 100% correct! My apologies to you… My post was not about FEMA, I really could careless, it is about apathy in this country and the lack of knowledge, I want to know who is awake! ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/25 "2012-10-28T01:14:19Z")
I predict an executive order granting the moderators emergency thread closing and banning powers soon. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/26 "2012-10-28T01:24:29Z")
Back to basics, the only thing your presence warns us about is the tragedy of slipping English composition skills. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/27 "2012-10-28T01:27:11Z")
> [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > Yes you can my Lord Jayjay … then the moderator can move you over to the “Pom pass Jacka$$ section” > > My Lord!! Do not resort to name-calling insults in any forum outside The BBQ Pit. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Back\_to\_basics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Back\_to\_basics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Back_to_basics)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/28 "2012-10-28T01:29:58Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Back to basics, the only thing your presence warns us about is the tragedy of slipping English composition skills. Good point sir, I will be more careful in the future. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/29 "2012-10-28T01:35:10Z")
> [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > My post was not about FEMA, I really could careless, it is about apathy in this country and the lack of knowledge, I want to know who is awake! So this was a test? I can’t tell you how relieved we all are that we passed. ---
**Author:** ![Back\_to\_basics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Back\_to\_basics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Back_to_basics)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/30 "2012-10-28T01:39:16Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Back to basics, the only thing your presence warns us about is the tragedy of slipping English composition skills. > [@Gyrate](#): > > So this was a test? I can’t tell you how relieved we all are that we passed. I am so pleased that you are relieved. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/31 "2012-10-28T01:41:06Z")
> [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > Duckster, you are 100% correct! > > My apologies to you… > My post was not about FEMA, I really could careless, it is about apathy in this country and the lack of knowledge, I want to know who is awake! The lack of knowledge is all yours I’m afraid. Every single assertion of your original post is without merit, it is a collection of deluded fantasies. If you want to know who is awake look to the posters who have already explained this. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/32 "2012-10-28T01:45:09Z")
What the hell is it about FEMA anyway? Way back in 2001 or 2002 some of my friends were reading a book about how FEMA used Black Helicopters to keep tabs on everyone and assassinate them if they did… something, including reading that book (don’t ask me how you could get that book in a bookstore if the Government really didn’t want you reading it). As far as I know it was theoretically “nonfiction” (not meaning the “facts” were true, but that it wasn’t presented as a narrative) ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/33 "2012-10-28T01:49:45Z")
> [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > FEMA itself came into existence by means of an executive order. While this may be true on a technicality, it ignores the fact that the Executive Order addressed simply the reorganization of a number of smaller agencies, (already operating under the Executive office), that had their origins in a multitude of both Congressional and Executive actions. It also ignores the fact that Congress has, on several occasions, given the agency authorization to carry out specific duties, as well as confirming the agency’s legitimacy by conferring more duties uon it and recognizing it in the creation of the Department of Homeland Security, > [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > Please note, an emergency is defined by federal law as any occasion or instance for which, in the determination of the President, federal assistance is needed to supplement state and local efforts and capabilities to save lives and to protect property and public health and safety, or to lessen or avert the threat of a catastrophe in any part of the United States. That such an event is “defined by law” undercuts your claim that the whole thing is an executive power play. You also seem to have missed the fact that the President cannot declare an emergency unless he is asked to do so by the governor of the state in which the emergency occurred. > [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > "What the War and Emergency Powers Act does, in conjunction with the above-mentioned executive orders, is to enable the President to “Suspend the Constitution at will”. You will have to provide a direct quotation from the law that you claim permits this. > [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > All the President needs to justify this action is to declare a national emergency. > Again, that it is the President himself who declares the emergency; not Congress. But only after the president is invited to do so by the governor of the state affected by the emergency. > [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > Also, think about this for a moment “Homeland Security” has the right to suspend your rights as a “Citizen of the United States of America” at anytime no questions asked or answered. Again: show us the actual law that makes this happen in the way that you describe it happening. > [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > What are your thoughts? I think that you have encountered an alarmist tract or website that has presented an incomplete and slanted description of the laws surrounding FEMA and that you have fallen prey to their wild Conspitracy Theory. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/34 "2012-10-28T02:05:24Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > (don’t ask me how you could get that book in a bookstore if the Government really didn’t want you reading it) Heh, reminds me of one of my favorite _Simpsons_ jokes. It involved Al Gore. ---
**Author:** ![Back\_to\_basics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Back\_to\_basics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Back_to_basics)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/35 "2012-10-28T02:06:37Z")
> [@zoid](#): > > The lack of knowledge is all yours I’m afraid. Every single assertion of your original post is without merit, it is a collection of deluded fantasies. If you want to know who is awake look to the posters who have already explained this. Thank you for your informative in depth observation and a most delightfully objective critique. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/36 "2012-10-28T02:10:23Z")
> [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > Thank you for your informative in depth observation and a most delightfully objective critique. It’s the only honest and logical reponse possible. You’ve posted a bunch of unfounded nonsense. I attempted to point this out. You responded with snark. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/37 "2012-10-28T02:14:36Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > What the hell is it about FEMA anyway? The Right has a hate-on for it because its purpose is to help people\*, instead of them “pulling themselves up by the bootstraps”. Look how Bush made a point of eviscerating it when he got into office. \*Note how they don’t have such a paranoid attitude over institutions like the prison system or the military; those are meant to harm people not help them, so the Right has no problem with them or fear of them. Even though in a real tyranny, they’d be at the forefront of any program of oppression, not FEMA. ---
**Author:** ![Back\_to\_basics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Back\_to\_basics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Back_to_basics)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/38 "2012-10-28T02:18:02Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > While this may be true on a technicality, it ignores the fact that the Executive Order addressed simply the reorganization of a number of smaller agencies, (already operating under the Executive office), that had their origins in a multitude of both Congressional and Executive actions. > It also ignores the fact that Congress has, on several occasions, given the agency authorization to carry out specific duties, as well as confirming the agency’s legitimacy by conferring more duties uon it and recognizing it in the creation of the Department of Homeland Security, > > That such an event is “defined by law” undercuts your claim that the whole thing is an executive power play. You also seem to have missed the fact that the President cannot declare an emergency unless he is asked to do so by the governor of the state in which the emergency occurred. > > You will have to provide a direct quotation from the law that you claim permits this. > > But only after the president is invited to do so by the governor of the state affected by the emergency. > > Again: show us the actual law that makes this happen in the way that you describe it happening. > > I think that you have encountered an alarmist tract or website that has presented an incomplete and slanted description of the laws surrounding FEMA and that you have fallen prey to their wild Conspitracy Theory. Maybe, just maybe I’m wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/39 "2012-10-28T02:21:02Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > The Right has a hate-on for it because its purpose is to help people\*, instead of them “pulling themselves up by the bootstraps”. Look how Bush made a point of eviscerating it when he got into office. > > \*Note how they don’t have such a paranoid attitude over institutions like the prison system or the military; those are meant to harm people not help them, so the Right has no problem with them or fear of them. Even though in a real tyranny, they’d be at the forefront of any program of oppression, not FEMA. I’m not sure, the “FEMA is going to kill us all” crowd **I’ve** encountered at least seems to have significant overlap with the Truther community – and the Truther community always struck me as being pretty liberal. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077/40 "2012-10-28T02:28:33Z")
> [@Back\_to\_basics](#): > > Maybe, just maybe I’m wrong. Well? You had to have gotten your claims from somewhere. Research those sources and figure out whether they are publishing facts or lies. Find the source of the allegations I challenged and discover whether there is any substance in their claims. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-lambs-heading-to-slaughter/639077.md?page=3)