# Are we our own prisons? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 27, 2017, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388 "2017-04-27T19:14:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/41 "2017-04-28T03:15:08Z")
[Freedom’s Waiting](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7lOOQxEv9M) ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/42 "2017-04-28T03:18:19Z")
> [@Fredescu](#): > > Have you tried focusing your ability to point out logical errors on the guy with no physical freedom who is claiming to be free? When someone says prison is in the mind it speaks of a different freedom. I’m not trying to defend him, but I’m trying to point out the counters people might have to some points. ---
**Author:** ![Fredescu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/73ab20/32.png) [@Fredescu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fredescu)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/43 "2017-04-28T04:00:41Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > When someone says prison is in the mind it speaks of a different freedom. I would say the “fallacy” you’re looking for is this one then: [Glittering generality - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glittering_generality) It’s not technically a logical fallacy, but it doesn’t need to be because the quote isn’t making a logical claim. It is appealing to the emotion that the term “freedom” is laden with. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/44 "2017-04-28T12:23:21Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > “They’re prisons! Man made prisons! You’re doing time. You get up in the morning. She’s there. You go to sleep at night. She’s there. It’s like you gotta ask permission to use the bathroom. Is it all right if I use the bathroom now? Yeah, and you can forget about watching TV while you’re eating. Oh, yeah. You know why? Because it’s dinner time. And you know what you do at dinner? You talk about your day. How was your day today? Did you have a good day today or a bad day today? Well, what kind of day was it? Well, I don’t know. How about you? How was your day? It’s sad , Jerry! It’s a sad state of affairs!!” > > -Kramer Maybe I am in prison, but the warden is really pretty. Especially when she’s wearing that purple nightgown. And double especially when she isn’t. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/45 "2017-04-28T12:57:04Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Dear god no. I’m not crazy, … Did your mom have you tested? ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/46 "2017-04-28T14:37:43Z")
> [@Fredescu](#): > > I would say the “fallacy” you’re looking for is this one then: [Glittering generality - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glittering_generality) > > It’s not technically a logical fallacy, but it doesn’t need to be because the quote isn’t making a logical claim. It is appealing to the emotion that the term “freedom” is laden with. I was mostly referring to how you can’t just dismiss someone just because they are crazy (which I think is a fallacy). But you are correct I think, freedom is a pretty emotionally charged term just like slavery. Such words evoke emotion over reason and are usually likely to win people over. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/47 "2017-04-28T14:57:12Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > I was mostly referring to how you can’t just dismiss someone just because they are crazy (which I think is a fallacy). You shouldn’t listen to them because they are crazy either. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/48 "2017-04-28T16:31:00Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Some would even say that freedom is a prison and prison is freedom. And some would have a wank right in front of ye. What’s your point? ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/49 "2017-04-28T21:54:04Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > You shouldn’t listen to them because they are crazy either. So then what is one supposed to do. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/50 "2017-04-28T23:02:01Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > So then what is one supposed to do. Do about what? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2017, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/51 "2017-04-28T23:32:18Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Some would even say that freedom is a prison and prison is freedom. “Questions are a burden to others, and answers a prison for oneself.” Being imprisoned “frees you” from the burden of making decisions. What shall I have for dinner tonight? Being free, I am compelled to decide, but in prison, I would have that decision lifted from my shoulders, simplifying things greatly. More seriously, everyone is not only a prisoner in his or her own head…but in solitary confinement. No one can ever really know another person’s mind. At best, we tap out code against the walls. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/52 "2017-04-29T06:42:49Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > “Questions are a burden to others, and answers a prison for oneself.” > > Being imprisoned “frees you” from the burden of making decisions. What shall I have for dinner tonight? Being free, I am compelled to decide, but in prison, I would have that decision lifted from my shoulders, simplifying things greatly. > > More seriously, everyone is not only a prisoner in his or her own head…but in solitary confinement. No one can ever really know another person’s mind. At best, we tap out code against the walls. So you’re saying he’s right then? Or do you mean something else? In response to someone else, I said if I can’t write him off for being crazy but I shouldn’t listen to him because he’s crazy then what do you do? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/53 "2017-04-29T11:52:45Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > So you’re saying he’s right then? Or do you mean something else? > > In response to someone else, I said if I can’t write him off for being crazy but I shouldn’t listen to him because he’s crazy then what do you do? Ignore him completely, and go listen to people that _aren’t_ crazy. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/54 "2017-04-29T14:19:34Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Ignore him completely, and go listen to people that _aren’t_ crazy. And what if those other people say something similar to what I quoted from the beginning of the thread? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/55 "2017-04-29T14:47:19Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > And what if those other people say something similar to what I quoted from the beginning of the thread? What are you looking for exactly… permission from others to think that Manson’s insane rantings had a shred of validity to them? Why have you latched on to a criminal psychopath for guidance and insight to the human condition? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/56 "2017-04-29T15:35:36Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > In response to someone else, I said if I can’t write him off for being crazy but I shouldn’t listen to him because he’s crazy then what do you do? Don’t look for an authority figure who will tell you what to think. Listen to ideas from a lot of different sources, compare them, and think for yourself. Be your own authority figure. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/57 "2017-04-29T16:41:03Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > So you’re saying he’s right then? Or do you mean something else? > > In response to someone else, I said if I can’t write him off for being crazy but I shouldn’t listen to him because he’s crazy then what do you do? I mean about five different things altogether. Seriously, there is no one single answer to this. Even Charles Manson can say something pithy. It’s an adage, not an actual philosophical principle. Other people have said the same thing. Google the phrase. “We are all in prison; I built mine myself, but it doesn’t make it any easier to get out of.” “We are all in prison, but not everyone recognizes the fact.” etc. If Charles Manson said, “Eat less and exercise more,” would you reject this because he’s crazy? ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/58 "2017-04-29T20:05:59Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > I mean about five different things altogether. Seriously, there is no one single answer to this. Even Charles Manson can say something pithy. It’s an adage, not an actual philosophical principle. > > Other people have said the same thing. Google the phrase. “We are all in prison; I built mine myself, but it doesn’t make it any easier to get out of.” “We are all in prison, but not everyone recognizes the fact.” etc. > > If Charles Manson said, “Eat less and exercise more,” would you reject this because he’s crazy? Obviously not since everyone knows that, and it’s backed by science. So pretty much what you are saying is that what he says is true isn’t news and anything new he says isn’t true? Seems like he just cobbled together a few ideas from previous people just to sound profound and deep in order to fool a group of people into thinking him some messiah. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2017, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/59 "2017-04-29T22:20:41Z")
I certainly wouldn’t conclude that “anything new he says isn’t true.” Who can know? He might have an epiphany, and figure out something. Or he might just find a clever way to phrase it. He’s evil and crazy, but he ain’t stupid. Personally, I far prefer Vaughn Bode, the cartoon messiah, who also spouted obvious wisdom and thoughts that were deeply shallow. But he was also funny, and drew sexy pictures. He didn’t have anything of great value to say, but he said it (and drew it) well, and he was infinitely the nicer fellow. In one of Bode’s cartoons, a little figure is looking out of a huge window, which, as the scene pulls back, is revealed to be the lens of an eye. “This is the best view in the universe,” the guy says, and his wise mentor says, “This is the only view of the universe.” Profound? Nah. But nicely depicted. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2017, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388/60 "2017-04-30T00:40:23Z")
In short what he said isn’t new or exclusive to him right? Well that makes sense and makes me feel a bit better. Anyone can parrot someone else, in this case he just used that to play the role of guru in a turbulent time to appear wise enough to lure in those looking for guidance. And then you have quackers that completely miss the mark: [https://www.ideapod.com/idea/The-Final-Lesson-of-Truth-from-Seer-Friedrich-Nietzsche/569eba60474f142412877be6](https://www.ideapod.com/idea/The-Final-Lesson-of-Truth-from-Seer-Friedrich-Nietzsche/569eba60474f142412877be6) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-we-our-own-prisons/785388.md?page=4)