# Are you for the death penalty or not? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 17, 2009, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686 "2009-08-17T02:47:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/41 "2009-08-17T15:23:19Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > +1 > > There are new advances in forensics coming all the time wheich make positive proof more available than previously [and yes I will also agree that DNA has been exhonerating people currently named as guilty _because the DNA procedures did NOT exist when they went to trial_ that would not have been found guilty if that tech had existed at that time] > > There are some people who are so damaged they are not human, and instead of warehousing them, they should be put down with as much passion as a rabid dog. Many career gang members _are_ rabid dogs, and should be put down. When someone commits enough violent crimes that they have spent most of their lives in jail there is something wrong with them that we obviously can not repair. it may have started with society failing them, but that time passed long ago and they are irreparable at this time, we should stop warehousing them. Indeed. I am against the current system but for the concept of a death penalty were it adjudicated correctly and quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Hirundo82](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/919ad9/32.png) [@Hirundo82](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hirundo82)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/42 "2009-08-17T15:25:42Z")
I have no moral opposition to the death penalty as long as it is applied fairly and in such a way that there is no possibility of a wrongly convicted man being executed. I don’t think our present system meets any of those requirements. I don’t want the death penalty abolished, but I would like to see our system reformed to meet the aforementioned goals. There should be more strictly defined guidelines on who is eligible for the death penalty (e.g. strong physical evidence, multiple reliable witnesses to the crime). I think that if we did so, there would be far fewer people (especially innocent people) sentenced to death. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/43 "2009-08-17T15:32:44Z")
Against. It has no effect on crime and can lead to innocent people being killed. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/44 "2009-08-17T15:37:08Z")
Against it . I find it funny that many people who think the government is totally incompetent are certain that no innocent person has ever been executed wrongly. In other words, that group of morons has a flawless record in this case. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/45 "2009-08-17T15:53:21Z")
Opposed. Apart from the moral implications in the taking of human life for any purpose other than saving other life in immediate danger, it should be obvious that the problem of wrongful convictions is a huge one. When a wrongful conviction is discovered after ten years, we can’t turn back time, but we can release the prisoner with a hefty check and our apologies. Unless the sentence was death and had already been imposed, that is. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/46 "2009-08-17T16:02:03Z")
BTW, the Supreme Court has ruled that there is no constitutional problem with putting an innocent person to death. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/47 "2009-08-17T16:03:05Z")
Opposed We execute innocent people. That is as wrong as a state can get. It is barbaric . Killing people to prove killing is wrong is not logical. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/48 "2009-08-17T16:08:01Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Why on earth would the SCOTUS need to be involved in a case not involving a federal question? Because it always is. Capital cases that withstand state appeal are appealed into the Federal system. By creating the tribunal, we eliminate the lower levels and cut to the chase, so to speak. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/49 "2009-08-17T16:12:24Z")
Theoretically, yes, I believe that there are some offenses for which death is the most appropriate punishment. Practically, no, as I don’t trust either the state, human wisdom, due process, or human nature enough to make that decision in the vast, vast, vast majority of circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![Terraplane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@Terraplane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terraplane)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/50 "2009-08-17T16:19:58Z")
Against, in all circumstances. I think it’s barbaric to kill somebody for any reason besides self-defense and even if I ignored that I still wouldn’t trust the state to not screw it up. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/51 "2009-08-17T16:32:49Z")
Against. Even if there were no costs involved and it was known with 100% certainty what was done by the perp. Capital punishment does nothing to reform the perp, it is ineffective as a deterrent and it does not undo the crime. Therefore it is ALL about revenge. Revenge is a childish “second wrong” that doesn’t make anything right. I know, I know … username/post incongruity. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/52 "2009-08-17T16:36:27Z")
Forgot to mention- it’s applied far more often to minority defendants and to defendants whose victim was a white person than the other way around. ---
**Author:** ![Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sometimes_Sober_Sometimes_Not)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/53 "2009-08-17T17:02:03Z")
Last night flipping through the channels I saw that Clint Eastwood Movie “True Crime”. It’s about an innocent guy who was put on death row. It’s a freaky coincident, because I made this thread last night. ---
**Author:** ![Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sometimes_Sober_Sometimes_Not)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/54 "2009-08-17T17:03:05Z")
I respect all your opinions. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/55 "2009-08-17T17:04:07Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Opposed. > > Apart from the moral implications in the taking of human life for any purpose other than saving other life in immediate danger, it should be obvious that the problem of wrongful convictions is a huge one. When a wrongful conviction is discovered after ten years, we can’t turn back time, but we can release the prisoner with a hefty check and our apologies. > > Unless the sentence was death and had already been imposed, that is. Bricker, thank you for demonstrating, as you so frequently do, that “conservative” does not equal “asshole.” ---
**Author:** ![Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sometimes_Sober_Sometimes_Not)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/56 "2009-08-17T17:08:01Z")
If there is 100 percent proof the person did it with DNA evidence. Why shouldn’t the guy be put on death row depending on the crime? ---
**Author:** ![Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d2c977/32.png) [@Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sometimes_Sober_Sometimes_Not)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/57 "2009-08-17T17:13:21Z")
Also, I’m guessing alot of the people here are “pro-choice”. (I happen to be, depending on the terms of the pregnancy.) Wouldn’t that be a “double standard” in a way if you’re against the death penalty, but you are pro-choice. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/58 "2009-08-17T17:17:44Z")
> [@Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](#): > > Also, I’m guessing alot of the people here are “pro-choice”. (I happen to be, depending on the terms of the pregnancy.) > > Wouldn’t that be a “double standard” in a way if you’re against the death penalty, but you are pro-choice. Hardly. Pro-choice people do not consider a fetus to be a person, and therefore it is not deserving of legal protection. The contradiction is being in favor of the death-penalty but against abortion rights. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/59 "2009-08-17T17:18:12Z")
> [@Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](#): > > Also, I’m guessing alot of the people here are “pro-choice”. (I happen to be, depending on the terms of the pregnancy.) > > Wouldn’t that be a “double standard” in a way if you’re against the death penalty, but you are pro-choice. It would be if pro-choice people thought fetuses were people, but 99% of us don’t- they are _potential_ people, at least until they become viable. I’m sure there are some out there who _do_ think fetuses are people but are okay with killing them anyway, hence the 1% allowance. However, convicted criminals _are_ people, no matter how distasteful their crimes may be. As noted above, I don’t have a philosophical objection to the death penalty anyway. I just don’t see the point, and I have yet to hear a reasonable proposal for how you’d compensate a wrongfully executed person. ETA: beaten to the punch _shakes fist at **StR** _ ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2009, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686/60 "2009-08-17T17:20:15Z")
> [@Sometimes\_Sober\_Sometimes\_Not](#): > > If there is 100 percent proof the person did it with DNA evidence. > > Why shouldn’t the guy be put on death row depending on the crime? There is no such thing as 100% proof. DNA evidence can be faked or contaminated. Especially in cases involving prosecutorial or police misconduct, all bets are off. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/are-you-for-the-death-penalty-or-not/506686.md?page=4)