# Argent Towers, a moment of your time. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 16, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227 "2010-02-16T18:23:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/261 "2010-02-17T01:15:44Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > What you don’t get is that no on was accusing AT of “grooming,” or being a pedophile (with the exception of a poster who made a mistake) of actually sending the kid porn. There was no “lynch mob.” There were no “pitchforks.” You’re bitching about a thread that doesn’t exist. I never said a lot of the things you are quoting. But, uh-oh! Nzinga is feeling some torch heat on her ass! Let me quote a few of the things that I DO find a bit mobby, although my original post never said anyone was mobby at all. I was taught to multi quote, but have forgotten how, so bear with me. Myrnalene wrote: “I think that he needs to stay far, far away from kids if he really thinks this is appropriate behavior.” StPauler introduces the idea that AT is creepy: "It’s one thing to recommend that book in that thread, but to me there’s something rather creepy about PMing it. " elbows calls for sanctions: "Also the fool that is Argent Towers deserves to be sanctioned for this action, regardless. " DianaG reinforces the ‘creepy’ angle, and also flat out calls him abnormal: “Then what the fuck is your problem? Because this is not normal behavior, dude.” “Recommending that book to an actual 13 year old is way beyond creepy.” Sarafeena implies that AT has exposed a child to porno: “And while I agree that some 13-year-olds might be able to hold their own in a philosophical discussion with adults, that doesn’t make it appropriate to expose them to child pornography.” Pepperland girl mentions ‘grooming’: “Also, as far as I know, members weren’t allowed to groom younger members or suggest reading material that would normalize sex between an adult and a child.” All of that nonsense was on page ONE. It feels mobby to me. Whew! I am not about to slog through the rest for more quotes. I am never going to do that again, as a matter of fact. I am going to breeze in and comment on the OP if I damn well please. It never even occured to me that a poster shouldn’t be able to. If I couldn’t I would rarely post! And the pittee decides he needs to pack it up?? Imagine letting that nonsense run me off a board that I love to post on. Hell no. ETA: Did lorene drop the term 'counter-offenderati?? Ha! Is that the same as ‘athiest religion’?? ---
**Author:** ![Myrnalene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@Myrnalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrnalene)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/262 "2010-02-17T01:17:09Z")
> [@lorene](#): > > I’m not allowed to change my mind after calling you something? Yes, everyone, I called her a fucker. I did I did I did. Please, someone, let the mods know. I then decided that it was unnecessarily inflammatory and I edited it. But clearly it is very important to **Diosa** to let the record show that I called her a fucker, so by all means, don’t let my editing fool you. I for one am shocked and appalled. > [@Carmady](#): > > “Yeah, I’m Stagger Lee and you better get down on your knees > And suck my dick, because If you don’t you’re gonna be dead” > Said Stagger Lee > > Billy dropped down and slobbered on his head > And Stag filled him full of lead > Oh yeah." That’s pleasant. Is Billy 11? If not, you are missing the point. ---
**Author:** ![Carmady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@Carmady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carmady)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/263 "2010-02-17T01:20:01Z")
> [@Myrnalene](#): > > That’s pleasant. Is Billy 11? If not, you are missing the point. Do 11-year-olds watch MTV? (and is Curtis supposed to be 11 now?) ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/264 "2010-02-17T01:23:04Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > I never said a lot of the things you are quoting. But, uh-oh! Nzinga is feeling some torch heat on her ass! Let me quote a few of the things that I DO find a bit mobby, although my original post never said anyone was mobby at all. I was taught to multi quote, but have forgotten how, so bear with me. > > Myrnalene wrote: > … So you managed to find all those quotes that to you qualify as ‘mobby,’ but yet at the same time failed to see any that were reasonable or clarified the thinking behind the objections? Not Fenris’, not dropzone’s, not Attack from the 3rd dimension’s (which was IMO one of the best in the entire thread), not even Ed’s warning. You don’t consider that maybe a little selective? ---
**Author:** ![Myrnalene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@Myrnalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrnalene)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/265 "2010-02-17T01:24:16Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Myrnalene wrote:“I think that he needs to stay far, far away from kids if he really thinks this is appropriate behavior.” You left out the two sentences **just before** that. > [@Myrnalene](#): > > **I do NOT believe Argent Towers is a pedophile.** I think he is a gold-plated idiot. If you seriously take issue with the fact that what AT did was incredibly inappropriate, then I have not one more word to say to you. HE HIMSELF has acknowledged that he acted wrongly, so I really don’t know what you are doing. You came in and shot your mouth off and are now scrambling for some hill or other to die on. Good luck with all that. ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/266 "2010-02-17T01:24:32Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > ETA: Did lorene drop the term 'counter-offenderati?? Ha! Is that the same as ‘athiest religion’?? I meant the people who won’t stop and listen to what others are actually saying but instead automatically dismiss it as “Offenderati” nonsense. If that’s the same as atheist religion, then so be it. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/267 "2010-02-17T01:25:17Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > Do 11-year-olds watch MTV? (and is Curtis supposed to be 11 now?) So lemme guess–you haven’t read _Hogg,_ right? Or the rest of the thread either, I’d assume. This would mean that your input would amount to precisely… lemme see, carry the one and: **DIDDLY** **SQUAT** ---
**Author:** ![Myrnalene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@Myrnalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrnalene)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/268 "2010-02-17T01:25:30Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > Do 11-year-olds watch MTV? (and is Curtis supposed to be 11 now?) You get that this discussion is about _child_ porn, right? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/269 "2010-02-17T01:26:55Z")
It’s not a just “a book.” It’s straight up pornography. It’s not even normal pornography but the most intentionally gross and violent pornography the autor could summon. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/270 "2010-02-17T01:28:39Z")
> [@Myrnalene](#): > > You left out the two sentences **just before** that. > > If you seriously take issue with the fact that what AT did was incredibly inappropriate, then I have not one more word to say to you. HE HIMSELF has acknowledged that he acted wrongly, so I really don’t know what you are doing. You came in and shot your mouth off and are now scrambling for some hill or other to die on. > > Good luck with all that. Wait. You don’t have not _one more word to say to me_ cause of _what_, now? The fuck outta here with that. You need to never speak to me again (I don’t really guess we speak much, but still) if I don’t agree with you? ETA: Syntropy, yes, of course I was being selective. I was looking for things that I found kind of ‘mobby’ For the record, I did see all of the posters that didn’t have pitchforks and stones. Good on them. ---
**Author:** ![Carmady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@Carmady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carmady)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/271 "2010-02-17T01:30:24Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > So lemme guess–you haven’t read _Hogg,_ right? Or the rest of the thread either, I’d assume. This would mean that your input would amount to precisely… lemme see, carry the one and: > > **DIDDLY** > **SQUAT** Thank you. Diddly divided by Squat could be huge. Both terms are small. Maybe it is .0001 divided by .00000000000000001, in which case my contribution dwarfs that of everyone else in the thread. And you are the one missing my point. Hogg is not child porn, it isn’t even illegal. Stuff that you consider very nasty is in some cases popular and recommended by MTV and major magazines. Nick Cave is mainstream. quote from wikipedia: Norman Mailer, for instance, said “There is no question that Hogg by Samuel R. Delany is a serious book with literary merit.”[2] ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/272 "2010-02-17T01:31:19Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > This thread is ridiculous. I saw worse than Hogg when I was 13. No you didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/273 "2010-02-17T01:33:13Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > Thank you. Diddly divided by Squat could be huge. Both terms are small. Maybe it is .0001 divided by .00000000000000001, in which case my contribution dwarfs that of everyone else in the thread. > > And you are the one missing my point. Hogg is not child porn, it isn’t even illegal. Stuff that you consider very nasty is in some cases popular and recommended by MTV and major magazines. Nick Cave is mainstream. > quote from wikipedia: > > Norman Mailer, for instance, said “There is no question that Hogg by Samuel R. Delany is a serious book with literary merit.”[2] It’s fucking child rape snuff scat incest torture porn. It’s completely asinine to suggest that it’s something that’s in anyway appropriate for a 13 year old. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/274 "2010-02-17T01:35:31Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > And you are the one missing my point. Hogg is not child porn, it isn’t even illegal. Stuff that you consider very nasty is in some cases popular and recommended by MTV and major magazines. Nick Cave is mainstream. > quote from wikipedia: > > Norman Mailer, for instance, said “There is no question that Hogg by Samuel R. Delany is a serious book with literary merit.”[2] > [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Then we’d have \*two \*people talking about it all the time… You had to go and say it, didn’t you? ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/275 "2010-02-17T01:36:15Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > Thank you. Diddly divided by Squat could be huge. Both terms are small. Maybe it is .0001 divided by .00000000000000001, in which case my contribution dwarfs that of everyone else in the thread. > > And you are the one missing my point. Hogg is not child porn, it isn’t even illegal. Stuff that you consider very nasty is in some cases popular and recommended by MTV and major magazines. Nick Cave is mainstream. > quote from wikipedia: > > Norman Mailer, for instance, said “There is no question that Hogg by Samuel R. Delany is a serious book with literary merit.”[2] [Try to keep up](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12125616&postcount=103). The whole Norman Mailler point was addressed earlier as well. Which you would know if you read the fucking thread. ---
**Author:** ![Carmady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@Carmady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carmady)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/276 "2010-02-17T01:39:44Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > You had to go and say it, didn’t you? I’m squeamish myself. I haven’t read nor would I ever read Hogg. I don’t even like violent horror movies (or the song I referenced). That isn’t relevant though. ---
**Author:** ![Carmady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@Carmady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carmady)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/277 "2010-02-17T01:42:39Z")
> [@Syntropy](#): > > [Try to keep up](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12125616&postcount=103). The whole Norman Mailler point was addressed earlier as well. Which you would know if you read the fucking thread. Delaney can call his book the king of Spain for all I care. It isn’t illegal. It isn’t child porn (which he did not call it). And it does have support from a respected author. Nick Cave might well call “Stagger Lee” pornography, but that didn’t stop MTV and Rolling Stone from recommending the album. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/278 "2010-02-17T01:43:56Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Sarafeena implies that AT has exposed a child to porno: > > “And while I agree that some 13-year-olds might be able to hold their own in a philosophical discussion with adults, that doesn’t make it appropriate to expose them to child pornography.” Look, I hate to have to defend myself, because it seems like twisting the knife in AT when he’s already apologized and such, but yeah, I did imply that. And I did so because I think that there’s really no functional difference between “exposing” a kid to porn by handing it to him and “exposing” a kid to porn by telling him where to get it and highly recommending that he do so. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/279 "2010-02-17T01:44:58Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > I’m squeamish myself. I haven’t read nor would I ever read Hogg. I don’t even like violent horror movies (or the song I referenced). > > That isn’t relevant though. Yes, it is, if you’re going to assert it’s not “child porn.” It has been expressly demonstrated that the author of the book in question unhesitatingly, resoundingly, unequivocally endorses the genre label of “pornography” for that book. Which has an eleven year old protagonist who is multiply, forcibly, disgustingly raped and abused in every manner imaginable all throughout the entire book. Is there anything germane remaining outside the nutshell descriptor of “child porn” that you object to in this case? ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/280 "2010-02-17T01:45:08Z")
> [@Carmady](#): > > Nick Cave might well call “Stagger Lee” pornography, but that didn’t stop MTV and Rolling Stone from recommending the album. To 13-year-olds in private messages on the internet? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227.md?page=15)