# Argent Towers, a moment of your time. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 16, 2010, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227 "2010-02-16T18:23:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/81 "2010-02-16T20:37:13Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > From the registration agreement: Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/82 "2010-02-16T20:37:41Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I used to work with kids as a teacher and ran some summer day camps and after school clubs. If I had recommended this book to a student, I would have been fired, and no philosophical justification would have saved me. You can get yourself into serious trouble with this shit. It _looks bad_. Use some common sense. Well, if I were working personally with kids in a situation like the one you describe, of course I would never do anything like that. Because I would have gotten into huge trouble. But here, on this forum, over the internet, where people post behind made-up monikers like the names of megalomaniac Air Force generals, it’s not like that. A text-based medium is totally different. If I could go back in time, though, I would never have done what I did. It has stirred up so much consternation here, it might be causing some peoples’ blood pressure to rise, and because I care about the well-being of all, I would never want that to happen. If it will help ease peoples’ minds, I will admit to a very poor and tasteless error in judgment, and apologize. You will henceforth hear no mention from me about this book, in any way, whether it be on the forums or in private messages. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/83 "2010-02-16T20:38:46Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > So it’s official then. We all have to be extra careful not to post anything that offends “the children”. :rolleyes: > > What a bunch of sanctimonious fucks. > > Marley, since you are posting, can I ask what the minimum age for posting on this board is? A little effort at reading comprehension would tell you that it’s the PMing that we are objecting to, not actual board content. [QUOTE=Marley23] It’s not my board, but the subject is under discussion. [/QUOTE] You asked what I would have you do, so I figured you would get my meaning when I said “your board” that you, as one of TPTB who are busy discussing it, are the ones who will decide if you think it’s appropriate or not to say something to **Argent Towers** about this. It might have been a good idea to try to intervene a little quicker than after a protracted discussion, so as maybe to help convince **Argent** not to have the conversation with Curtis in the first place, but I guess it’s too late for that now. ---
**Author:** ![Myrnalene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@Myrnalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrnalene)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/84 "2010-02-16T20:39:39Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Modding concerns aside, “porn” does not mean “something I think is gross.” I’m not going to read this thing to find out if it’s porn or not, but I’ll make that general point on literary grounds. :rolleyes: I’m quite aware. I think the Twilight books with their fucked up gender politics are “gross”, but I don’t consider them porn as they don’t contain _gleeful, graphic depictions of child rape._ But, uh, thanks for looking out for me. I’ll let you know if I need you to explain any more adult concepts that I am already familiar with. Since you saw you haven’t read the book (and I certainly don’t ask you to) I don’t know your point is, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Caffeine.addict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f475e1/32.png) [@Caffeine.addict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caffeine.addict)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/85 "2010-02-16T20:39:53Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > When that 13 year old is on a high horse lecturing all of us about degenerate behavior (and by using a stupid ad for a swimsuit magazine as an example) then I’ll give him a piece of my mind, frankly. > > I’ve said it before. He can dish it out, he can take it. So, you PMed him the book for what purpose? To show him what true degeneracy was? Seriously, what did you hope to accomplish by sending that? I’m morbidly curious. ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/86 "2010-02-16T20:40:30Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > So it’s official then. We all have to be extra careful not to post anything that offends “the children”. :rolleyes: I think you may have missed the point. It isn’t about ‘not offending the kids.’ It’s about being a responsible adult. It was possible to make the point Argent Towers wanted to make without soliciting a private message in order to recommend a book which graphically depicts the repeated rape of an 11 year old. There’s all kinds of elbow room between the two. Argent Towers chose the far end of the spectrum because his anger was piqued over being lectured on sexual depravity by a kid when he could have simply walked away knowing said kid knows exactly dick about what does and does not constitute ‘sexual deviancy.’ It was more important to him that he teach Curtis LeMay a lesson. That is the error in judgment we’re discussing. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/87 "2010-02-16T20:40:43Z")
Oh, for fuck’s sake. _Wont someone think of the children?!?!_ :rolleyes: Those of you that are saying that if someone on an internet message board dared suggest such filth to your child, you’d personally go beat them. . . uh, how about not letting your CHILD on an open forum that mostly consists of adults? Look, lots of stuff that is inappropriate for kids is discussed here- shit, there’s a ton of stuff that is inappropriate for me and I’m 24 ;). Should we all censor ourselves because of the middle school kids whose parents let them have free reign on the internet? I say plenty of things here that I’d never say in front of a 13 year old in person because dangit, the majority of the audience here ain’t 13. And the fact that some of you are suggesting that Argent is GROOMING this kid for sexual abuse is far more disgusting than him suggesting a book to someone on a message board. Jesus fucking Christ on the cross. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/88 "2010-02-16T20:41:31Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > When that 13 year old is on a high horse lecturing all of us about degenerate behavior (and by using a stupid ad for a swimsuit magazine as an example) then I’ll give him a piece of my mind, frankly. > > I’ve said it before. He can dish it out, he can take it. I’ve had five year olds sass me–does this mean it’s appropriate for me to beat the living shit out of them to teach them a lesson? No, because, as an adult, I’m expected to have the judgement and self restraint necessary to temper my behavior and expression. Did anybody ever explain this to you? > [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > I do find it amusing that you originally wrote “Delany’s long-dead filthy taint”. I was going to reply to tell you that Delany is very much alive, but I guess you figured that out on your own. Why yes, unlike some people I actually do give some thought to the things I say and do and correct as necessary. Perhaps you might interrupt your amusement and your jiggling around on your chair in babyish excitement for a moment and give that a leetle bit of thought. Perhaps even emulate the example? Or is too high a percentage of your processing capability taken up in your endless loop of kiddie rape book obsession? If so, you might want to get that looked at–if you keep picking at it, it’s liable to get even more infected than it already is. ---
**Author:** ![Myrnalene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@Myrnalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrnalene)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/89 "2010-02-16T20:45:54Z")
Diosa and bucketybuck, are you really so addle-brained that you cannot tell the difference between speaking about something objectionable in public that a child may hear or read, and specifically targeting that child as the recipient of such material? ---
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/90 "2010-02-16T20:47:52Z")
> [@Myrnalene](#): > > Diosa and bucketybuck, are you really so addle-brained that you cannot tell the difference between speaking about something objectionable in public that a child may here or read, and specifically targeting that child as the recipient of such material? Clearly both of these clueless retards can’t follow a simple conversation. Jackasses. ---
**Author:** ![Gfactor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@Gfactor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gfactor)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/91 "2010-02-16T20:48:15Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > Fuck you, Reminder: [QUOTE=Restricted language in the Pit] The following expressions should not be directed at other posters. * * * fuck you [/QUOTE] > **[Restricted language in the Pit](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=508858)** > > The following expressions should not be directed at other posters. cunt and variants, e.g., cuntlapper motherfucker cocksucker fuck you and variants, e.g., go fuck yourself, fuck off and die suck/lick my dick/cock and variants Expressions not... No warning issued. **Gfactor** Pit Moderator ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/92 "2010-02-16T20:50:26Z")
> [@Myrnalene](#): > > Diosa and bucketybuck, are you really so addle-brained that you cannot tell the difference between speaking about something objectionable in public that a child may hear or read, and specifically targeting that child as the recipient of such material? Exactly. I have no problem with talking about the book (or pretty much anything else) on the board. Argent Towers specifically messaged a 13 year old boy to recommend a book about the repeated sexual abuse of a 13 year old boy. That? Is fucked up. ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/93 "2010-02-16T20:51:15Z")
> [@Gfactor](#): > > Reminder: > > [Restricted language in the Pit - The BBQ Pit - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=508858) > > No warning issued. > > **Gfactor** > Pit Moderator I don’t think we’ll ever have a better example of how messed up the SDMB has become. I’m not busting on you, Gfactor, it’s not your fault. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/94 "2010-02-16T20:52:28Z")
> [@Sarahfeena](#): > > You asked what I would have you do, so I figured you would get my meaning when I said “your board” that you, as one of TPTB who are busy discussing it, are the ones who will decide if you think it’s appropriate or not to say something to **Argent Towers** about this. It might have been a good idea to try to intervene a little quicker than after a protracted discussion, so as maybe to help convince **Argent** not to have the conversation with Curtis in the first place, but I guess it’s too late for that now. I’m not objecting to you offering your opinion. Anyway: I responded about 20 minutes after the post was reported. I thought a non-mod suggestion would be sufficient. I don’t know when the PMs were made, but obviously it wasn’t. > [@Myrnalene](#): > > Since you saw you haven’t read the book (and I certainly don’t ask you to) I don’t know your point is, anyway. If you’ve read the thing, I defer to your experience. If you haven’t, I stand by my point: there’s no reason to throw out loaded words like child porn on something that sounds disgusting enough in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/95 "2010-02-16T20:54:56Z")
Maybe it’s just me, but again and again I see people complaining about over moderation on this board. Can’t say bad words, can’t call each other names, this word yes, this word no. Yet three times in the last couple of months I have seen things that scream for moderation and yet nothing happens until the boardmembers scream and scream. What the hell is up with that? Recommending pornographic material to a thirteen year old by pm? Good Lord, what next? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/96 "2010-02-16T20:55:21Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > Oh, for fuck’s sake. _Wont someone think of the children?!?!_ :rolleyes: > > Those of you that are saying that if someone on an internet message board dared suggest such filth to your child, you’d personally go beat them. . . uh, how about not letting your CHILD on an open forum that mostly consists of adults? > > Look, lots of stuff that is inappropriate for kids is discussed here- shit, there’s a ton of stuff that is inappropriate for me and I’m 24 ;). Should we all censor ourselves because of the middle school kids whose parents let them have free reign on the internet? I say plenty of things here that I’d never say in front of a 13 year old in person because dangit, the majority of the audience here ain’t 13. > > And the fact that some of you are suggesting that Argent is GROOMING this kid for sexual abuse is far more disgusting than him suggesting a book to someone on a message board. Jesus fucking Christ on the cross. No one cares about board posts, but contacting a child by PM to recommend child rape porn (and not just any ordinary child rape porn, but child rape porn also adorned with scat porn, snuff porn necrophila, misogynist rape and violence, and racism). If you can’t see why that would be inappropriate or why parents would be upset by it, then you’re a fucking moron. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/97 "2010-02-16T20:55:37Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Exactly. I have no problem with talking about the book (or pretty much anything else) on the board. Argent Towers specifically messaged a 13 year old boy to recommend a book about the repeated sexual abuse of a 13 year old boy. That? Is fucked up. Why do people who don’t know anything about the book keep talking about it as if they do? First of all, the narrator of the book isn’t 13. Second of all, if he was, it’s not like I would have recommended the book deliberately like that based on the age of the character, like to imply, “he’s the same age as you” as you seem to be suggesting that I did. People are using such loaded language here. “Recommending pornographic material?” “Child pornography?” You _don’t know what you’re talking about._ You’re resorting to these loaded terms because you know how much emotion is behind it and you know people will get outraged especially in the wake of the recent **Cesario** disaster. This has nothing to do with me insidiously trying to corrupt some innocent child by “exposing him” to evil “child pornography.” This is a case of me responding to someone’s aggressive and high-handed religious rhetoric and ideological barrages. Hell, I never even thought he would actually PM me, let alone say, “it was Hogg you were talking about, right?” So don’t make me out to be some kind of molester or pedophile. The book is about way, way more than “the repeated sexual abuse” of a boy. The whole thing is an experiment in challenging very strong social taboos. That’s the whole point of transgressive literature. ---
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/98 "2010-02-16T20:58:21Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > Why do people who don’t know anything about the book keep talking about it as if they do? > > First of all, the narrator of the book isn’t 13. Second of all, if he was, it’s not like I would have recommended the book deliberately like that based on the age of the character, like to imply, “he’s the same age as you” as you seem to be suggesting that I did. :rolleyes: It doesn’t matter WHY you recommended it and we don’t need to read the fucking book to know about it. There’s a fine wiki article about it. The bottom line is you kinda fucked up. Stop defending that. All you’re doing is asking for people to continue to beat you up. ---
**Author:** ![Myrnalene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@Myrnalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrnalene)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/99 "2010-02-16T20:58:33Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > First of all, the narrator of the book isn’t 13. No, he is not 13. _He is 11._ You have no idea how to not sound like a disingenuous creep, do you? ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227/100 "2010-02-16T20:58:35Z")
> [@Myrnalene](#): > > Diosa and bucketybuck, are you really so addle-brained that you cannot tell the difference between speaking about something objectionable in public that a child may hear or read, and specifically targeting that child as the recipient of such material? A) The kid is old enough to read and post on the internet. B) The kid’s parents ought at this point in his life be taking responsibility for who the kid talks to privately about what. C) Most relevantly to me–I know scores of people who were reading similarly graphically awful things at that age–hell, I was 12 when I plowed through Mission Earth and its gratuitous depictions of BDSM, rape by any number of methods, and generally rampantly juvenile depictions of sexuality (and worse, all done for the sake of humor rather than literary merit). Hell, at 13, I was coming up with some pretty awful shit on my own. Boys his age are the filthiest motherfuckers on the planet. Yeah, it’s a book about a kid being forced to be a sex slave. Yes, it’s graphic. So fucking what, it’s on library shelves the world over. And remember Delaney writes a lot of sci-fi with some damn good ideas–I could have with just a bit of different luck stumbled across this instead of the L. Ron Hubbard I was filling my days with at that age. I’m not going to say it was the SMARTEST thing Argent has ever done, but specifically the bullshit about pedophilia and grooming that I’m seeing in this thread is such overblown hysteria that I can’t take it seriously. Also: Lighten the hell up about the language rules already. Ed being a toolbox concerning language use has no bearing on the acceptable topics on this board, and saying shit like “we’re prudes about language but OMG PEDOS” makes you look like a goddamn idiot. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argent-towers-a-moment-of-your-time/529227.md?page=6)