# Argo: Good Film, Not Great Film \[Argo reviews thread\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 13, 2012, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627 "2012-10-13T17:06:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/61 "2013-02-25T14:11:00Z")
Merged duplicate threads. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/62 "2013-02-25T14:11:27Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > ["Am I the only one who..." - Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=682515) When I posted this, the thread title was “Am I the only one who thought Argo wasn’t that good?” Damn mods, ruining the joke. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![BrokenBriton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/63 "2013-02-25T14:16:51Z")
LOL. If anyone takes the Oscars at all seriously, here’s another wake up call. Quite the absurd decision. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/64 "2013-02-25T14:45:07Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > It was entertaining, but more fiction than not. If it weren’t fiction, it would have been nominated in a different category. Of course it was fiction. “Based on a true story” does not equal “Documentary.” > [@BrokenBriton](#): > > LOL. If anyone takes the Oscars at all seriously, here’s another wake up call. Quite the absurd decision. I disagree. I saw 8 of the best picture nominees, and although I would have been happy with a win for any of several of them, _Argo_ really was my favorite. _Zero Dark Thirty_, for example, may have been more historically accurate, but it had me looking at my watch half way through and really not caring about what happened to anyone. Wait, I take that back; I started to sympathize with the terrorists. On the other hand, even though I knew how _Argo_ was going to end, I found it engrossing and entertaining. Plus I thought they did a tremendous job of capturing the era of 1979-1980: the music, the cinematography, the costumes. If you watched that movie without knowing when it was made it would be very easy to believe it was made in the 1980s. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/65 "2013-02-25T14:49:54Z")
I thought Argo was great and deserved every award it received, and Affleck should have not only been nominated for Best Director, but he should have won it also. I saw a majority of the nominees this year and it’s the film I’d give the statue to if I were a voter, with Life of Pi and Silver Linings Playbook both near the top of the list as well. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/66 "2013-02-25T14:52:39Z")
All I know about the film is that it has a lot of Canadians upset because it downplays Canada’s roll in freeing the dignitaries. I haven’t seen the film, but apparently they make it out to be a CIA job supported by Canada, when in fact Canada, and especially Ken Taylor, were 100% responsible. ETA: I see **Northern Piper** is on board with this. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/67 "2013-02-25T15:16:30Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > All I know about the film is that it has a lot of Canadians upset because it downplays Canada’s roll in freeing the dignitaries. > > I haven’t seen the film, but apparently they make it out to be a CIA job supported by Canada, when in fact Canada, and especially Ken Taylor, were 100% responsible. > > ETA: I see **Northern Piper** is on board with this. I just watched an hour long special on the “Real” story of Argo with interviews with Mendez, and several of the American’s that were rescued. One of the things they talked about was that after the operation was over, the CIA asked Ken Taylor to take full credit and all public accolades for the mission, which he did. This was to protect their ability to carry out a similar mission in the future or something. They also told the rescued Americans that even though they may want to, they shouldn’t write a book about their experience. Surprisingly, they all kept their word on that count. So while the Canadian government was certainly a huge player in this mission, the CIA was also there hand-in-hand, I’d say 50/50. Views that Ken Taylor and the Canadians are getting the short end of the stick in the retelling is probably because of the way Taylor and others went out of their way to purposefully take full-credit at the time. The special showed a clip of Reagan giving Taylor an award, and one of the interviewees mentioned that Reagan probably didn’t even know the full story of the US’s involvement in the rescue. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/68 "2013-02-25T15:24:25Z")
I’m not particularly concerned with whether the historical details were correct or not - it’s like complaining about the bad history in _Braveheart_. Besides, I thought the movie did a fairly good job at presenting Taylor as responsible for keeping the embassy workers safe at no small personal risk to himself. Maybe Canada played a bigger role in the rescue - and maybe their role in real life was exaggerated to protect the CIA. Either way it doesn’t make the move more or less worthy of acclaim; the movie stands on it’s own by what’s in the film. ---
**Author:** ![newcomer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e5b9ba/32.png) [@newcomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newcomer)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/69 "2013-02-25T15:35:32Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Lots of Canadians. This is more of a complaint than a critical review of a film. However, I have two major issues with it and one is slightly related to the “complaint by Canadians” about the veracity of the whole story. With this argument I will also observe why “Lincoln” is - when judged from what I consider to be a merit of work of art – a much better film. Also, I’m at work so I don’t have time to re-read this and fix (like I ever do – lol) so it may come across as raw and unfinished so apologies for that. One of the key laws of dramatic arts to which film – along with literature and plays – subscribes goes like this: “persons represented should be, in consequence of actions proper to their characters, and owing to a natural course of events, placed in positions requiring them to struggle with the surrounding world to which they find themselves in opposition, and in this struggle should display their inherent qualities”. “Argo” has put this law upside down and allowed a change in the plot of significant amplitude and as a result it placed under-developed character into a set of actions and surroundings such that the character itself lost that feeling of natural course of events and presented a struggle which a lowly character simply could not overcome. The character simply was not up to demands of the plot and it fails flat most of the time. Every film is testing your suspension of belief but at one point a film has to settle on is it an attempt of realistic (as in natural) or is it a fantasy of some sort – this film walks that line like a DUI driver. Add to that quite uninspired performance by Ben Affleck and it becomes very difficult to see more than set of dialog zingers that can fit in 3 minute trailer. In “Lincoln” – while we acknowledge certain artistic freedoms of character composition and aggregation typical in historical movies of this magnitude (e.g. “Amistad”) – the character is not only fully developed and mature to face the course of events, in fact, it is the main character that drives most of the action and attends to it if it goes off route. Throughout the film, we are not told of Lincoln’s qualities, we rather see in his interactions with others, in group as well as one on one, of his inherent qualities and they are only accentuated by the dialog but convincingly cemented by action outcome. Every time a character is placed in a situation arbitrarily as it is in “Argo” the flow of a dramatic course thus affected creates a creature that limps in and out of our imagination. On the other hand, while Lincoln has only one horse riding scene, in our imagination he is on a horse at all times. The other important element of a successful work of dramatic art including film is the “individuality of language; i.e. the style of speech of every person being natural to his character”. In “Argo” almost all of the characters speak in the similar language further exemplified by so called “snappy dialogs” that, as marketing researchers’ suggestion goes, apparently is the norm in a fast-paced tech society we now live in so if any dialog has more depth or subtlety it will fly over people’s heads and all that fine artistic effort will be in vain. So, cut the dialog is the new mantra. Once you reduce dialog to slogans the only way to fill in the space is screaming hordes of locals and…. well, lots of explosions. I could go on and on about “individuality of the language” in “Lincoln” but that would be too obvious so I’ll just leave it there. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/70 "2013-02-25T15:38:06Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > I haven’t seen the film, but apparently they make it out to be a CIA job supported by Canada, when in fact Canada, and especially Ken Taylor, were 100% responsible. The Discovery Channel just ran a documentary (featuring Mendez) in which it said that Ken Taylor and the Canadian authorities took full credit at the time, by agreement, out of fear that Iran would have retaliated against the other hostages if the operation had been exposed as CIA activity. This program emphasized contributions from both countries. Taylor took the escapees in, at great personal risk. Mendez conceived of the movie-making idea. Canada’s Parliament met in secret to authorize the issuance of fake passports. President Carter approved the mission. Mendez went in, prepped the escapees, and led them out via the airport and Swissair. I have no way of judging the accuracy of this program and whether it too unfairly downplays Canadian actions. ETA: Ninjaed by **Bob Ducca**. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/71 "2013-02-25T16:02:02Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > Canada’s Parliament met in secret to authorize the issuance of fake passports. That seems doubtful to me, for two reasons. First, passports are issued under the royal prerogative, not under statutory authority, so as a matter of law, I don’t see the need for Parliament’s involvement. Second, Parliament has around 400 members. It doesn’t sound likely that in a matter where complete confidentiality is needed to protect lives, Parliament would sit. The risk of a leak would be too great. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/72 "2013-02-25T16:18:13Z")
I presume that law in Canada grants the issuing authority discretion in who to issue passport and the government the power to waive certain requirements in some cases. ---
**Author:** ![Kepler1571](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/db5fbb/32.png) [@Kepler1571](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kepler1571)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/73 "2013-02-25T16:18:48Z")
Man, I just don’t get the love for “Argo.” I thought it was unremarkable. Great idea, pedestrian execution, paint by numbers script. Nothing atrocious, solid B. But not even nomination worthy, let alone winning, unless as a purely political gesture. ---
**Author:** ![Kepler1571](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/db5fbb/32.png) [@Kepler1571](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kepler1571)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/74 "2013-02-25T16:20:44Z")
> [@DMark](#): > > We saw the film Argo yesterday. > > We thought the film was good, but I don’t think Ben Affleck needs to clear any room on his shelf for Oscars. > > Part of the problem is, if you saw the trailers and know even a tad bit about history, you know exactly what happens in this film. Now granted, just knowing how a film ends is not a deal breaker - I think most people knew the Titanic was not going to be a film about a happy pleasure cruise - and that film scooped up plenty of Oscars. > > In Argo, the story kind of fell flat - there really were no great surprises, no real sense of urgent “will they or won’t they” escape, and the “action” scenes were mostly crowds of protestors burning American flags in the streets of Tehran. > > The set up was kind of cool - the Hollywood back story was the most fun. But the actual scenes of the six hostages in the Canadian Embassy in Iran were surprisingly boring. You barely got to know the six people, which means you really were not all that invested in their release. To be honest, they mostly came across as very annoying house guests rather than desperate hostages. > > Their actual escape had a few moments of mild excitement and thrills - but once again, even this was subdued by the fact that you knew it ended well. > > If I had been the script reader, I would have pushed for more of the fun Hollywood story, and then have them at least flesh out the stories of the six hostages a bit better so you gave a damn if they lived or died. The acting was decent, but Ben Affleck played dour throughout, and as director/star and producer, he was pretty much in every scene. > > So the film was good - it accomplished what it meant to accomplish - but it just missed any great insight, or twist, or great action adventure. As an audience member, you will get what you paid for and what you probably expected from the story - but sadly, nothing more. I should have read this before posting. This was exactly my reaction to the film. Meh. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/75 "2013-02-25T16:34:22Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > I presume that law in Canada grants the issuing authority discretion in who to issue passport and the government the power to waive certain requirements in some cases. As a purely conceptual-legal question, this makes me wonder something.\* What’s the definition of a fake passport in Iran, and could Parliament have gotten around that definition by authorizing the “fake passports” using just the right language? I’m thinking something like, unilaterally declaring the six Americans to be Canadian citizens, only to take their citizenship away again once the operation was over. \*Something which I know would have no real-world legal applications, because if Iran wants to hang you and you’re in their borders I’m guessing they find a way. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/76 "2013-02-25T16:49:58Z")
I thought Argo was good, just not quite as good as advertised. The tension in the Iranian revolution scenes was great, the cast was excellent, and John Goodman seemed to be having a ball. But by the middle of the movie it turned into a formulaic heist film (a good one, but still) and the ending at the airport was obviously fiction. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/77 "2013-02-25T16:51:35Z")
> [@Kepler1571](#): > > Man, I just don’t get the love for “Argo.” I thought it was unremarkable. Great idea, pedestrian execution, paint by numbers script. Nothing atrocious, solid B. But not even nomination worthy, let alone winning, unless as a purely political gesture. That’s what I thought too. Entertaining, B/B+. Not a best picture. I mean, I’m glad any time Spielberg doesn’t win, but that was the only reason I was glad. ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/78 "2013-02-25T16:52:37Z")
> [@DMark](#): > > …I don’t think Ben Affleck needs to clear any room on his shelf for Oscars. **OK, so on the above point I was seriously wrong.** Otherwise, I am sticking to my original OP review and saying this film was good but not great - and\* most certainly not Oscar worthy\*. I am convinced a lot of the vote was sympathy vote because Ben was snubbed in the Best Director category. This is the equivalent of giving little Timmy an “A” in his third grade science project because his dog, Lassie, died and everyone feels sorry for him. Nice gesture for the kid, but not deserved upon merit. BTW, I wasn’t in an Oscar office pool this year, but I would have killed - I saw Argo winning a few weeks ago as the tide started to shift with this sympathy vote. To win a pot of money in an office pool, I too would have voted Argo as most likely to win, Oh well, it won’t be the first Best Film award that got it wrong, and I am sure it won’t be the last. I will lose no sleep over this - but I am fairly certain that in a year, five years and 10+ years, people will look back and say, “Why in the hell did that film win the Oscar?!” ---
**Author:** ![BrokenBriton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/79 "2013-02-25T16:54:34Z")
> [@Kepler1571](#): > > Man, I just don’t get the love for “Argo.” I thought it was unremarkable. Great idea, pedestrian execution, paint by numbers script. Nothing atrocious, solid B. But not even nomination worthy, let alone winning, unless as a purely political gesture. Indeed. No dimension, no art. ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2013, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627/80 "2013-02-25T17:01:09Z")
So all those other awards that Affleck has been winning at all the other ceremonies - all of them are because those groups felt bad that he was snubbed a Best Director nomination for a movie of average merit? Sorry, I think you’re just out of touch. I thought this was a fine movie to win (I could have gone with _Lincoln_ or _Pi_ as well) and many critics and industry people agreed - not limited to just the academy voters. You didn’t see it and that’s fine but don’t try to dismiss the win by claiming it’s some kind of pity vote. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/argo-good-film-not-great-film-argo-reviews-thread/637627.md?page=5)