# Arm teachers with guns. What could possibly go wrong? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 28, 2018, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784 "2018-02-28T22:37:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/41 "2018-03-04T16:35:42Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Well, that’s a good deal for the Shelter-in-Place Company, anyway. I’m not sure it is much of a solution in terms of _preventing unstable people to gain access to firearms and shoot at unarmed and unsuspecting people in public spaces_. But while it consumes classroom space to no otherwise useful purpose and cultivates a sense of fear and paranoia that is normally reserved for the creations of H.P. Lovecraft, at least it does not introduce new potential hazards to the classroom. > > Stranger Unless they’re airtight. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/42 "2018-03-04T16:37:30Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Unless they’re airtight. It seems it would be easier, cheaper, and less obtrusive to armor the doors to the room. Faster to close and lock the door than to herd the classroom into the bulletproof shelter as well. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/43 "2018-03-04T17:40:48Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Unless they’re airtight. “Look, it’s a totally understandable oversight, and let’s just thank Jesus and Blake Shelton that this issue was caught after only just a few hundred accidental suffocations. God Bless America and the Winchester Repeating Rifle for making this country great!” Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/44 "2018-03-04T18:20:19Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Unless they’re airtight. You would address this problem with racks of loaded high-powered rifles in school corridors, powerful enough to allow rescuers to shoot holes in the refuges to let air in. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/45 "2018-03-04T18:23:34Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > You would address this problem with racks of loaded high-powered rifles in school corridors, powerful enough to allow rescuers to shoot holes in the refuges to let air in. I had to read that twice before I realized that you spelled refuges with just one ‘e’. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/46 "2018-03-04T18:31:42Z")
At least suffocation deaths are not as messy as shooting deaths. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/47 "2018-03-04T19:03:59Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Unless they’re airtight. Well, that could be a bonus if the school decides the proper response to a fire alarm being pulled (as the shooter did in Parkland) is to move into the shelter. No smoke inhalation damage in case it really is a fire and not a shooter. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2018, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/48 "2018-03-04T22:58:22Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > At least suffocation deaths are not as messy as shooting deaths. While they don’t involved as much exudate of bodily fluids, it’s still pretty ugly. I’m not going to link to pictures because I don’t need to see any more of that, but it’s not a easy death. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2018, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/49 "2018-03-14T09:38:58Z")
Gosh, I wonder [what could go wrong](http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-seaside-high-school-gun-20180313-story.html)? (Teacher accidentally fires gun during safety lecture at Monterey County high school) ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2018, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/50 "2018-03-14T14:31:58Z")
You guys are just cherry picking the few negative stories about arming teachers. Why aren’t you posting all the positive stories, huh? :smack:😃 ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2018, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/51 "2018-03-14T15:33:22Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Did we? For lockdown practice my kids have always taken that as seriously as I ever took a duck and cover exercise. And the few true lockdowns they have had have proven to them that lockdowns aren’t serious either since no one got hurt and it was the school overreacting. (I think my daughter has been through four true lockdowns, my son three.) Oh, I had guns on my bus in elementary school. Armed Federal Marshalls - the heydey of integration in the South. So yeah, I’m not sure how different it is today when my parents were told that the buses were swept for bombs before leaving the bus barn. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2018, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/52 "2018-03-14T17:09:54Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > Gosh, I wonder [what could go wrong](http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-seaside-high-school-gun-20180313-story.html)? > > (Teacher accidentally fires gun during safety lecture at Monterey County high school) Not just a teacher. Also a reserve police officer, who is likely to be more competent with guns than your average teacher. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/53 "2018-04-12T16:12:21Z")
Yet another thing that [could go wrong](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43733755) (Parkland teacher, advocate of arming teachers, leaves gun in public lavatory, found and fired by [del]drunk[/del] homeless person.) ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/54 "2018-04-12T16:40:26Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > Yet another thing that [could go wrong](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43733755) > > (Parkland teacher, advocate of arming teachers, leaves gun in public lavatory, found and fired by [del]drunk[/del] homeless person.) It’s been a whole two months though. If you extrapolate that out, then that means that your average armed teacher is only going to have an incident about that often. Remove a few months for summer and winter break, and you are down to just 4 incidents a year per teacher. There being about 100k schools, with 3.2 million teachers. If we have one gun in each school, then we will have a paltry 400,000 firearm related incidents in schools a year. If you figure 20% of teachers armed, a benchmark that’s been thrown about, that’d be barely more than two and a half million incidents a year, nothing, really. As the famed Doctor Necessiter says, “If the murder of twelve innocent people can help save one human life, it will have been worth it!” ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/55 "2018-04-12T16:46:01Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Also a reserve police officer, who is likely to be more competent with guns than your average teacher. One would think so, but the contrary evidence keeps piling up. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/56 "2018-04-12T17:05:20Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > There being about 100k schools, with 3.2 million teachers. If we have one gun in each school, then we will have a paltry 400,000 firearm related incidents in schools a year. If you figure 20% of teachers armed, a benchmark that’s been thrown about, that’d be barely more than two and a half million incidents a year, nothing, really. As the famed Doctor Necessiter says, “If the murder of twelve innocent people can help save one human life, it will have been worth it!” Yeah, but you are not taking into account the positives. During a school shooting, a good kid could find a gun lying around that a teacher forgot and then use that gun to take out the school shooter. You just look at negatives all the time. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/57 "2018-04-12T17:22:06Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > It’s been a whole two months though. If you extrapolate that out, then that means that your average armed teacher is only going to have an incident about that often. Remove a few months for summer and winter break, and you are down to just 4 incidents a year per teacher. > > There being about 100k schools, with 3.2 million teachers. If we have one gun in each school, then we will have a paltry 400,000 firearm related incidents in schools a year. If you figure 20% of teachers armed, a benchmark that’s been thrown about, that’d be barely more than two and a half million incidents a year, nothing, really. As the famed Doctor Necessiter says, “If the murder of twelve innocent people can help save one human life, it will have been worth it!” Why do you try to make these goofy half-baked extrapolations from one incident? They’re not very convincing. Utah has had armed teachers for years now, and hasn’t seen anything even remotely close to the rate of incidents you are imagining. ETA: “your average armed teacher” has nowhere near “4 incidents a year” ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/58 "2018-04-12T17:27:53Z")
The humans call it _sarcasm_. ---
**Author:** ![Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/59 "2018-04-12T17:42:28Z")
At some point I’d like to run simulations of mass shootings for people who think arming everyone is a good idea. I’d warn everyone in advance first, telling them that at some point in the next week there would be a real-time simulation that would probably last less than 3 minutes. People just have no idea how little time a mass shooting takes from start to finish – and don’t realize that even if they begin with police officers at the scene, innocent people still get shot and killed. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2018, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784/60 "2018-04-12T17:49:13Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Why do you try to make these goofy half-baked extrapolations from one incident? They’re not very convincing. Utah has had armed teachers for years now, and hasn’t seen anything even remotely close to the rate of incidents you are imagining. > > ETA: “your average armed teacher” has nowhere near “4 incidents a year” It was not meant to be take all that seriously. If it had been some random teacher somewhere, it would simply be a data point. As it is one of the people specifically advocating for arming teachers though, it has a bit more relevance. You would think that he would be holding himself as an example of one of the responsible ones. Still no stats on how many teachers in Utah are armed, yet? Still somewhere between 0 and 100%? without knowing that, it’s hard to get a handle on what the rate is. ETA: You also only hear about incidents like this when something happens. If a teacher leaves their gun in a bathroom, and another teacher picks it up and hands it to them, that is an incident, just not one that anyone ever hears about. Hard to get solid stats on that as well, but I guarantee it is higher than 0. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arm-teachers-with-guns-what-could-possibly-go-wrong/809784.md?page=4)