# Armando Galarraga: A Perfect Solution is to Make it Perfect **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 3, 2010, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769 "2010-06-03T14:24:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/21 "2010-06-03T17:04:09Z")
Did he blow the call? Yes. Should it be overturned? No. Sucks that it costs gallaraga a perfect game, but umps are something baseball has to live with. No instant replays, no re-dos. Suck it up and keep playing. besides, as noted, Gallaraga’s class response will make him more famous in the long run than pitching a perfect game would have. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/22 "2010-06-03T17:24:48Z")
The people who don’t want to changed reasoning: That’s just the way it has to be. My response: Why? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/23 "2010-06-03T17:30:57Z")
Slippery slope, for one thing. Plus there is nothing in the rule book allowing it. “For the good of baseball” doesn’t cut it. If you want to change the rules so that things like this can be dealt with **in the future** , that’s a different issue. But as it stands now, with the game over and done with, the call stands. Doesn’t matter if every person in the world knows the call was wrong (and they do!). It stands. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/24 "2010-06-03T17:37:03Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > If there isn’t one, there should be some sort of rule that gives the Commish sole discretion to rule on calls like this post facto when that ruling has no effect on the outcome of the game. So, if that blown call had led to a 4-run rally that won the game for the Indians, then it’s too bad–can’t go in and have a re-do, unless it’s a legitimate protest over as misapplication of a rule (which would exclude judgment calls). But that didn’t happen here. > > And I’m a baseball purist. But I was just sick for that pitcher, for the Tigers, for the fans, even for the umpire when I heard him talk about it. I don’t think I could muster any righteous indignation over “the rules” if they somehow found a reason to overturn this one. Ditto. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/25 "2010-06-03T17:42:46Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > The people who don’t want to changed reasoning: That’s just the way it has to be. > > My response: Why? You’ve got this slightly wrong. The people who don’t want it to be changed reasoning: this is the way it is. It already is this way. It didn’t have to be, but now that the events are over, it is this way. Your question then more properly becomes “why can’t it be different?” I think **silenus** covered that pretty well, but let me put it to you this way: why not just re-do all the stats for things that wouldn’t have affected the win/loss outcome of a game? Surely lots of people would have improved stats after that, and maybe even a couple would get in the record books for something. Isn’t that enough reason to re-do things that wouldn’t have changed who won or lost a game anyway? I mean, who really cares about whether or not the rules have any integrity, as long as some folks have killer stats? In other words, are you ready to see your advocacy broadened to include other similar events and actions? Or are you just advocating a one-time exception, and anyone else who feels similarly wronged just has to deal with it? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/26 "2010-06-03T17:44:36Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > “For the good of baseball” doesn’t cut it. I disagree. The decision would create good will and deflect the abuse and criticisms that umpires receive. It would be a feel-good story and since when is feeling good not, well, for the good? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/27 "2010-06-03T17:46:31Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > In other words, are you ready to see your advocacy broadened to include other similar events and actions? Or are you just advocating a one-time exception, and anyone else who feels similarly wronged just has to deal with it? All situations are created fifferently. How about if a player gets 26 outs and the 27th out is clearly made but ruled a non-out on an obviously blown call that everyone including the umpire concedes that the Commissioner can overturn the call. Deal? ---
**Author:** ![Ruminator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Ruminator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruminator)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/28 "2010-06-03T17:48:18Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > I disagree. The decision would create good will and deflect the abuse and criticisms that umpires receive. It would be a feel-good story and since when is feeling good not, well, for the good? But it would also be disrespectful to all the previous players and teams that lived with all the bad calls that weren’t reversed in the last 100 years of baseball. Whether the bad call determines the winner/loser or simply hurts a player’s statistics, the bad call is a part of the game. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/29 "2010-06-03T17:49:56Z")
By that reasoning we should overturn every court case in the last year. That would create good will (among criminals) and deflect the abuse and criticisms the cops, lawyers and judges receive. “Life is pain. Anybody who tells you different is selling something.” ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/30 "2010-06-03T18:03:23Z")
Whatever Bud Selig decides will almost certainly be wrong. Remember, this is the guy who brought you a [tied All-Star game](http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/2002/allstar/news/2002/07/09/allstar_game_ap/). Selig is probably the least competent MLB Commissioner ever. \* This is, of course, merely my opinion and does not reflect the opinion of Major League Baseball, its fans, stockholders, lawyers or Satanic emissaries.\* ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/31 "2010-06-03T18:05:27Z")
Out of curiosity, did he continue pitching and get the 28th batter out? ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/32 "2010-06-03T18:11:09Z")
Yes. A ground out from the next batter. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/33 "2010-06-03T18:24:51Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > All situations are created fifferently. How about if a player gets 26 outs and the 27th out is clearly made but ruled a non-out on an obviously blown call that everyone including the umpire concedes that the Commissioner can overturn the call. > > Deal? So you are just creating a one-time exception, or are you looking to do this a lot? If one-time, why just this and not that? Or that other thing? If you want to review every play in the history of MLB, and maybe change rulings as you see fit, well, I think you’re gonna have a hard sell on that plan. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/34 "2010-06-03T19:07:03Z")
This is an argument about the definition of a baseball statistic. MLB could restrict its decision to the statistic itself, and other past statistics could be adjusted based on the circumstances. I’m not taking that side myself, but it doesn’t seem to be unreasonable, and I don’t think it would shake the foundations of America’s Pastime. Changing the outcome of the game would be a very different circumstance. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/35 "2010-06-03T19:25:18Z")
Reminder: If the call had been made correctly, the game would be over at that point. Over. The bad call came after the game was already over. A correction of it would not affect that in any way except to correct the scoring of Donald’s groundout and to wipe out Crowe’s AB. But scoring changes like that get made routinely already, even days later, and even when the play was blatantly an error and not a hit ;). Sportsmanship requires respect for officials’ calls, certainly, even when they’re of the pine-tar variety. But the official himself, also acting in the principle of sportsmanship has been as public as anyone about saying what the right call would have been. Sportsmanship requires respect for players, too. Either way, sportsmanship requires reversing the call. It is only rarely possible, sure, but this is such a case. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/36 "2010-06-03T19:26:11Z")
[Selig makes the right call](http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2010/06/02/detroit-tigers-pitcher-loses-perfect-game-blown/). The earth shifts on its axis. ---
**Author:** ![howye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9adbd/32.png) [@howye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/howye)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/37 "2010-06-03T19:42:37Z")
Why should anything be changed? Why is the 27th batter different than the first? Will the commissoner now review every pitch of a game that has 2 or fewer hits? The call was bad, the pitcher had a perfect game broken up by the call. Boo-hoo. Nothing will ever change that. There was no celebration on the field, no triumph or glory. Changing the stat sheet does not replace that. Galarraga knows that changing things now turns him into a trivia question, and not in a good way. People who are saying the call should be changed afterwards and that they feel so bad for Galarraga, come off as the same type of people who don’t want to keep score at their kids little league games. It sucks, its sad, and life is like that. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/38 "2010-06-03T20:48:46Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Reminder: If the call had been made correctly, the game would be over at that point. Over. The bad call came after the game was already over. A correction of it would not affect that in any way except to correct the scoring of Donald’s groundout and to wipe out Crowe’s AB. But scoring changes like that get made routinely already, even days later, and even when the play was blatantly an error and not a hit ;). > > Sportsmanship requires respect for officials’ calls, certainly, even when they’re of the pine-tar variety. But the official himself, also acting in the principle of sportsmanship has been as public as anyone about saying what the right call would have been. Sportsmanship requires respect for players, too. Either way, sportsmanship requires reversing the call. It is only rarely possible, sure, but this is such a case. Nonsense, the final call is just as integral a part of the game as the first call. The game wasn’t “over” before the bad call, any more than a basketball game is over when the buzzer sounds between the time the player throws up a desperation shot and it goes through the hoop. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/39 "2010-06-03T21:48:06Z")
> [@howye](#): > > Why should anything be changed? Why is the 27th batter different than the first? Will the commissoner now review every pitch of a game that has 2 or fewer hits? > > The call was bad, the pitcher had a perfect game broken up by the call. Boo-hoo. Nothing will ever change that. There was no celebration on the field, no triumph or glory. Changing the stat sheet does not replace that. Galarraga knows that changing things now turns him into a trivia question, and not in a good way. > > People who are saying the call should be changed afterwards and that they feel so bad for Galarraga, come off as the same type of people who don’t want to keep score at their kids little league games. It sucks, its sad, and life is like that. The 27th out is different than the first. When a guy has a no hitter going, the umps generally give him the close calls. They want the hit that ends it to be deserved. Pressure is on the umps from the 7th inning on to be very careful. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2010, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769/40 "2010-06-03T21:49:44Z")
I’m not a huge baseball fan, so feel free to disregard my views, but I come down in favor of not-changing the call. . The rules to baseball are as they are and part of those rules are umpire calls. To change this is to change the game as it stands now, and so Galarraga could have his perfect game according to some game, but not according to 2010 rules major league baseball. Yes it really sucks for Mr. Galarraga, and his loss of the perfect game is not his fault, but on the other hand many other things that go into a perfect game are beyond the control of the pitcher. If the player throwing to first base had been a split second slower then it would also nullify the perfect game due to no fault of Galarraga. I would also wonder what those who are in favor of changing the call would do if, the base runner had been actually safe barely, but erroneously called out. Would they be demanding that Galarraga be stripped of his perfect game? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armando-galarraga-a-perfect-solution-is-to-make-it-perfect/541769.md?page=3)