# Armenian terrorists? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 13, 2002, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611 "2002-12-13T21:22:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2002, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/1 "2002-12-13T21:22:15Z")
The immigration law firm I work for has just gotten unofficial word that Pakistanis, Saudis, and Armenians will be added shortly to the list of countries whose nationals will be required to register with the INS (the requirement does not apply to permanent residents, U.S. citizens, asylum applicants/refugees, or diplomats). I’ll dig up details on this relatively new regulation if anyone’s dying to see them. This seems weird to me. Until now, the list had included only countries that were predominantly Arab and/or Muslim. Ethnic Armenians are overwhelmingly Christian (they have their own Christian church, one of the oldest in the world), and although there are some non-ethnic Armenians who are citizens of Armenia, relatively few of them are Muslims. I’ve seen no evidence that Armenian nationals have ever been involved in an act of terrorism against Americans, or even that they overstay or violate the terms of their U.S. visas more frequently than other similarly situated groups. So why are they being added to the list? Am I missing something? ---
**Author:** ![Greg\_Charles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/839c29/32.png) [@Greg\_Charles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greg_Charles)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2002, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/2 "2002-12-13T21:43:07Z")
I’m a quarter Armenian, so I wonder if I’m under suspicion. One of my relatives was once detained at the Istanbul Airport, because the Turks had got some wind of Armenian terrorists extracting some revenge for the genocide early this century, and the continued Turkish occupation of Armenian land. The funny thing is it wasn’t even one of my Armenian relatives. Her surname (by marriage) was Brian, and they were detaining anyone with names ending with -ian. Anyway, as far as I know, we have no grudge against America. We love our adopted country. U-S-A! U-S-A!! Security policies don’t always make sense. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/3 "2002-12-17T23:16:42Z")
[bump] Well, someone Up There apparently was just as confused as I was, because we got word today that Armenians will be removed fromt he list. What I still don’t get is why they were ever on the list to begin with. Any theories? ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/4 "2002-12-17T23:30:28Z")
> [@](#): > > What I still don’t get is why they were ever on the list to begin with. Any theories? “Well, all them Ay-rabs are Moslems that hate us, anyway, so let’s list them all!” :rolleyes: I’ve seen and heard enough of this attitude from people who really ought to know better to be fairly sure some mid-level authority decided something along that line. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/5 "2002-12-17T23:31:42Z")
Nagorno-Karabakh, maybe? There have been both Azeri and Armenian terrorists because of this issue, not against the US, though. ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/6 "2002-12-17T23:33:47Z")
Yep. [http://www.turkishpress.com/turkishpress/news.asp?ID=7741](http://www.turkishpress.com/turkishpress/news.asp?ID=7741) > [@](#): > > Armenian Terrorist May Be Released On Condition > > Anadolu Agency: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 > > WASHINGTON D.C. - Armenian terrorist Hampig Sasunyan, currently under trial in the United States, for the first time confessed at the court that he had murdered Kemal Arikan, Turkey’s Consul General in Los Angeles. Thus, Sasunyan got the chance to be released in 2007 over his good conduct. Somebody at the DOJ saw the words “ARMENIAN TERRORIST!!” on GoogleNews and added Armenians to the list. And then somebody even higher up noticed that he’s not a real world-devouring Al Qaeda-type terrorist, only a sort of plain vanilla homegrown terrorist, so the DOJ went, “…oh…”, and took Armenians off the list. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/7 "2002-12-18T00:48:56Z")
First part a pure, useless, twinkie hijack of dubious interest to anyone but me: Years ago my father ( who is 100% Serb, by the by ) had to get his passport picture retaken because my stepmother refused to let him use the first one, because she said “it made him look like an Armenian terrorist”. Which it did - Whatever the heck they look like :D. I kept that glowery shot taken in a cheap, Eastern European secret police-looking suit that made him look like a dangerous thug in my wallet for years until it fell apart, because it tickled me so ;). More seriously at one time there was an Armenian pseudo-Marxist/nationalist terror group in Turkey called the 3rd October Organization that apparently had some ties to some of the PLO splinter factions. Don’t know how active they currently are. Here they be: [http://library.nps.navy.mil/home/tgp/armenian.htm](http://library.nps.navy.mil/home/tgp/armenian.htm) - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![Dragonblink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Dragonblink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dragonblink)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/8 "2002-12-18T02:17:30Z")
Man, there’s gonna be riots in Glendale, CA … ---
**Author:** ![Neidhart](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Neidhart](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neidhart)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/9 "2002-12-18T03:01:50Z")
Calling [Serdar Argic . . .](http://www.jaedworks.com/shoebox/serdar-eye.html) ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/10 "2002-12-18T03:19:05Z")
Maybe somebody at the INS rented a copy of “Tune In Tomorrow.” It’s an old flick with Peter Falk and Keanu Reeves (score by Winton Marsalis.) The Peter Falk character has a lot of rude things to say about Armenians. It turns out he’s just doing it to rile people up. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/11 "2002-12-18T03:32:06Z")
> [@](#): > > Maybe somebody at the INS rented a copy of “Tune In Tomorrow.” It’s an old flick with Peter Falk and Keanu Reeves (score by Winton Marsalis.) The Peter Falk character has a lot of rude things to say about Armenians. It turns out he’s just doing it to rile people up. Close, but no cigar. It’s **Albanians** Falk’s character is obsessed with :). In the novel it was based on, it is apparently Bolivians that get the honor. Dunno why the change. Are Albanians funnier than Bolivians ;)? Apparently both are funnier than Armenians :D. - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/12 "2002-12-18T15:15:41Z")
Well, I hope nobody thinks Armenians are terrorists in general, because I get mistaken for Armenian all the time…it’s that swarthy quasi-Middle Eastern thing, I guess (I’m a nice Jewish girl from New Jersey, albeit of East European stock). The Armenians I used to meet in Russia would tell me that the Armenians are really just one of the Lost Tribes, and that Noah’s Ark is actually buried in the side of Mt. Ararat. Whenever I tried to buy fresh produce from some little old Armenian lady at a Russian open-air market, she would give me a big hug and all sorts of freebies. Come to think of it, maybe THAT’s why I always get searched in airports…they think I’m an Armenian, not a Palestinian! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/13 "2002-12-18T16:54:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Neidhart \* > \*\*Calling [Serdar Argic . . .](http://www.jaedworks.com/shoebox/serdar-eye.html) \*\* Serdar Argic … ah, that brings back memories. But shouldn’t it properly be spelled “S_rd_r Arg\*c” to avoid grepping? ---
**Author:** ![tiny\_ham](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a183cd/32.png) [@tiny\_ham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tiny_ham)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/14 "2002-12-18T17:00:20Z")
Armenians are…very often…SEXY AS ALL GET OUT. I don’t know why…but a good swarthy Armenian gets my blood going. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/15 "2002-12-18T17:07:37Z")
Well, \*\* jarbabyj\*\*, I would tend to concur…I have a thing for Caucasians in general (and I mean that in the original sense of the word). But that’s a whole other thread. You should check out the St. James Church annual Armenian festival in downtown Evanston every summer; great food, great music (hey, a Middle Eastern circle dance is a Middle Eastern circle dance, so I feel right at home), and more gorgeous swarthy Armenian men than you can shake a stick at…but I digress again… Anyway, it sems the Armenian community (predictably) took exception to being classified as terrorists. From today’s RFE/RL newsline ([www.rferl.org](http://www.rferl.org)): "ARMENIAN FOREIGN MINISTRY WELCOMES U.S. REVERSAL OF IMMIGRATION RESTRICTIONS The Armenian Foreign Ministry issued a statement on 17 December welcoming the decision by U.S. President George W. Bush’s administration to reverse a new measure requiring the registration of Armenian citizens with the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service, according to RFE/RL’s Yerevan bureau and Yerkir. The decision followed a flurry of activity by the politically active Armenian-American community, angered at the sudden inclusion on 13 December of Armenia in a list of countries subject to post-11 September 2001 restrictions on their citizens visiting the United States, that led to more than 10,000 notes of protest being directed to the White House. RG" ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/16 "2002-12-18T21:26:08Z")
Now the DOS is saying the designation of Armenians was erroneous to begin with. Gotta love our State Department: they’re the best and brightest, right? Ain’t it good to know INS knows who needs to be watched? Here’s an excerpt of the text of the rule (bolding mine): Immigration and Naturalization Service Registration of Certain Nonimmigrant Aliens From Designated Countries; Notice [[Page 77642]] DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE Immigration and Naturalization Service [AG Order No. 2638-2002] Registration of Certain Nonimmigrant Aliens from Designated Countries AGENCY: Immigration and Naturalization Service, Justice. ACTION: Notice. SUMMARY: This Notice requires certain nonimmigrant aliens to appear before, register with, and provide requested information to the Immigration and Naturalization Service on or before February 21, 2003. It applies to certain nonimmigrant aliens from one of the countries designated in this Notice who were last admitted to the United States on or before September 30, 2002, and who will remain in the United States after February 21, 2003. The specific requirements are set forth in the Notice. This Notice is applicable to certain nationals and citizens of Pakistan and Saudi Arabia who entered the United States on or before September 30, 2002, and who will remain in the United States after February 21, 2003. Aliens described in this Notice are required to register and provide additional information to the Immigration and Naturalization Service between January 13, 2003, and February 21, 2003, inclusive. **This Notice also rescinds an earlier Notice, Attorney General Order No. 2636-2002 of December 12, 2002, which appeared in the Federal Register on December 16, 2002 (67 FR 77136), and incorrectly listed Armenia as a designated country.** EFFECTIVE DATES: This Notice is effective on January 13, 2003. Aliens described in this Notice are required to register and provide additional information to the Immigration and Naturalization Service on or before February 21, 2003. FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT: Dan Brown, Office of the General Counsel, Immigration and Naturalization Service, 425 I Street, NW., Room 6100, Washington, DC 20536, telephone (202) 514-2895. SUPPLEMENTARY INFORMATION: Section 265(b) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (`Act''), as amended, 8 U.S.C. 1305(b), provides that [t]he Attorney General may in his discretion, upon ten days notice, require the natives of any one or more foreign states, or any class or group thereof, who are within the United States and who are required to be registered under this subchapter, to notify theAttorney General of their current addresses and furnish such additional information as the Attorney General may require. Additionally, section 263(a) of the Act, 8 U.S.C. 1303(a), provides that the Attorney General may `prescribe special regulations and forms for the registration and fingerprinting of \* \* \* aliens of any other class not lawfully admitted to the United States for permanent residence.’’ The Attorney General has previously exercised his authority under these and other provisions of the Act to establish special registration procedures under 8 CFR 264.1(f). 67 FR 52584 (Aug. 12, 2002). These requirements are known as the National Security Entry–Exit Registration System (`NSEERS''). In accordance with the authority set forth in 8 CFR 264.1(f)(4), the Attorney General has determined that certain nonimmigrant aliens specified in this Notice shall be registered and required to provide specific information. The Attorney General has the sole discretion to make this determination. Under this Notice certain nonimmigrant nationals or citizens of Pakistan and Saudi Arabia are required to appear at an Immigration and Naturalization Service (`Service’’) office to register under NSEERS and provide additional information. Previous Notices have applied to certain nonimmigrant nationals or citizens of Afghanistan, Algeria, Bahrain, Eritrea, Iran, Iraq, Lebanon, Libya, Morocco, North Korea, Oman, Qatar, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, Tunisia, United Arab Emirates, and Yemen. See 67 FR 67766 (Nov. 6, 2002); 67 FR 70526 (Nov. 22, 2002). In light of recent events, and based on intelligence information available to the Attorney General, the Attorney General has determined that the aliens described in paragraph (a) of this Notice must appear before the Service and provide certain information. This Notice applies only to certain nonimmigrant aliens from one of the countries designated in this Notice who were last admitted to the United States on or before September 30, 2002, and who will remain after February 21, 2003. Based on intelligence information available to the Attorney General, the Attorney General has determined that registering all nonimmigrant aliens from the covered countries would not enhance national security. Moreover, the Attorney General has determined that it would not be administratively feasible at the present time to register all of the nonimmigrants from the specific countries covered by this Notice, and that the delay occasioned by registering all nonimmigrants from the countries covered by this Notice would jeopardize the national security. Accordingly, the Attorney General has determined that only males aged 16 years or older need to be registered at this time. Furthermore, the Attorney General has determined that an alien who has an application for asylum pending on the date of publication of this Notice has already provided sufficient information in the application for asylum, along with fingerprints, to warrant exclusion from this Notice. Although section 265(b) of the Act, 8 U.S.C. 1305(b), provides a minimum period of 10 days notice for covered aliens to provide their current address and other required information, this Notice allows an alien described by the Notice a period of more than 30 days to register. The Attorney General has determined that such additional time to register is in the best interests of the United States and has extended this time to register solely as a matter of discretion. Finally, until further notice, once enrolled within NSEERS by registration under this Notice, an alien described in paragraph (a) of this Notice is required to register annually with the Service. All aliens described in paragraph (a) shall comply with all other provisions of 8 CFR 264.1(f)(5) through (f)(9). A willful failure to comply with the requirements of this Notice constitutes a failure to maintain nonimmigrant status under section 237(a)(1)©(i) of the Act, 8 U.S.C. 1227(a)(1)©(i). See 8 CFR 214.1(f). Pursuant to section 237(a)(3)(A) of the Act, 8 U.S.C. 1227(a)(3)(A), an alien who fails to comply with the provisions of this Notice is deportable, unless the alien establishes to the satisfaction of the Attorney General that such failure was reasonably excusable or was not willful. Finally, if an alien subject to this Notice fails, without good cause, to comply with the requirement in 8 CFR 264.1(f)(8) that the alien must report to an inspecting officer of the Service when departing the United States, the alien shall thereafter be presumed to be inadmissible under, but not limited to, section 212(a)(3)(A)(ii) of the Act, 8 U.S.C. 1182(a)(3)(A)(ii). See 8 CFR 264.1(f)(8). ---
**Author:** ![Greg\_Charles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/839c29/32.png) [@Greg\_Charles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greg_Charles)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/17 "2002-12-19T00:24:08Z")
I’m starting to really like this thread. Well, at least 25% of me is. Maybe I’ll change to my grandmother’s maiden name Zamanigian. I had no idea we were such chick magnets. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/armenian-terrorists/142611/18 "2002-12-19T03:37:43Z")
I had an Armenan roomie once, so I got to learn about the genocide of Armenians by the Turks about a century ago – the first genocide of the twentieth century, and the most neglected. To this day the Turks deny it, although you can find lots of books on the topic, and I darsay a few websites. A lot of Armenians are understandably pissed about this, and have committed acts to try and focus world atention on the issue. So armenian terrorists hav exsted. But AFAIK, they hav not operated in the US, or recently.