# Arming teachers **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 16, 2018, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927 "2018-02-16T14:48:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 32
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2018, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/621 "2018-03-02T21:32:40Z")
> [@Stonebow](#): > > But we also have to consider that 1) the people most likely to opt into this kind of system are the people I least likely want to have a gun around my kids… Could you elaborate on this any more? What do you mean? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2018, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/622 "2018-03-02T21:34:12Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > We’re not discussing a matter of strictly individual choice; it’s also a matter of public safety. School children and their parents have a right - even a responsibility - to work together to create a safe environment for learning. They can decide that they don’t want armed teachers in their schools. Individuals don’t have the unfettered right to take their firearms - legally purchased and possessed, or not - wherever they desire. Governments have the power to impose restrictions on firearms. Of course. Was anyone disputing that? ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2018, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/623 "2018-03-02T21:34:39Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I don’t think anyone in this thread is suggesting we obligate teachers to do something they don’t feel comfortable doing. We want them to have the choice, and make the choice themselves. I don’t see any “we”. ---
**Author:** ![Stonebow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Stonebow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stonebow)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2018, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/624 "2018-03-02T22:18:35Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Could you elaborate on this any more? What do you mean? Certainly, for any population of responsible gun owners I have encountered (and having spent the bulk of my life in the rural Southern US, I have encountered many) there is a portion of gun fetishists. I don’t trust them to find non-shooting solutions to complex problems when under stress (hell, I am not 100% on board with police officers carrying as a matter of policy). The CCW holders that I know (and I recognize that I know many who don’t advertise the fact) are routinely discussing incidents in which having the gun somehow saved their life. As I have managed 40 years on earth without carrying, or ever being in a situation where I felt the lack, I do wonder whether carrying makes you more likely to engage in behavior that engage situations that justify it. When all you have is a hammer, all problems look like a nail, as the saying goes. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Krupe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Leo\_Krupe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Krupe)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2018, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/625 "2018-03-02T22:19:51Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > We’re not discussing a matter of strictly individual choice; it’s also a matter of public safety. School children and their parents have a right - even a responsibility - to work together to create a safe environment for learning. They can decide that they don’t want armed teachers in their schools.\*\* Individuals don’t have the unfettered right to take their firearms - legally purchased and possessed, or not - wherever they desire.\*\* Governments have the power to impose restrictions on firearms. Au contraire! [https://admin.mashable.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/OCT-Tarrant-County.jpg](https://admin.mashable.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/OCT-Tarrant-County.jpg) :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![WillReadmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/6f9a4e/32.png) [@WillReadmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillReadmore)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2018, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/626 "2018-03-02T23:22:50Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Has any one asked teachers because it makes them the very first target? Which is a shame when your vocation isn’t security guard. Great question! My daughter, a petite white woman, teaches high school - math, special ed. She says there are no teachers at her current school who aren’t absolutely and totally opposed to the idea of teachers or other staff having guns in school. They aren’t so opposed to having officers who are armed, but there would need to be some very clear lines on what they are allowed to do and who is in control in a disciplinary situation, and there would need to be better training than is perceived to be the case today. And, by training they don’t mean anything related to guns - they mean something VERY different from that. She has taught in schools that have serious issues. One middle school in Chicago where she did “teach for America” while earning an advanced degree (UC - English) and got hooked on teaching had it’s windows boarded up and a wooden structure around the entrance where talking through a speaker box was required for entry into the area where the school door actually was. Another was a high school in the Bronx where the one white kid was from Albania and had limited English. Which is to say her experience isn’t all rich kid, gated community, academies. ---
**Author:** ![proudfootz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b9e5f3/32.png) [@proudfootz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/proudfootz)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/627 "2018-03-03T00:34:30Z")
While I can imagine some teachers being willing to pack a firearm at work, it would be simpler in my opinion to try and keep weapons out of the schools. I just don’t buy the argument that the best solution to too many guns in schools is moar guns. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/628 "2018-03-03T00:46:28Z")
> [@proudfootz](#): > > … it would be simpler in my opinion to try and keep weapons out of the schools. … Do you not think we’ve already adequately tried that approach? ---
**Author:** ![proudfootz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b9e5f3/32.png) [@proudfootz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/proudfootz)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/629 "2018-03-03T00:51:40Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Do you not think we’ve already adequately tried that approach? Not me! 😃 It seems to me the plethora of guns in the community surrounding the school is bound to leak into the school, so the solution is to dry up the oversupply of guns _outside_ the school zone so they are not forced _in_ by a process like osmosis. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/630 "2018-03-03T00:54:57Z")
> [@proudfootz](#): > > … so the solution is to dry up the oversupply of guns _outside_ the school zone so they are not forced _in_ by a process like osmosis. … :rolleyes: I kind of figured that’s where you were going to go with that. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/631 "2018-03-03T00:57:40Z")
If right-wing parents want their children to have armed bodyguards, they can quit their jobs and become armed bodyguards. Sure, that’ll make them obvious targets, but no job is perfect. ---
**Author:** ![proudfootz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b9e5f3/32.png) [@proudfootz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/proudfootz)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/632 "2018-03-03T00:58:12Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > :rolleyes: > > I kind of figured that’s where you were going to go with that. It’s the logical conclusion. 😃 On the other hand, if schools would just hand out guns to everyone on entry, there should be enough ‘good guys’ with guns to outgun the ‘bad guys’. But then we’d have designated school guns getting out into the surrounding community. Tough call! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/633 "2018-03-03T04:24:10Z")
Lower the number of guns, you say? Come now, we have already examined that notion, and hard-headed, realistic people assure us… without hesitation!..that is unworthy of consideration. Now, putting armed police in every school to walk about awaiting their pension, or arming and training some of the most civilian of civilians…now, _there_!..we have some practical solutions, worth mulling over, and studying, and then some more mulling… Yours is like trying to defeat a national disease by massive programs of vaccination! Wildly impractical, ruinously expensive and the first step to socialized medicine! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/634 "2018-03-03T04:41:17Z")
It’ll never work. We did away with pretend army guns almost 30 years ago and we still had 14 people killed with guns in a city of over 1 million people last year. 14! Will this madness never end? ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/635 "2018-03-03T16:03:08Z")
I have read every post in this thread. What jumps out at me is this question is treated in a similar way to other issues that get defined as having clear “left” and “right” positions. Global warming? What do people with PhDs in atmospheric science who spend their days analyzing climate data for NOAA know about the subject? Guys who own coal mines and have connection to Fox News say it is a hoax, and the suckers will believe that and believe the whole thing is a giant statist, leftist conspiracy to deprive us all of liberty. Tax cuts for the wealthy? What to professional economists with an encyclopedic knowledge of economic history know about the predictable effects of that? Billionaires who stand to make millions and who have connections to Fox News say it will _increase_ revenue, so the chumps will believe that, and anyone who suggests otherwise is another infuriating leftists hive-minder hell-bent on depriving Real Americans of their liberty for their own sinister reasons. Guns in schools? Guys who make millions selling guns and who have connections to Fox News say that moar guns is the answer, and the marks will believe that. Every statistic and foreign example indicates that moar guns will mean more deaths and mayhem than the status quo, but the pro gun guys are so sure of their position that we have the Dickey Amendment to ensure that _the question is not even studied_. By the power of Ipse Dixit, moar guns is the answer!! I propose treating guns like cars- require a license and registration to own them. Yes, this means a gun registry, but the intent there is not to take everyone’s guns away at a later date, this proposal is chosen precisely as a solution that does _not_ require taking or banning any guns. People who should not have guns can be denied a license, and people who do violent or crazy things can have their guns repossessed, but otherwise lawful citizens are not affected in a meaningful way. The suckers, chumps and marks can scream about the Naziesque intrusion of state power into their lives with the registry which is the foot in the door for leftist totalitarianism, but they never know what they are talking about anyway, motivated as they usually are by the most absurd and disinformed lies. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/636 "2018-03-03T18:21:00Z")
I imagine it’s very comforting to tell yourself that all your opponents are either ignorant suckers and chumps or mustache-twirling evil masterminds. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/637 "2018-03-03T18:36:47Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Do you not think we’ve already adequately tried that approach? No. No First World country has tried this approach as half-assed as the United States. More effort would be a great idea. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/638 "2018-03-03T18:43:37Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I imagine it’s very comforting to tell yourself that all your opponents are either ignorant suckers and chumps or mustache-twirling evil masterminds. It probably is. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/639 "2018-03-03T18:47:00Z")
Well I’m sorry HD, but if you have another explanation for the chronic misinformation baked into GOP policies and support for them, I’d like to hear it. It isn’t that I am criticizing my “opponents” as I don’t identify with either tribe. I am a One Nation guy who wants worthwhile solutions to problems. Dividing the populace with misinformation to benefit the elites is not a new thing- it goes back to Colonial times and sure looks alive and well today. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2018, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927/640 "2018-03-03T18:49:35Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > No. No First World country has tried this approach as half-assed as the United States. More effort would be a great idea. So another vote for “dry up the oversupply”? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927.md?page=31) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/arming-teachers/808927.md?page=33)