# Art confessions--"I don't see what's so great about..." **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 30, 2007, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026 "2007-06-30T10:00:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![GargoyleWB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gargoylewb/32/199_2.png) [@GargoyleWB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GargoyleWB)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/121 "2007-07-03T18:37:56Z")
And to contribute šŸ˜‰ I donā€™t see whatā€™s so great about top chefs and high cuisine. It all seems to me like self-serving insider elitist wankery to me. There is no genius or art involved by topping my shrimp fettucine with a curled rosette of colorful mystery fruit and drizzled with baslamic in a Spirograph pattern. Your $9 designer trademarked cocktail is worthless, no matter how pretty it is, if I can get a better tasting drink with more alcohol at the hotel lounge happy hour across the street. My mom used to make me pancakes shaped like cookie monster, with chocolate chips for hair and marshmallow eyes, and she didnā€™t charge $30 a plate for it. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/122 "2007-07-03T18:39:10Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] Againā€¦itā€™s art that I donā€™t get; not bad art. [/QUOTE] Right, exactly. I feel like thereā€™s something I donā€™t get with Joyce, and as a result I donā€™t like what Iā€™ve read. Thatā€™s not the same as, for example, _On the Road_. I know what people like about that book, I just thought it sucked. ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/123 "2007-07-03T18:43:02Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] Well, I admit thereā€™s a whole lot of knowinā€™ that I simply donā€™t possess (but would like toā€¦if I had about 3 more lifetimes to live), and in that respect, certainly heā€™s a great writerā€¦able to incorporate all of that into his work. However, heā€™s very inaccessible; you canā€™t get him unless you have all that background. Itā€™s difficult to enjoy the work on its own. Thatā€™s what bothers me about him. Againā€¦itā€™s art that I donā€™t get; not bad art. [/QUOTE] Thatā€™s cool. I didnā€™t want to speak for you or belittle it by saying (with nose in the air) ā€œWell, maybe you just donā€™t _get_ itā€. ---
**Author:** ![pendgwen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3da27b/32.png) [@pendgwen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pendgwen)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/124 "2007-07-03T18:56:00Z")
[QUOTE=Least Original User Name Ever] Did watching ā€œApocalypse Nowā€ help you like or dislike the Heart of Darkness? [/QUOTE] We watched Apocalypse Now in class after reading Heart of Darkness so my opinion of the book was already well established and the movie did nothing to mitigate it. ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/125 "2007-07-03T19:04:28Z")
**Tool**. Thundering away on the same two riffs for 13 minutes is not ā€œprogressive.ā€ ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/126 "2007-07-03T19:07:55Z")
[QUOTE=pendgwen] We watched Apocalypse Now in class after reading Heart of Darkness so my opinion of the book was already well established and the movie did nothing to mitigate it. [/QUOTE] Ah, so youā€™ve split the two apart, then. Just wondering/making sure. Is there anything in particular you disliked about it? ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/127 "2007-07-03T19:09:13Z")
[QUOTE=Marley23] Right, exactly. I feel like thereā€™s something I donā€™t get with Joyce, and as a result I donā€™t like what Iā€™ve read. Thatā€™s not the same as, for example, _On the Road_. I know what people like about that book, I just thought it sucked. [/QUOTE] (High-fives Marley) Good gawd but I think that book is the biggest piece of shit that ever rolled off a pen. ---
**Author:** ![pendgwen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3da27b/32.png) [@pendgwen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pendgwen)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/128 "2007-07-03T19:39:05Z")
[QUOTE=Least Original User Name Ever] Ah, so youā€™ve split the two apart, then. Just wondering/making sure. Is there anything in particular you disliked about it? [/QUOTE] You know it was long enough ago and Iā€™ve so completely avoided thinking about it since then that I couldnā€™t even tell you what exactly produced such a visceral _hate, hate, hate_ reaction. I rather enjoyed Apocalypse Now but it didnā€™t make me like the book. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/129 "2007-07-03T20:24:45Z")
Frank Zappa. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/130 "2007-07-03T21:28:32Z")
[QUOTE=Dung Beetle] Frank Zappa. [/QUOTE] I think Frank Zappa was so off the mainstream (particularly his sense of humor and his lyrics) that sometimes his musicianship got lost amidst the absurdity. I saw him once, and I gotta say he had the tightest band Iā€™ve ever seen. I know heā€™s not everyoneā€™s cup oā€™ tea, and I wouldnā€™t presume to tell you what you like or dislike, but I found his music to be interesting and complex ā€“ not to mention lyrically hilarious. Here is an interesting biography. [Frank Zappa Biography - hotshotdigital.com](http://www.hotshotdigital.com/WellAlwaysRemember.3/FrankZappaBio.html) Iā€™ve heard on more than one occasion that he was kind of a dick. ā˜¹ ---
**Author:** ![I\_m\_No\_Saint](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/977dab/32.png) [@I\_m\_No\_Saint](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_m_No_Saint)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/131 "2007-07-03T21:59:38Z")
-The Watchmen graphic novel. It just didnā€™t do a thing for me. Itā€™s not how I like my comic books. -Pink Floyd -99% ofanime. Itā€¦it just doesnā€™t make sense. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/132 "2007-07-03T22:12:13Z")
[QUOTE=VCO3] Iā€™m another ā€œdoesnā€™t get into Radioheadā€ person, but I have a workable theory as to why; I think that Radiohead is one of those bands that sounds really impressive and interesting to people that donā€™t listen to anything more challenging than standard rock music, but sounds completely boring if you listen to stuff thatā€™s far weirder and denser on a daily basis. [/QUOTE] Iā€™m with you on this oneā€¦and my contribution in a similar train of though: **The Beatles** I just donā€™t get it. What is/was so great about their music? That they invented whole new musical concepts (except didnā€™t)? That they used these concepts and turned them into commercial successes (which isnā€™t a measure of artistic success)? Or another argument Iā€™ve been unconvinced by, that they did so many different things but always were recognisably The Beatles (and why is this important?). ---
**Author:** ![photopat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e95f7d/32.png) [@photopat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/photopat)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/133 "2007-07-03T23:02:31Z")
Frank Miller. Canā€™t stand his work. Although the movie The 300 was okay. ---
**Author:** ![TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/51bf81/32.png) [@TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2007, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/134 "2007-07-03T23:14:04Z")
[QUOTE=GorillaMan] Iā€™m with you on this oneā€¦and my contribution in a similar train of though: **The Beatles** I just donā€™t get it. What is/was so great about their music? That they invented whole new musical concepts (except didnā€™t)? That they used these concepts and turned them into commercial successes (which isnā€™t a measure of artistic success)? Or another argument Iā€™ve been unconvinced by, that they did so many different things but always were recognisably The Beatles (and why is this important?). [/QUOTE] Itā€™s this simple: Lennon and McCartney simply _crapped_ incredible, instantly-timeless songs. Everything else that you mentioned was icing on the cake, but the fact is, some of the songs that have become the most loved songs of the past century were literally written _in a few hours_ by those guys because they needed an extra track for the new record or for the next film. Mindblowing. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2007, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/135 "2007-07-04T00:34:10Z")
[QUOTE=OneCentStamp] **Tool**. Thundering away on the same two riffs for 13 minutes is not ā€œprogressive.ā€ [/QUOTE] My Third Eye is the only song I can think of that vaguely fits that description. Do you think their songs are less varied than other bandsā€™? Regarding progressiveness. They have many songs with untraditional structure, and they use more odd time signatures than most other bands I can think of. Why not use the term progressive, and what would you call them instead? ---
**Author:** ![adhemar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3da27b/32.png) [@adhemar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhemar)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2007, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/136 "2007-07-04T01:11:16Z")
cartoons fart jokes NASCAR Symbolism in art or books, How do you know what the artist or author meant unless he spelled it out somewhere? Modern Jazz - I used to think I didntā€™ like jazz music until I realized what I listen to IS jazz it just isnā€™t modern jazz or neo jazz or something like that. Watching sports pretty much of any kind ā€œSo you think you can danceā€ The fact that I live in a place reknowned for itā€™s blues music but the only places I can hear live blues are in places I really donā€™t want to walk into alone. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2007, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/137 "2007-07-04T01:25:55Z")
[QUOTE=adhemar] Symbolism in art or books, How do you know what the artist or author meant unless he spelled it out somewhere? [/QUOTE] Artists can use symbolism without making it completely mysterious. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2007, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/138 "2007-07-04T01:29:26Z")
[QUOTE=adhemar] Symbolism in art or books, How do you know what the artist or author meant unless he spelled it out somewhere? [/QUOTE] What the author meant isnā€™t important. What matters is what it means to you. ---
**Author:** ![kellner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c2a13f/32.png) [@kellner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kellner)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2007, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/139 "2007-07-04T01:33:06Z")
Music. Yes, music in general. In a very general sense I recognize that some music can be aesthetically pleasing. I see how it can be used to communicate/evoke emotion. I understand that it is a fairly prominent aspect of our culture. I can also listen to more elaborate explanations of what music reportedly is and does and nod politely at the end. On a very fundamental level however, I just donā€™t get what the fuss is about. It doesnā€™t work for me. Iā€™m aware that Iā€™m missing something that means so much to many people but I canā€™t help it. ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2007, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026/140 "2007-07-04T05:00:40Z")
[QUOTE=kellner] Music. Yes, music in general. In a very general sense I recognize that some music can be aesthetically pleasing. I see how it can be used to communicate/evoke emotion. I understand that it is a fairly prominent aspect of our culture. I can also listen to more elaborate explanations of what music reportedly is and does and nod politely at the end. On a very fundamental level however, I just donā€™t get what the fuss is about. It doesnā€™t work for me. Iā€™m aware that Iā€™m missing something that means so much to many people but I canā€™t help it. [/QUOTE] I hope Iā€™m not being wooshed here, but if you donā€™t get music in general, I donā€™t think anyone can explain it to you. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/art-confessions-i-dont-see-whats-so-great-about/410026.md?page=8)