# Artificial meat **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 28, 2012, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275 "2012-02-28T19:25:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/41 "2012-03-01T14:39:33Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > The article says 30% of world’s ice-free land is used to raise animals. With artificial meat some of this land could be turned to wilderness acting as a carbon sink. I suspect that Gobi, Sahara or Mojave aren’t particularly good as carbon sinks go, yet they’re not very useful for herding either. Dry land isn’t composed exclusively of “packed-up-farms” and “bucollic, perfectly ecologically balanced forests”. ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2012, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/42 "2012-03-07T02:18:27Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > The article says 30% of world’s ice-free land is used to raise animals. With artificial meat some of this land could be turned to wilderness acting as a carbon sink. And there would be fewer farm animals spewing greenhouse gases like methane into the atmosphere. Of course artificial meat would have some environmental impact too but fundamentally I think it’s a lot more efficient just growing the meat you want rather than raising a whole animal for perhaps years. 30% is a crap figure, we have farms in Australia that are the size of freaken countries with only a few thousand head of cattle. Some land is so marginal that growing anything on it would be nigh on impossible. ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2012, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/43 "2012-03-07T06:58:32Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > I knew I had seen a study that did this. [Here.](http://www.ajcn.org/content/89/5/1704S.full) > They come up with 11 kg CO2 equivalents/kg of product for cheese; half as much as beef and 2 1/2 times more than chicken. Not so far off from your calculations. I found another estimate of 8.3kg C02/per kilo of cheese. [http://somethingspecialwi.com/documents/CarbonFootprintOfCheese-pages.pdf](http://somethingspecialwi.com/documents/CarbonFootprintOfCheese-pages.pdf) I actually found several studies on this matter, but none of them seem to reference my blog. :dubious: My pasteurized process cheese food weights 19 grams per slice which works out to .17 kg CO2 per slice of cheese. I not certain how much actual milk is involved in cheese ‘food’. There is some interesting work by biologists trying to transplant genes from kangaroos to cattle and develop a non-flatulent cow. Of course, chickens and turkeys are pretty efficient protein factories. I wonder if it would be easier to develop a dumber chicken, so people don’t get attached to them? How much actual brain does it take to eat and poop? I don’t how chickens compare to aquaculture farms. Maybe it would be easier to come up with a fish that tastes like chicken. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2012, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/44 "2012-03-07T08:03:10Z")
> [@sisu](#): > > 30% is a crap figure, we have farms in Australia that are the size of freaken countries with only a few thousand head of cattle. Some land is so marginal that growing anything on it would be nigh on impossible. If it’s grazing land, presumably it grows grass. Allowing grass to grow is a lot better for the environment than letting cows eat it and belch methane. And there are other parts of the world where cattle farming is a [serious threat](http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/may/31/cattle-trade-brazil-greenpeace-amazon-deforestation) to forests. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2012, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/45 "2012-03-07T13:45:25Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > 1. From a purely culinary perspective that artificial meat could potentially allow for a lot more variety allowing people to easily enjoy meat from protected species, predators etc. Tigers, dolphins etc. I wonder if this might be the major driving force behind private research. Bill Gates decides he wants a legal hippo-burger, so he throws a few million bucks at the problem. And looking far ahead, I wonder if someday there will be vat-grown meats that really have no clear correspondence to animals. Your favorite meat will be a particular brand, perhaps a variety of that brand, and it’s name will be as arbitrary as a car model. I prefer a steak made from Kraft Harmongulous, but you prefer the General Mills Parfalintrask. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Niply\_Elder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@The\_Niply\_Elder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Niply_Elder)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2012, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/46 "2012-03-10T16:34:52Z")
this kinda went under the radar, but it’s classic SD > [@DSeid](#): > > I relish the concept and can’t wait until the technology can catch up to the role I say it should have, yes, the says me role. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/47 "2012-03-11T00:52:27Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > And looking far ahead, I wonder if someday there will be vat-grown meats that really have no clear correspondence to animals. Your favorite meat will be a particular brand, perhaps a variety of that brand, and it’s name will be as arbitrary as a car model. I prefer a steak made from Kraft Harmongulous, but you prefer the General Mills Parfalintrask. I read an SF short story, probably while I was in high school, to this effect. The setting was a civil suit trial, one company against another, where the suing company had been hurt in market share because the sued company had come out with a new brand. The premise of the story was that people had forgotten where food naturally came from, and the trial lawyer had to tell the jury about “our primitive ancestors” food growing technology, introduce the concept of “meat” and where it came from, and finally the last line of the story was the lawyer introducing the jury to the word “cannibal”. I wish I could remember title and author. It would be perfect reading for this thread. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2012, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/48 "2012-03-11T04:51:15Z")
> [@](#): > > A better solution might include logically thought out population control as well. Logical population control tends to encounter problems like [humans](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex-selective_abortion). > [@](#): > > If they can’t compete with synthetic meat Assuming they’d need to. Spindle workers didn’t need to compete with power looms. The amount of food produced wasn’t reduced, so given an appropriate distributive system there’s no problem, right? Well, other than the starvation. ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2012, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/49 "2012-03-12T23:37:55Z")
> [@Lantern](#): > > If it’s grazing land, presumably it grows grass. Allowing grass to grow is a lot better for the environment than letting cows eat it and belch methane. And there are other parts of the world where cattle farming is a [serious threat](http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/may/31/cattle-trade-brazil-greenpeace-amazon-deforestation) to forests. Grazing land with very poor soils, lots of rocks and large distances between towns, there are bigger issues in regards to hard hoofed animals and the degradation to soils but nothing will grow there of any commercial value, except kangaroos mmmm kangaroo steaks… Yep, destroying rainforests for cattle is not a win win situation ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2012, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/50 "2012-03-13T00:13:56Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > I found another estimate of 8.3kg C02/per kilo of cheese. … > … Of course, chickens and turkeys are pretty efficient protein factories. I wonder if it would be easier to develop a dumber chicken, so people don’t get attached to them? How much actual brain does it take to eat and poop? Hey, I for one was pretty impressed. That takes some brains. Something few think chickens have much of as it is. Maybe they aren’t as dumb as we think they are, but few critters other than turkeys have people really believing that they are [dumb enough to drown in the rain](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/369/are-turkeys-so-stupid-they-will-look-up-in-the-sky-when-it-rains-and-drown). **The Niply Elder** , thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2012, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/51 "2012-03-13T01:36:20Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > I read an SF short story, probably while I was in high school, to this effect. The setting was a civil suit trial, one company against another, where the suing company had been hurt in market share because the sued company had come out with a new brand. The premise of the story was that people had forgotten where food naturally came from, and the trial lawyer had to tell the jury about “our primitive ancestors” food growing technology, introduce the concept of “meat” and where it came from, and finally the last line of the story was the lawyer introducing the jury to the word “cannibal”. I wish I could remember title and author. It would be perfect reading for this thread. That’s _The Food of the Gods_ by Arthur C. Clarke, I think. The brand name of the food being (from memory) something like “Ambrosia Six” ---
**Author:** ![JoelUpchurch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f05b48/32.png) [@JoelUpchurch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoelUpchurch)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/52 "2012-03-14T02:48:32Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Hey, I for one was pretty impressed. That takes some brains. Something few think chickens have much of as it is. Maybe they aren’t as dumb as we think they are, but few critters other than turkeys have people really believing that they are [dumb enough to drown in the rain](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/369/are-turkeys-so-stupid-they-will-look-up-in-the-sky-when-it-rains-and-drown). > > **The Niply Elder** , thank you. My parents raised chickens when I was a kid and I’d say chickens have a lot more brains than they need to be food. I not clear about why they need more brains than a worm or a fish. We also should be able to come up with a featherless chicken. I figure feathers are just extra processing cost. I’m not sure the wings are cost effective also. ---
**Author:** ![Namkcalb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c89c15/32.png) [@Namkcalb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Namkcalb)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2012, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/53 "2012-03-14T08:15:53Z")
> [@JoelUpchurch](#): > > I’m not sure the wings are cost effective also. No way! I’m trying to cross them with an octopus.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Namkcalb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c89c15/32.png) [@Namkcalb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Namkcalb)\ **Post date:** [March 15, 2012, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275/54 "2012-03-15T10:56:49Z")
> [@Namkcalb](#): > > No way! I’m trying to cross them with an octopus.🙂 You are an idiot, how dare you sully an interesting topic with a bad joke. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-meat/614275.md?page=2)