# Artificial sweeteners: recent bad news **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 30, 2023, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345 "2023-06-30T11:04:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2025, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/121 "2025-12-04T00:22:36Z")
Out of curiosity, @DSeid, have you seen a lot of patients with phenylketonuria? I might have seen two since my clinical clerkship. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2025, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/122 "2025-12-04T00:28:11Z")
I don’t want to discuss this sidetrack too much in this thread, but this putative link between poor sleep and dementia and neurodysfunction is also interesting. (NYT limited gift link, not a journal). [https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/25/well/mind/deep-sleep-rem-brain-health.html?unlocked\_article\_code=1.6E8.zdrG.szpKNLZhcjkY&smid=url-share](https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/25/well/mind/deep-sleep-rem-brain-health.html?unlocked_article_code=1.6E8.zdrG.szpKNLZhcjkY&smid=url-share) ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2025, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/123 "2025-12-04T00:34:24Z")
Well, that’s why, when I nap, i try to do so for about 90 minutes. That ought to give me a full sleep cycle. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2025, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/124 "2025-12-04T00:50:35Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > patients with phenylketonuria Embarrassed that I can’t say for sure but less than a handful. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2025, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/125 "2025-12-04T01:12:03Z")
> [@Dr\_Paprika](#): > > this putative link between poor sleep and dementia and neurodysfunction is also interesting. (Not a doctor) I’ve seen a variety of research making me think that dementia becomes more likely with either of a) poor clearing of junk from the brain, and/or b) insufficient resources for the brain. A healthy diet with omega-3s, choline, B6, B9, and B12 should keep one pretty good but with modern diets omega-3s can be more scarce, and too much overly white flour and rice and too few vegetables might harm you on the B vitamins. It’s also possible that we’re deficient in CoQ-10 and Phosphitydilserine due to abandoning the consumption of offal and brains. High dose creatine might help to provide more energy to the brain - and, in the modern, complex world, maybe we need more than our ancestors generally did. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2025, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/126 "2025-12-04T02:58:52Z")
During four years of medical school, we spent under a week discussing sleep. A lot less is known about it than one might expect. And good studies showing some of how the glymphatic system works took until 2012. > **[Glymphatic system](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glymphatic_system)** > > The glymphatic system, glymphatic clearance pathway or paravascular system is an organ system for metabolic waste removal in the central nervous system (CNS) of vertebrates. According to this model, cerebrospinal fluid (CSF), an ultrafiltrated plasma fluid secreted by choroid plexuses in the cerebral ventricles, flows into the paravascular space around cerebral arteries, contacts and mixes with interstitial fluid (ISF) and solutes within the brain parenchyma, and exits via the cerebral venous par... ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2025, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/127 "2025-12-04T19:04:45Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > > [@wolfpup](#): > > > > Artificial sweeteners definitely lead to less weight gain > > My understanding is that is in fact not the case, not in actual use cases, so cite please? I’m going to take back my taking-back on the original comment, except the word “definitely” should be stricken in favour of “there is some evidence for weight loss from artificial sweeteners in some groups”. Relevant quotes (SSB=sugar sweetened beverage, ASB=artificially sweetened, USB=unsweetened): > Although overall change in weight also was not different between groups, we found effect modification (_P_=0.006) by central adiposity. Among participants in the highest tertile of baseline trunk fat but not other tertiles, weight gain was greater (_P_=0.002) for the SSB (4.4±1.0 kg, estimate±SE) compared with ASB (0.5±0.9 kg) or USB (−0.2±0.9 kg) group. Among the conclusions: > Among individuals with central adiposity, replacing SSBs with either ASBs or USBs lowered body weight. From the **[Journal of the American Heart Association](https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/JAHA.119.015668)**. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2025, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/129 "2025-12-04T20:21:58Z")
Yeah the studies get mixed results. Definitely not definitively though! My bias, and it is a bias, is that continuing to further entrain our brains to require big sweet hits is not good for our long term weight and fat control, even when it is one of the times it works short term. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2025, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/130 "2025-12-06T15:04:59Z")
So throwing this in here even though it is becoming a hijack and a deep dive nerding - looking for studies associating taste receptors polymorphisms with neurodegenerative diseases find this one. The association found in the African American population studied was for bitter taste receptors. [https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-71669-9.pdf](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-024-71669-9.pdf) 🤔 Already associated with longevity in some long lived sub populations. > **[Taste receptor polymorphisms and longevity: a systematic review and...](https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8429150/)** > > Bitter taste receptors (TAS2R) are involved in a variety of non-tasting physiological processes, including immune-inflammatory ones. Therefore, their genetic variations might influence various traits. In particular, in different populations of South... ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2026, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/131 "2026-04-12T14:30:06Z")
More recent bad news for non-nutritive sweeteners: > **[Popular sweeteners may impact metabolism across generations](https://www.news-medical.net/news/20260410/Popular-sweeteners-may-impact-metabolism-across-generations.aspx)** > > When you choose a diet version of your favorite fizzy drink, you consume non-nutritive sweeteners, which taste sweet but - unlike sugar - contain no calories. Animal model. Not a human study. No certainty occurs in humans. But the impact across generations gives a real pause … and not one that refreshes. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2026, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/132 "2026-04-12T14:40:24Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > More recent bad news for non-nutritive sweeteners: > > [Popular sweeteners may impact metabolism across generations](https://www.news-medical.net/news/20260410/Popular-sweeteners-may-impact-metabolism-across-generations.aspx) > > Animal model. Not a human study. The animals were _mice_. Data from such studies [often extrapolates poorly to humans](https://news.northwestern.edu/stories/2023/03/humans-are-not-just-big-mice-study-identifies-sciences-muscle-scaling-problem). > **[Inflammatory findings on species extrapolations: humans are definitely no...](https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3604596/)** > > Modern toxicology has embraced in vitro methods, and major hopes are based on the Omics technologies and systems biology approaches they bring along (Hartung and McBride in ALTEX 28(2):83–93, 2011; Hartung et al. in ALTEX 29(2):119–28, 2012). A ... ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2026, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/133 "2026-04-12T15:01:52Z")
I’m not a fan of mice studies. Not that I’ve really concerned myself about it too much. There was that mouse that grew a human **ear** on his back. (Wonder what his ear worm was–eeek!). Gave me lab grown pancreatic hopes for a few minutes. As a diabetic I use very little sweetener. There are times when I absolutely need sugars. Usually plain white sugar in the way of sugar cubes. (Exact measurements are my peccadillo, sugar cubes are more exact). I like a drop or two of real honey in a certain tummy ache tea I was using during my recent problems. But that’s about it. I don’t play that sweetener game. If it’s not for me to eat I just don’t. I learned a long time ago it’s not worth the trouble it causes, for a candy bar. It amazes me how much sugar and artificial sweetener people use. Gallons and gallons of coke, diet or regular. Every, nearly, food product you buy is bumped up with sugar. Southern cooks put sugar in everything… Meats, beans, potatoes, veggies, sauces and of course desserts. I’ve adjusted that in my house back when my kids were little. So sugar in a pot of beans is foreign to them. It’s scary. I’m glad they’re looking into artificial sweeteners. I just don’t think it will help anyone. Peeps are chasing the sweet taste. Always. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2026, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345/134 "2026-04-12T15:34:01Z")
Yeah no one is claiming this directly translates to humans. More just raising the possibility that intergenerational impacts may occur in humans as well. Still. > [@Beckdawrek](#): > > It amazes me how much sugar and artificial sweetener people use. I guess we shouldn’t be so amazed? Sweet as a potent stimulus of our reward networks has been selected for, for a very very very long time. The unrestricted virtually unlimited availability to that reward system? Not. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/artificial-sweeteners-recent-bad-news/986345.md?page=6)