As A Progressive, I Found Voting This Year A Disgusting, Vile, Unpleasant Experience

[Chessic_Sense]

I’m so sick of people voting at the Federal level over abortion. You’d think after 40 years of Republicans and Democrats coming and going in the White House, and nothing ever changing about abortion, that voters would understand that it’s set in stone. You’d think that after Romney slips up and says “I don’t know of any legislation limiting abortion that I’d support” out loud and his track record as governor, that voters would realize he’s not interested in changing the law.

You’d think that people would realize by now that abortion threats are manufactured to win votes, but Evil Captor proves me wrong and the strategy right.

Oh well. Maybe after another four years of absolutely nothing changing, he’ll get it.

[Giraffe]

@Evil_Captor

Oh noes! If we build a progressive party we will no longer have the option of voting for Tweedledum instead of Tweedledee!

I’m pretty sure I said exactly this in 2000 about Bush vs. Gore, to explain why I (very self-righteously) voted for Nader instead.

I was wrong.

[Damuri_Ajashi]

@Evil_Captor

I voted for the civil rights violating, Wall Street suckup who would NOT attack women’s freedom of choice to avoid electing the civil rights violating Wall Street suckup who WOULD attack women’s freedom to choose. In short, I voted for Obama.

The local races were just as bad, nothing but Republicans, blue dog Democrats and libertarian to choose from. Yech.

Well fuck that shit. I’m off to work on building viable progressive political party, if that’s possible. Beats voting for people you KNOW will betray you.

And I had to stand in line for 40 minutes to do it.

The level of civil rights violations and wall street sucking up is not equal between the two. BTW Wall Street (in the broad sense) HATES Obama.

[Rand_Rover]

@Evil_Captor

I voted for the civil rights violating, Wall Street suckup who would NOT attack women’s freedom of choice to avoid electing the civil rights violating Wall Street suckup who WOULD attack women’s freedom to choose. In short, I voted for Obama.

I guess you didn’t get the memo that SCOTUS has that “women’s freedom to choose” thing all nailed down. So, basically, you based your vote on a fairly poor understanding of the issues (much like Christian fundamentalists, just in the opposite direction).

Also, as a libertarian (i.e., fiscally conservative and socially liberal), voting is always a disgusting, vile, unpleasant experience. But I cope (and I base my vote on more meaningful metrics than some people do).

[carnivorousplant]

@Rand_Rover

I guess you didn’t get the memo that SCOTUS has that “women’s freedom to choose” thing all nailed down.

I thought there was the possibility of the next President appointing two Supreme Court Justices which could change that.

[Rand_Rover]

@carnivorousplant

You said it, brother . . .

[The_Understander]

@Damuri_Ajashi

The level of civil rights violations and wall street sucking up is not equal between the two. BTW Wall Street (in the broad sense) HATES Obama.

Dead right. Pretending that both parties are the same is a recipe to get nothing and, moreover, a gross disservice to objective facts. It is lazy thinking and, from the progressive perspective, counterproductive. Who is going to vote for someone whose first complaint is that people don’t like their ideas?

People like progressive ideas. What they do not respond to is the lack of psychology we employ. When a president passes health care reform, stops discriminating against gays in the military, professes belief in tax fairness, and we still say he is right wing, we give our credence to the right wing.

OBAMA WINS!

[Atakapa]

@Enfant Terrible

Dead right. Pretending that both parties are the same is a recipe to get nothing and, moreover, a gross disservice to objective facts. It is lazy thinking and, from the progressive perspective, counterproductive. Who is going to vote for someone whose first complaint is that people don’t like their ideas?

People like progressive ideas. What they do not respond to is the lack of psychology we employ. When a president passes health care reform, stops discriminating against gays in the military, professes belief in tax fairness, and we still say he is right wing, we give our credence to the right wing.

OBAMA WINS!

You can’t blame people for being pissed that Obama continued and expanded “War on Terror” nonsense like the Patriot Act, domestic surveillance, assassinating US citizens, and everything else Bush started that I and many others were hoping he’d reverse. It was almost enough to make me want Romney to win so the people that were screaming bloody murder during the Bush administration would quit sitting on their hands just because the guy doing it had a “D” by his name instead of an “R.”

[The_Understander]

@Atakapa

You can’t blame people for being pissed that Obama continued and expanded “War on Terror” nonsense like the Patriot Act, domestic surveillance, assassinating US citizens, and everything else Bush started that I and many others were hoping he’d reverse. It was almost enough to make me want Romney to win so the people that were screaming bloody murder during the Bush administration would quit sitting on their hands just because the guy doing it had a “D” by his name instead of an “R.”

And you can’t blame people for being happy that we avoid ruinous tax policy and retain health care. You don’t get to pick my priorities.

[John_Stamos_Left_Ear]

@Atakapa

You can’t blame people for being pissed that Obama continued and expanded “War on Terror” nonsense like the Patriot Act, domestic surveillance, assassinating US citizens, and everything else Bush started that I and many others were hoping he’d reverse. It was almost enough to make me want Romney to win so the people that were screaming bloody murder during the Bush administration would quit sitting on their hands just because the guy doing it had a “D” by his name instead of an “R.”

Unless either:

a) Things would have gotten better under a Romney administration
b) Someone other than Obama or Romney would have won

Then your point is moot. Either elect the guy who most closely approximates your views - and then try and get him and other elected officials to listen to what you and others like you have to say on these issues - or whine that you don’t have a voice.

[gamerunknown]

Don’t worry, Obama is an actual left wing politician. He just had to wait until he stole a second term in order to disarm the US so that the revolutionary vanguard can accede to power.

[Evil_Captor]

@John_Stamos_Left_Ear

You want to get a Progressive agenda recognized by politicians?

Here’s what you do:

Go to the most Progressive candidates who are actually in office - I am thinking that Bernie Saunders might be the most visible and most closely approximating Progressive views but there are others who can assist - and ask them for help.

Find issues where you can make a dent and gather up petitions and even try and raise money to directly lobby politicians who would be sympathetic to your cause.

It would also help if you were in a state or county that would be more likely to support Progressive candidates. A place like Maine or Vermont or even Minnesota has pockets where a Progressive agenda can take hold… Not so much in Texas or Utah.

But there is something you need to realize: You are a huge minority and there is no guarantee of representation for minority political views. Things are so bad for Progressives in this country right now that many of them grasp onto the horribad RON PAUL as some kind of savior (because someone against Civil Rights is a pantheon of Progressive thought).

You have a very uphill battle. But complaining about how the ballot doesn’t represent your views won’t change anything except make other Progressive-minded people shake their heads at you when your idealism gets in the way of reality.

Actually I’m having a lot of fun hammering out in my mind what I think a progressive party should be all about right now. Once I’ve got that nailed down, then it’s time to talk to others. I’m thinking what’s needed is grassroots work nationwide … get progressives on city councils, school boards, into state legislatures, as well as Congress, and sure, work on making individual Dems more progressive. I still think the Dem’s national leadership needs a stick to hit them in the head before they will listen, and I doubt most Dems are ready for progressive change, but hell, I’ll work with the Tea Party to institute progressive change … and the Tea Party DO hate Wall Street.

[Evil_Captor]

@Chessic_Sense

I’m so sick of people voting at the Federal level over abortion. You’d think after 40 years of Republicans and Democrats coming and going in the White House, and nothing ever changing about abortion, that voters would understand that it’s set in stone. You’d think that after Romney slips up and says “I don’t know of any legislation limiting abortion that I’d support” out loud and his track record as governor, that voters would realize he’s not interested in changing the law.

You’d think that people would realize by now that abortion threats are manufactured to win votes, but Evil Captor proves me wrong and the strategy right.

Oh well. Maybe after another four years of absolutely nothing changing, he’ll get it.

Actually, I agree with you. Abortion is an issue the Repubs use to get votes out of their social conservative base, and which Dems use to scare progressives into voting for them lest those nasty ol Republicans institute anti-abortion legislation or appoint anti-abortion Supreme Court justices. Worked, too, this election cycle.

[Evil_Captor]

@Tom_Scud

I do think you’re better off trying to work within the Democratic party (getting more progressive candidates nominated locally, building up more of a left-ish presence within the party, and so on), which worked for the right-wingers with the Republican party. Still a very long distance to go.

I see no reason I can’t do this. Carrot and stick, baby. I just no longer believe Dems are all that interested in carrots.

[John_Stamos_Left_Ear]

@Evil_Captor

Actually, I agree with you. Abortion is an issue the Repubs use to get votes out of their social conservative base, and which Dems use to scare progressives into voting for them lest those nasty ol Republicans institute anti-abortion legislation or appoint anti-abortion Supreme Court justices. Worked, too, this election cycle.

One of those assertions is actually true and not just a scare tactic.

Linky

[Evil_Captor]

@Damuri_Ajashi

The level of civil rights violations and wall street sucking up is not equal between the two. BTW Wall Street (in the broad sense) HATES Obama.

Wall Street does not hate Obama. They would rather have had Romney, but they’ll use Obama now that the prospect of using Romney is no longer viable.

[Evil_Captor]

@Enfant Terrible

Dead right. Pretending that both parties are the same is a recipe to get nothing and, moreover, a gross disservice to objective facts. It is lazy thinking and, from the progressive perspective, counterproductive. Who is going to vote for someone whose first complaint is that people don’t like their ideas?

People like progressive ideas. What they do not respond to is the lack of psychology we employ. When a president passes health care reform, stops discriminating against gays in the military, professes belief in tax fairness, and we still say he is right wing, we give our credence to the right wing.

OBAMA WINS!

Both parties ARE pretty much the same, on issues relating to Wall Street and the One Percent. Neither party can seem to enact meaningful reform of our broken financial system. Banks are too big to fail, PACs are going to do nothing but get bigger and more influential, Wall Street is still a casino and the gap between rich and poor grows ever greater. The Dems have no REAL interest in changing any of that, most of them are millionaires, didn’t you hear?

[Evil_Captor]

@Giraffe

I’m pretty sure I said exactly this in 2000 about Bush vs. Gore, to explain why I (very self-righteously) voted for Nader instead.

I was wrong.

Yes, you were. And I voted for Obama because there was no viable progressive candidate at the national level. Now I will work to change that, so I’ll have someone to vote for. I do not think it will happen overnight, though you never know. Another economic setback and the country could get a LOT more radicalized.

[Evil_Captor]

@Enfant Terrible

And you can’t blame people for being happy that we avoid ruinous tax policy and retain health care. You don’t get to pick my priorities.

Well he gets to pick his priorities, too. That’s how democracy works.

[Rand_Rover]

@Evil_Captor

Actually, I agree with you. Abortion is an issue the Repubs use to get votes out of their social conservative base, and which Dems use to scare progressives into voting for them lest those nasty ol Republicans institute anti-abortion legislation or appoint anti-abortion Supreme Court justices. Worked, too, this election cycle.

And,more specifically, it worked on you.