# As Hitler is to evil, x is to good **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 20, 2015, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084 "2015-11-20T15:11:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/1 "2015-11-20T15:11:06Z")
Here’s one I’m pondering that I could use your input on - is it easier to find someone (namely Hitler, in western culture at least) as a shorthand for, or represents the ultimate symbol of, evil than it is for the reverse? Who would use suggest fills the role for good as Adolf does for evil, the inverse of Hitler if you will, that would be as readily understood? My own suggestion would be Martin Luther King, Jr. but I don’t know how many would agree. ---
**Author:** ![Trom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@Trom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trom)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/2 "2015-11-20T15:17:29Z")
Mr. Rogers ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/3 "2015-11-20T15:22:33Z")
Mother Teresa? ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/4 "2015-11-20T15:24:07Z")
Maybe Gandhi? I know only a little about him, but he’s a pretty common go-to example of a non-violent good guy. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/5 "2015-11-20T15:30:03Z")
I think Gandhi is the most commonly cited (even though there are some controversies about him). Maybe Nelson Mandela. MLK is an American thing. Not that he’s unheard of elsewhere, but I don’t see a non American mentioning him as an example of goodness, and more generally outside the specific context of US civil rights. And many people despise mother Theresa (myself included). ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/6 "2015-11-20T15:33:00Z")
Fred Rogers. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/7 "2015-11-20T15:44:28Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > Mother Teresa? That’d be my go-to for shorthand purposes. Mr. Rogers was a swell guy but I don’t know if he has the same international recognition. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/8 "2015-11-20T15:50:27Z")
Both Gandhi and Mother Teresa will get you strong negative reactions by many who have knowledge of their lives. You won’t get that many strong positive reactions about Hitler, _The Producers_ notwithstanding. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/9 "2015-11-20T15:55:35Z")
Goodness and virtue are much more relative than evil. It’s a lot more difficult to get people to agree on what constitutes are “purely good” person than a “purely evil” person. In terms of pure numbers, it’s hard to argue that Norman Borlaug shouldn’t be near the top of the list. ---
**Author:** ![CT\_Damsel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CT\_Damsel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CT_Damsel)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/10 "2015-11-20T16:05:55Z")
Jonas Salk ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/11 "2015-11-20T16:09:36Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Both Gandhi and Mother Teresa will get you strong negative reactions by many who have knowledge of their lives. On the other hand, even those people should understand the shorthand and anyone who takes “She thinks she’s Mother Teresa or something” as an invitation for a lecture can be safely ignored anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/12 "2015-11-20T16:10:27Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > Goodness and virtue are much more relative than evil. It’s a lot more difficult to get people to agree on what constitutes are “purely good” person than a “purely evil” person. > > In terms of pure numbers, it’s hard to argue that Norman Borlaug shouldn’t be near the top of the list. Yes, but as I interpret the OP, he wasn’t asking who _genuinely was_ a good person, so much as someone who is a widely regarded example or symbol of a good person. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/13 "2015-11-20T16:17:18Z")
In some contexts, Jesus works as “a shorthand for, or represents the ultimate symbol of” good (e.g. as in WWJD). But with Jesus, the divinity aspect complicates matters, plus there’s the taint of all the not-so-good that has been done in his name. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/14 "2015-11-20T16:22:58Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > In terms of pure numbers, it’s hard to argue that Norman Borlaug shouldn’t be near the top of the list. > [@CT\_Damsel](#): > > Jonas Salk Their research may have saved many lives, but I doubt that all that many people these days would even recognize their names, let alone what they did. And although I know who they were I don’t know enough offhand about their lives to know if they were exemplary human beings. If you told someone that they were as good a person as Norman Borlaug the reaction would probably be confusion rather than being flattered. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/15 "2015-11-20T16:24:33Z")
That unknown Chinese kid who stood in front of the tanks in Tiananmen Square. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/16 "2015-11-20T16:26:25Z")
> [@Trom](#): > > Mr. Rogers My first thought. ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/17 "2015-11-20T16:27:58Z")
Before I opened this thread, just from reading the title, I decided on Fred Rogers. Mostly because he liked me just the way I am. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/18 "2015-11-20T16:42:38Z")
What happens if we limit it to living persons? Any suggestions? Aung San Suu Kyi? Jimmy Carter? ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/19 "2015-11-20T16:47:02Z")
Saint Francis of Assisi. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084/20 "2015-11-20T17:57:34Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > If you told someone that they were as good a person as Norman Borlaug the reaction would probably be confusion rather than being flattered. That’s a function of public ignorance rather than a comment on the impactfulness of Borlaug’s work. However, I did skim the OP and see that he wants a “symbol” for goodness and it’s true that even though Borlaug is credited with saving a billion people from starving to death, most people do not know who he is or what he did. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-hitler-is-to-evil-x-is-to-good/738084.md?page=2)