# As if New Orleans needed another blow to morale... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 24, 2005, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652 "2005-10-24T13:47:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2005, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/21 "2005-10-24T21:02:56Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > I thought it was because he wasn’t going to be allowed to move the Vikings to his hometown. Perhaps the Minnedopers can clarify. I think that it has to do with a soul owning clause with the Metrodump. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2005, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/22 "2005-10-24T21:03:34Z")
I’d like to step in here as an Angeleno and state for the record that the Los Angeles Basin doesn’t need any stinkin’ professional football. You can keep your Vikings, **Nurse Carmen** , I don’t want 'em. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2005, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/23 "2005-10-24T22:11:21Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > I’d like to step in here as an Angeleno and state for the record that the Los Angeles Basin doesn’t need any stinkin’ professional football. You can keep your Vikings, **Nurse Carmen** , I don’t want 'em. What s/he said. Doubly so if someone is proposing dropping a new Los Angeles football stadium in downtown L.A. – traffic is already wretched enough whenever the Lakers play… ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/24 "2005-10-25T01:54:50Z")
It’s not just the Saints. I read today that the Hornets are almost certain to permanently move to Okalhoma City, of all places, next season, after playing most of their “home” games there this year. ---
**Author:** ![Notorious\_Nik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/858c86/32.png) [@Notorious\_Nik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Notorious_Nik)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/25 "2005-10-25T02:03:37Z")
The NFL has blinders on with regards to Los Angeles. They’ve had two teams, and couldn’t support either one. I realize it’s the number 2 TV market in the country, but that’s really all they’ve got. A lot of people that could watch, but not a lot that will. As long as LA has the Lakers and the Dodgers, they don’t need another NFL team. ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/26 "2005-10-25T06:33:21Z")
> [@fetus](#): > > I agree that New Orleans, the NFL, its players and its fans really don’t need this. Greedy owners are a fact of life these days…I just hope it doesn’t get too bad down there. [speaking as a shareholder in The Green Bay Packers, Inc.] One more reason to love the Packer’s organization. Should the team ever fold, all assets go directly to a small town VFW hall. And just to get it off my chest, fuck Edinger. I just knew a former Bear would find some way to hose us. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/27 "2005-10-25T13:48:17Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > What s/he said. Doubly so if someone is proposing dropping a new Los Angeles football stadium in downtown L.A. – traffic is already wretched enough whenever the Lakers play… I would think that the days of building stadiums and ballparks in urban areas is over. It just never made sense to begin with. Here in New England they did it right with the Pats. Foxborough is close enough that everybody from the city can get there to see a game, but it’s out of the way enough that the traffic headaches are minimalized. Now, if we could only get them to tear down the greem monster… ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/28 "2005-10-25T15:37:47Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > I would think that the days of building stadiums and ballparks in urban areas is over. It just never made sense to begin with. Here in New England they did it right with the Pats. Foxborough is close enough that everybody from the city can get there to see a game, but it’s out of the way enough that the traffic headaches are minimalized. Agreed. Similar to Gillette Stadium, the new Giants Stadium I went on about in the linked thread will be built out of the city (state!) right next to the current stadium. Sadly, we never managed to get rid of the moochers…the Jets muscled their way into the new stadium for the next 99 years. Hopefully those cheap bastards won’t float the cost for a roof. The New York Giants playing in a dome would be a crime against humanity. Regarding the OP, don’t hate on the Saints too much when they move. Sure, it would be nice if the Saints could stay, as I’m sure many residents are fans. But that’s not what should be focused on for the foreseeable future. The city is crippled. The last thing they should be worrying about is supporting an NFL team. And I don’t know where all the righteous indignation comes from, to be honest. An NFL team does not support a city. The city supports the team, and in return the team _represents_ the city. If a city can no longer support a team, which NO is clearly no longer able to do, then they shouldn’t have one. ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/29 "2005-10-25T16:43:19Z")
> [@Notorious Nik](#): > > The NFL has blinders on with regards to Los Angeles. They’ve had two teams, and couldn’t support either one. They supported both of them. The issue had to do with new stadiums. The teams both wanted new stadiums, and neither Los Angeles nor Anaheim were going to build them for them, so they up and left. It’s the same reason that LA still doesn’t have teams, the city refused to pay for a new stadium for the expansion team, so Houston got it instead. Good for LA. Let the lesser, insecure cities knuckle under and give precious city funds to billionaire owners. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/30 "2005-10-25T17:06:57Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > I would think that the days of building stadiums and ballparks in urban areas is over. It just never made sense to begin with. Here in New England they did it right with the Pats. Foxborough is close enough that everybody from the city can get there to see a game, but it’s out of the way enough that the traffic headaches are minimalized. Now, if we could only get them to tear down the greem monster… Oh, I couldn’t disagree more, at least from a local perspective. Here in Baltimore, Camden Yards and Ravens Stadium anchor one end of the Inner Harbor and are a wonderful compliment to the city. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/31 "2005-10-25T17:13:54Z")
It would seem that not everyone here has attended a game in Foxboro. If a game is a sellout, it takes 2 solid hours to clear everyone onto Route 1. There is no commercial or community growth in the area attributable to the stadium, either - no restaurants or even hotels that wouldn’t have been there already. If the stadium had been built in South Boston, next to the Convention Center and the I-93 access road as well as within walking distance of the Silver Line and Red Line, it would take less time to get in and out, and there’d be some serious spinoff growth due to it. But the stadium in the boonies is just that, nothing more. ---
**Author:** ![howdysanta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3be4f8/32.png) [@howdysanta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/howdysanta)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2005, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/32 "2005-10-25T17:42:28Z")
Did you even bother reading the Baltimore Sun Article or did you just stick to the “facts” from the Saints page? If you had read the article you would see… “For years, economists with no stake in the success of the NFL or NCAA, or the local politicians or chambers of commerce, have debunked the myth of the “economic impact” of big sports projects…” “For the most recent game [Superbowl] in New Orleans for which the numbers were analyzed, the 1997 game, again assuming a $300 million boost, income was actually $33.7 million. After expenses, the actual economic impact on the city was $200,000. The most recent Final Four in New Orleans that Matheson and Baade analyzed, in 1993, was worse: The expectation was between $75 million and $100 million, but it brought in $29.3 million of income, barely breaking even. The 1987 Final Four lost money for the city.” In short, major league sports franchises claim to bring in a lot of money but they don’t… > [@BabaBooey](#): > > Oh, and: > > “In 2002 the New Orleans Saints pumped a total of $402.17 million of new dollars into the New Orleans and Louisiana economies. That total was made up of $181.10 million of direct spending and $221.17 million of secondary spending.” > > " Leading off: the 2002 Super Bowl at the Superdome, infusing $350 million into the local economy. Closing it out: the 2004 Sugar Bowl and its $250 million-plus worth of impact." > [http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/bal-sp.steele15sep15,1,2132783.column?coll=bal-home-columnists](http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/bal-sp.steele15sep15,1,2132783.column?coll=bal-home-columnists) > > [http://www.neworleanssaints.com/docs/02noseconimpact-cover\_summary.doc](http://www.neworleanssaints.com/docs/02noseconimpact-cover_summary.doc) ---
**Author:** ![Creative\_Munster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/919ad9/32.png) [@Creative\_Munster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Creative_Munster)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2005, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/33 "2005-10-27T12:00:47Z")
[QUOTE=fetus] Have you ever _been_ to San Antonio? Yecch!QUOTE] It’s been about a decade since I was last in San Antonio, but I liked the people and the city when I was there. What is, in your opinion, wrong with the city? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2005, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/34 "2005-10-27T19:47:09Z")
:shrug: Have you ever been to Cincinnati? Brace yourselves, Angelenos - [you might be getting the Saints permanently](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/26/AR2005102602322.html). ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/35 "2005-10-28T16:19:40Z")
> [@fetus](#): > > Have you ever _been_ to San Antonio? Yecch! Hey, there’s nothing wrong with San Antonio. It’s a really nice town. Having said that, I’ll also add that it is a Dallas Cowboys town and the Saints ain’t gonna march in. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/36 "2005-10-28T16:31:59Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > :shrug: Have you ever been to Cincinnati? > > Brace yourselves, Angelenos - [you might be getting the Saints permanently](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/26/AR2005102602322.html). Dammit, what do I have to do to make myself clear? I said right in post #22 to this thread, that we don’t need any stinkin’ professional football in the Los Angeles Basin. If those NFL dillweeds can’t comprehend a simple post on the SDMB, maybe they’ll comprehend my boot up their asses. Sheesh. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/37 "2005-10-28T16:39:23Z")
> [@Weirddave](#): > > Oh, I couldn’t disagree more, at least from a local perspective. Here in Baltimore, Camden Yards and Ravens Stadium anchor one end of the Inner Harbor and are a wonderful compliment to the city. Yeah. That’s why I’m looking forward to the Nats’ new stadium - down at the edge of town. And even if it brings nothing to the neighborhood, it’s a shitty neighborhood, so it’s not like a stadium could make it _worse_. ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2005, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652/38 "2005-10-28T16:52:45Z")
> [@John Corrado](#): > > And even if it brings nothing to the neighborhood, it’s a shitty neighborhood, so it’s not like a stadium could make it _worse_. Developers are already buying up property around the proposed stadium/waterfront site and starting to build nice condos and lofts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/as-if-new-orleans-needed-another-blow-to-morale/327652.md?page=1)