# Ashamed of being an American? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 13, 2018, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833 "2018-07-13T08:36:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/61 "2018-07-14T19:17:38Z")
Stephen Miller is in his mid thirties. Richard Spencer just turned forty. I didn’t see a lot of wrinkled faces in the crowd at the nazi bbq in Charlottesville last August either. ---
**Author:** ![Kennedy1960](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ccd318/32.png) [@Kennedy1960](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kennedy1960)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/62 "2018-07-14T19:21:12Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Stephen Miller is in his mid thirties. Richard Spencer just turned forty. I didn’t see a lot of wrinkled faces in the crowd at the nazi bbq in Charlottesville last August either. And that crowd was, what? 20, 30k out of a population of 300 million. Gotta have faith man. It’s gonna take time. But my generation will solve things. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/63 "2018-07-14T19:35:21Z")
Faith is the one thing we can’t afford. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/64 "2018-07-14T19:35:35Z")
Ha, faith. I have no such faith. Too many Americans think that the problem is just Trump and will go away when he does, or that your system of checks and balances is functional and things will fix themselves, or that It Couldn’t Happen There in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/65 "2018-07-14T20:52:15Z")
> [@Kennedy1960](#): > > And that crowd was, what? 20, 30k out of a population of 300 million. > > Gotta have faith man. It’s gonna take time. But my generation will solve things. There are times to have faith, but this is not one of those times. Not when people in power are trying to destroy the institutions that make democracy work. Action and vigilance are more productive than faith. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2018, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/66 "2018-07-14T22:11:48Z")
Am I ashamed of my country? No. PARTS of it? Yes. Over all, no. Trump is an embarassment, but we’ve been through worse, we’ll survive. (And as for Nixon, the guy was a paranoid narcissist. He was just smarter, sneakier and had more experience than Trump. Don’t kid yourselves that he was merely a “flawed man”. This is the dude who said, “If the president does it, it is not illegal.” He was also a serious racist and an anti-semite to boot.) > [@Huey\_Freeman](#): > > I love these British white folk. While Churchill was indeed a great leader, he was quite the racist himself. Not to mention a major imperialist. Mind you, he was a product of his time, but don’t pretend Churchill was this raging progressive. And while I won’t deny that Britain is right about Trump, they aren’t any better. They have just as many skeletons in their closet as we do. ---
**Author:** ![Warm\_blood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/df705f/32.png) [@Warm\_blood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Warm_blood)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/67 "2018-07-15T00:28:48Z")
> [@Kennedy1960](#): > > And the fact that over 60% of our people disapprove of him speaks to our goodness as a nation. Meaning that at least a third of your population think he’s doing a fine job. That’s a disturbingly high amount of supporters for a disturbingly bad president. > [@Kennedy1960](#): > > His supporters are mainly old people, and all due respect to the elderly, but when they die, a lot of the poison will die with them. Give it ten, twenty years and you’ll see a very different GOP. Demographics are changing. Hispanics, and Hispanic/White mixes will make up the new majority. Millenials and Gen Z are projected to be more left wing in both parties. Hispanics aren’t going to mistreat Mexicans, nor will they mistreat Whites or Blacks as most Hispanics have a bit of both in them. As such, racism will fade. Trump is not so much a symptom as he is the last, desperate gasp of older WASP people afraid of the future, who want to destroy the country and drink Liberal tears rather than accept the fact that they’re losing, that they’re dying out, that people are done with Evangelical Christianity and homophobia. They realize they lost the culture wars, and like children having a fit, they’d prefer to burn down this country than accept defeat. > > My only wish is that the next generation was more Liberal and less Socialistic. But that’s neither here nor there. You seriously believe bigotry is the sole province of the Boomers? Do you have any idea how many generations before you have espoused that same idea, that when old people die out, so will their ideas? This is a stunningly naive and ahistorical take. Bigots raise children and pass down their bigoted beliefs to them. Some will reject their parents’ teachings and become champions of the progressive causes their elders warned them about, but many more will simply carry on their ancestors’ hateful legacy. Millennial white men by and large still lean conservative: [https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/03/21/a-bright-spot-for-republicans-among-millennials-young-white-men/?utm\_term=.dd900186068c](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/03/21/a-bright-spot-for-republicans-among-millennials-young-white-men/?utm_term=.dd900186068c) White supremacy doesn’t have an age or generational limit, unfortunately. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/68 "2018-07-15T01:07:25Z")
To the OP. Why do you even ask? What do you hope to read? Yeah, maybe some college students are going around ranting how they hate being americans but for the most part Americans are still proud of their country and most things about it. If this country was truly the shit hole some think it is we wouldnt be having to build walls to keep people out. We’d be building walls to keep people in. So would you prefer to live in China? How about Russia? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/69 "2018-07-15T05:34:35Z")
Why don’t you “love it or leave it types” ever mention countries like Canada or Germany or Holland or Norway or something? It’s always Russia or China with you guys. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/70 "2018-07-15T07:23:13Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > To > So would you prefer to live in China? How about Russia? The Chinese have pulled nearly a billion people out of abject poverty in the last 3 decades and are now the center of world trade and finance. Dude, you can love your own country and be proud of her, without shitting on others. You do know that? ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/71 "2018-07-15T08:15:58Z")
> [@Kennedy1960](#): > > Alright, so you’re basically trolling. Understood. Kennedy, irs against the rules here to accuse another poster of trolling. If you must do so please do it in the BBQ Pit. This is an official warning. Please don’t do so again. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/72 "2018-07-15T09:24:24Z")
IMO either only those who voted for (or defend) Trump should be ashamed, or all humans should be. I don’t understand apportioning blame by birth location. And, as much as I want to lean towards the former, psychologically-speaking I do feel a little ashamed actually, despite being a Brit living in China. I belong to a species capable of hella dumb. ---
**Author:** ![Hiker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3be4f8/32.png) [@Hiker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hiker)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/73 "2018-07-15T10:18:14Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > To the OP. > > Why do you even ask? > > What do you hope to read? > > Yeah, maybe some college students are going around ranting how they hate being americans but for the most part Americans are still proud of their country and most things about it. If this country was truly the shit hole some think it is we wouldnt be having to build walls to keep people out. We’d be building walls to keep people in. > > So would you prefer to live in China? How about Russia? Your post would be more to the point if the OP had asked “Are you glad to be an American?”. People in America still do - on average - enjoy more freedom and wealth than people in most other parts of the world. That is the reason why many want to come to your country, and it would be a valid reason to be glad to already be there. But is it also a reason to be proud? To me that sounds like someone being proud of the fortune he entirely inherited from daddy. ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/74 "2018-07-15T11:10:10Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > If this country was truly the shit hole some think it is we wouldnt be having to build walls to keep people out. You don’t \*have \*to build walls to keep people out. You want to, there is a difference, hence the shithole. ---
**Author:** ![survinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@survinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/survinga)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/75 "2018-07-15T11:56:30Z")
> [@JB99](#): > > I’m ashamed. Our country is evil. I can’t even try to defend it anymore. Evil? No, we’re not an evil country. Currently, we made a huge mistake that we’ll have to correct in 2020. There is a problem in the Republican party that we’ll have to work through, and overcome somehow. But we’re not evil. Nazi Germany was evil, as was Stalinist Russia, and China under Mao. I think we’re still fundamentally a good country that is working through some issues. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/76 "2018-07-15T15:10:13Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > To the OP. > > Why do you even ask? > > What do you hope to read? > > Yeah, maybe some college students are going around ranting how they hate being americans but for the most part Americans are still proud of their country and most things about it. If this country was truly the shit hole some think it is we wouldnt be having to build walls to keep people out. We’d be building walls to keep people in. > > So would you prefer to live in China? How about Russia? I’m very comfortable here in the US, but I’m a white male. With only a high school education and poor at the moment… but I’m safe and have a roof over my head. I can talk to you fine folks with my wi-fi and play my Nintendo afterwards. What **The Tooth** said about America hurts me almost, (because their perspective seems valid). I’m a social democrat, (I think that’s the technical term,) and it frightened me to read that our youth’s boys are swinging more conservative. I went to Bernie rallies and saw all types of people there. I think, as a white male, they feel threatened. I mean, especially since YouTube is probably more popular than TV these days; You get a lot of content creators cherry picking crazy people on the left, usually on college campuses, saying things that are a little extreme. And their egos think that every leftist is wrapped up in hating white males because they were born that way… I actually asked because of privilege. I THINK I was born innocent, but the society I grew up in gave me privilege. I guess we need to change that. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/77 "2018-07-15T15:18:32Z")
Ugh… What I just posted was a rough draft of my thoughts… I was going to build, add and possibly cut some of it. I posted it by mistake. I asked because this is Straight Dope, and I don’t want people to sugar-coat the answer. I also would love to hear how we can make ourselves better. Finding a way of making our own energy would be helpful. ---
**Author:** ![JB99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JB99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JB99)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/78 "2018-07-15T15:53:20Z")
> [@survinga](#): > > Evil? No, we’re not an evil country. > > Currently, we made a huge mistake that we’ll have to correct in 2020. There is a problem in the Republican party that we’ll have to work through, and overcome somehow. > > But we’re not evil. Nazi Germany was evil, as was Stalinist Russia, and China under Mao. I think we’re still fundamentally a good country that is working through some issues. 61 million Americans heard this: > [@](#): > > Yeah, that’s her. With the gold. I better use some Tic Tacs just in case I start kissing her. You know, I’m automatically attracted to beautiful — I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait. And when you’re a star, they let you do it. You can do anything… Grab ’em by the pussy. You can do anything. And said, “Yes, this is the man I want leading our country.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/79 "2018-07-15T15:55:27Z")
You do them too much credit assuming they know about historical events other than the Northern War of Aggression. ---
**Author:** ![Parkerized](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@Parkerized](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Parkerized)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2018, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833/80 "2018-07-15T19:47:40Z")
> [@MyFootsZZZ](#): > > We’re in bed with some sketchy people, we’re spying on our own citizens, and… Trump and his backers. > > Anyone not particularly proud to be an American? Anyone ashamed? How long have you felt that way? Speak for yourself. Unless you are a Democrat. In which case, you are forgiven. Still, it is a shame, if not shameful. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashamed-of-being-an-american/817833.md?page=5)