# Ashcroft declares all out war on the REAL threat to America! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 6, 2004, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645 "2004-04-06T23:42:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/21 "2004-04-07T05:01:22Z")
C’mon, guys, General Ripper–I mean the Attorney General, is just helping to make sure no one saps or impurifies our precious bodily fluids. Quit horsing around and get on board, why dontcha. Anyway, looks like I’ve got a metric crapload of downloading to do. Later. ---
**Author:** ![MeanJoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanjoe/32/5693_2.png) [@MeanJoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanJoe)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/22 "2004-04-07T06:22:56Z")
New Bumper Sticker! “Hey John! You’ll get my porn when you pry it from my warm, sticky fingers!” MeanJoe ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/23 "2004-04-07T06:30:33Z")
That what the Bush administration is really aiming for is fascist control over the country. ---
**Author:** ![DoctorJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctorj/32/2904_2.png) [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/24 "2004-04-07T06:57:41Z")
I think it’s great how Ashcroft and the uniquely confused brand of Republican that supports him will go on for hours about “freedom” and how important it is to defend our freedom, but when it comes to individual, actual freedoms, they’re the first to yell out in protest. The freedom to watch consentually produced pornography in the privacy of your own home? Nope. The freedom to use recreational drugs in the privacy of your own home? Nope. The freedom to terminate an unwanted pregnancy? Nope. (Yeah, I know that one’s more complicated than that.) The freedom to live as a family with a partner who happens to be of the same sex? Hell no. The freedom to practice your religion? Sure, as long as you’re the right religion. So when they talk about “freedom”, what the hell are they talking about? The freedom to buy stuff? ---
**Author:** ![Abbie\_Carmichael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/49beb7/32.png) [@Abbie\_Carmichael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Abbie_Carmichael)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/25 "2004-04-07T07:01:58Z")
I’m probably going to regret posting this but here goes … **He is a devout Pentacostal, and I’ve known a few of those in my day. Dancing isn’t the only no no.** _chokes on ice water_ Pentecostals don’t dance? Say what? Ever read the book of Acts? What on earth do I see people at my church do at pretty much every single service? It ain’t bowling they’re doin in the aisles, hon. And another thing: Ashcroft’s denomination is [Assembly of God](http://www.ag.org/top/). The word “pentecostal” is a generic term these days for pretty much any Christian church that acknowledges the baptism of the Holy Spirit. You can be a pentecostal Catholic, pentecostal Baptist, etc. And if you’ll actually look into what they believe, you’ll find that they don’t oppose dancing per se, just the stuff that it can lead to (dunno about you but I’ve seen more than just handholding and fruit punch at the dances I’ve been to). _I’m_ not opposed to dancing, nor am I a member of the AoG denomination, but from what I’ve seen of “dancing” these days, I’d just as soon not look like a hooker on the dance floor, so I can understand why some denominations would be opposed to going to social dances. It’s not that dancing is bad (who could make an argument against ballet with a straight face?), it’s just that the particular brand of dancing we’re seeing today is, well, disgusting. How could I expect someone to take me seriously when I talk about how God has changed my life, when there is absolutely nothing in my life that shows that there has been a change? I couldn’t, and apparently lots of other people couldn’t as well, and that’s why they choose to abstain from certain things. If modern dancing ever became a bit more modest, I imagine they’d partake again. Kinda hard to jitterbug to Eminem, though. All but the very, VERY strictest pentecostals are cool with dancing, and the vast majority of them do not oppose makeup and female church leaders and the like. (A friend in high school belonged to a REALLY weird pentecostal sect that pretty much didn’t allow anything, and it didn’t “take” with her, either.) As far as secular music and movies, it’s really not a “oooh we can’t listen to music that doesn’t mention God every 5 seconds, we’ll go to hell if we do” thing. It’s more like a “we prefer not to listen to music that has cuss words in every line” kind of thing. It’s not a secular vs. religious music thing. It’s about what the lyrics are saying. Same with movies. If Hollywood were to start making family-friendly movies, I imagine they’d do quite well with most Christians. We like to party, too, just on our own terms. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/26 "2004-04-07T07:29:56Z")
myself, when I see those kids “freaking” (as it is called) I think, man, we can’t lose…fundamentalism is history in the face of this organized army of hormone crazed teenagers… well, maybe brother ashcroft will grab the wrong snake… except for that the snake what bites him will die first… ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/27 "2004-04-07T07:59:35Z")
> [@Abbie Carmichael](#): > > but from what I’ve seen of “dancing” these days, I’d just as soon not look like a hooker on the dance floor, so I can understand why some denominations would be opposed to going to social dances. It’s not that dancing is bad (who could make an argument against ballet with a straight face?), it’s just that the particular brand of dancing we’re seeing today is, well, disgusting. And it’s disgusting because…? It’s all that Elvis’ fault… all that gyrating and hip-wiggling. It just wasn’t _proper_. And the kids today- actually TOUCHING while dancing! And not just their hands! We’re on the verge of a catastrophic moral collapse, and it’s all because of _dancing_. QUOTE=Abbie Carmichael]As far as secular music and movies, it’s really not a “oooh we can’t listen to music that doesn’t mention God every 5 seconds, we’ll go to hell if we do” thing. It’s more like a “we prefer not to listen to music that has cuss words in every line” kind of thing. [/QUOTE] Look, dear: you can buy every single album in Billboard’s Top 40 at your friendly neighborhood WalMart, and there won’t be a moment’s worth of swearing in any of them. Here’s the thing, though… there wasn’t a moment’s worth of swearing in most of them _to begin with_. ---
**Author:** ![Erasticity](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3e96dc/32.png) [@Erasticity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erasticity)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/28 "2004-04-07T10:04:58Z")
Make SEX itself illegal. That wil give a big boost to cloning research because one day in the future, the asskrofts of the world are going to look around and realise that … WAIT A MINUTE! Why is there no successor to my job position? for that matter, who’s paying the taxes around here? For that matter, again, why are all the teachers (still able to teach) unemployed? Procreation, much to the chagrin of the Asskrofts of America, still requires the transfer of (oh the moral travesty!) bodily fluids. — I swear, spending 12 years in Europe really gives you an interesting perspective on some of the sillier elements of the Great Corporation : USA. I sometimes wonder that it isn’t a law in America to cover women from head to toe, ala Shiara (sp?). America = embrace violence, Reject sex/skin. (always reminds me of Granny Weatherwax, this American morality…) ---
**Author:** ![Martiju](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e8c25b/32.png) [@Martiju](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martiju)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/29 "2004-04-07T10:46:40Z")
> [@MeanJoe](#): > > New Bumper Sticker! > > “Hey John! You’ll get my porn when you pry it from my warm, sticky fingers!” > > MeanJoe Come on guys, give this one the credit it deserves!! 😃 **wipes pieces of orange from screen** ---
**Author:** ![SentientMeat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@SentientMeat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SentientMeat)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/30 "2004-04-07T11:49:05Z")
Bravo, **MeanJoe**. I’ve heard Charlton Heston does it with a tourniquet around his wrist so it feels like someone else. _My cold, dead hand_. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Sarang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jack\_Sarang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Sarang)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/31 "2004-04-07T12:20:18Z")
> [@SentientMeat](#): > > Bravo, **MeanJoe**. > > I’ve heard Charlton Heston does it with a tourniquet around his wrist so it feels like someone else. Urban Myth. Doesn’t work… probably. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/32 "2004-04-07T12:35:03Z")
Anyone else find it hypocritical that a party dedicated to protecting your second amendment rights to have a handgun isn’t interested in protecting your first amendment rights to whack off to visual stimulation in the privacy of your own home? ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/33 "2004-04-07T12:46:21Z")
> [@laigle](#): > > Why? Are you saying that arresting people for the common activity of viewing readily available material shouldn’t be a topic of debate? It’s a worthy topic; however… IMHO, There’s not a lot of debate going on here. A whole lot of griping though. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/34 "2004-04-07T13:12:17Z")
> [@SimonX](#): > > It’s a worthy topic; however… > > IMHO, > There’s not a lot of debate going on here. A whole lot of griping though. > YMMV. Not our fault no one is defending it. I think we’ve moved on to debating how batshit insane Ashcroft is. My position on the topic: Very. Whenever you’re considered “hardcore” by fundamental Christians, that is pretty damn scary - especially when you’re one of the highest ranking members of the government. I bet Ashcroft feels uncomfortable around Condi Rice. > [@Really Not All That Bright](#): > > Look, dear: you can buy every single album in Billboard’s Top 40 at your friendly neighborhood WalMart, and there won’t be a moment’s worth of swearing in any of them. Here’s the thing, though… there wasn’t a moment’s worth of swearing in most of them to begin with. Well, to be fair, I don’t think fundies are too keen on Britney. Bad taste in religion does not mean bad taste in music. 😉 (joking, sheesh) Besides, there’s way too much sexual reference for them. ---
**Author:** ![MeanJoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanjoe/32/5693_2.png) [@MeanJoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanJoe)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/35 "2004-04-07T13:15:58Z")
**SentientMeat & Martiju** - Thanks! To be honest, I was a little surprised that someone else hadn’t posted that yet. 🙂 I really have to wonder about this policy and the American public’s awareness level. I consider myself fairly well informed in terms of what is in the news each day and it is pretty rare that I encounter something that I’ve not at the least seen a headline in the paper or online, or in the crawl on CNN. Yet I’ve not heard a peep about this one. Lost in the noise of Iraq and the election? Considering the lack of this thing making the news, it kind of makes it hard to justify the position that we have a “liberal media”, eh kids? Afterall, if our media was liberal as certain types of Republicans insist - wouldn’t they be up in arms over this? A better question is - why aren’t they up in arms over this regardless of any perceived bias?? MeanJoe ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/36 "2004-04-07T13:26:40Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > Vote the bastards out. Vote the bastards out. Let that be your mantra. > > Ashcroft is the most frightening man to ever hold high public office in the United States. He absolutely **knows** what is best for you and for me because God damn well tells him so. > > GWB makes me nauseous; Ashcroft makes my blood run cold. Well fuckin’ told, my friend. This guy is evil personified. A man _that_ fucked up in the head should never be allowed to hold public office. I picture him kneeling in front of an alter, flogging himself with chains and calling a Jesus statue “daddy.” Considering he once lost an election to a dead guy, I think the people have spoken. ---
**Author:** ![London\_Calling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@London\_Calling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/London_Calling)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/37 "2004-04-07T13:32:18Z")
> [@Kalhoun](#): > > Considering he once lost an election to a dead guy, I think the people have spoken. Well, it speaks volumes about the system of Government. Ashcroft isn’t elected, his is a presidential appointment, right ? ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/38 "2004-04-07T13:50:46Z")
> [@London\_Calling](#): > > Well, it speaks volumes about the system of Government. > > Ashcroft isn’t elected, his is a presidential appointment, right ? Yes, he’s appointed. But you’d think Dubya would have read the election thing as an indicator that his man isn’t exactly America’s cup o’ tea. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/39 "2004-04-07T13:53:41Z")
> [@Kalhoun](#): > > Yes, he’s appointed. But you’d think Dubya would have read the election thing as an indicator that his man isn’t exactly America’s cup o’ tea. Since when did Dubya care about elections? :-p ---
**Author:** ![CTB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9a140/32.png) [@CTB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CTB)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2004, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645/40 "2004-04-07T14:00:45Z")
If Ashcroft and the administration is willing to put this policy forward in an election year, just try to imagine what will be attempted in a second term where reelection is not a concern. :eek: Once we get these guys out of office, it is time to clean the house of all the folks who accepted the appointment of this f\*cking nutjob. Is it too far out to imagine the “new and improved” DOJ attempting to limit your arts, you rmusic, and yes, your dance? I don’t know if they would succeed, but I can definitely see him try it. What I hear from some folks I know at DOJ, most of those lawyers with a shred of sanity and decency are throwing up their hands and leaving the department in droves, leaving spaces open for zealots who believe as Ashcrft does. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashcroft-declares-all-out-war-on-the-real-threat-to-america/238645.md?page=3)