# Ashton Kutcher and Punctuation **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 13, 2003, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840 "2003-08-13T05:21:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Skott](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Skott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skott)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/1 "2003-08-13T05:21:36Z")
Am I wrong in thinking that the title of the new Ashton Kutcher vehicle, [My Boss’s Daughter](http://us.imdb.com/Title?0270980), should be less an “s”? ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/2 "2003-08-13T05:23:56Z")
Nope. The only acceptable time to omit the possessive ‘s’ is when doing the possessive of a plural, e.g.: “My bosses’ daughters.” ---
**Author:** ![RealTronic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9dc877/32.png) [@RealTronic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealTronic)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/3 "2003-08-13T05:49:56Z")
Just to clarify: The title is correct, because there is an additional syllable added in the possessive form. That extra syllable is what decides whether or not to add the s or not. Examples: the class’s and the witness’s but the classes’ and the witnesses’ (sorry, my examples are all singularplural pairs, but the rule is if the word ends in a pronounced “s” - and I can’t think of one that is singular right now…) ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/4 "2003-08-13T06:22:42Z")
_The Chicago Manual of Style_ adds: > [@](#): > > Traditional exceptions to the general rule for forming the possessive are the names _Jesus_ and _Moses:_ > > in Jesus’ name > Moses’ leadership ---
**Author:** ![SolGrundy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbce88/32.png) [@SolGrundy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SolGrundy)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/5 "2003-08-13T07:08:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by friedo \* > \*\*Nope. > > The only acceptable time to omit the possessive ‘s’ is when doing the possessive of a plural, e.g.: “My bosses’ daughters.” \*\* That’s not the way I heard it. I was taught that the possessive for singular words ending in _s_ could be written either way – both “my boss’ daughter” and “my boss’s daughter” are acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/6 "2003-08-13T07:11:26Z")
SolGrundy, can you quote an authoratative source? ---
**Author:** ![soulmurk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b782af/32.png) [@soulmurk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/soulmurk)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/7 "2003-08-13T07:42:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zoe \* > \*\*SolGrundy, can you quote an authoratative source? \*\* From [Webster](http://webster.commnet.edu/grammar/possessives.htm). > [@](#): > > …the NYPL Guide also suggests that when a word ends in a double s, we’re better off writing its possessive with only an apostrophe: the boss’ memo, the witness’ statement. Many writers insist, however, that we actually hear an “es” sound attached to the possessive forms of these words, so an apostrophe -s is appropriate: boss’s memo, witness’s statement. If the look of the three s’s in a row doesn’t bother you, use that construction. Your guess is as good as mine as to who these writers are and why their insistence makes any difference, but both do seem to be acceptable at least in regards to words that end in a double s. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/8 "2003-08-13T13:00:19Z")
**SolGrundy** , you do know that the term “Webster” is in the public domain now, and anybody can publish under that name? It does not necessarily indicate any authority on matters of language or usage. ---
**Author:** ![soulmurk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b782af/32.png) [@soulmurk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/soulmurk)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/9 "2003-08-13T21:27:25Z")
Actually, I posted the link, not **SolGrundy** , but I’m aware that the Webster name doesn’t equal authoratative. The link was given to me by my English professor to refer to when writing papers, the site is maintained by “Professor of English Charles Darling for English courses at Capital Community College,” and the source cited is the “New York Public Library’s _Guide to Style and Usage_.” Authoritative enough for me, but I suppose it’s up for debate. ---
**Author:** ![PiscesPrincess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f1d935/32.png) [@PiscesPrincess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PiscesPrincess)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/10 "2003-08-13T21:58:44Z")
I seem to recall that if Russ has a dog, it is Russ’s dog. But if there is a plural case, e.g. if two dogs have a house, it is the dogs’ house. I’m Canadian though, and I’m the first to admit that Language Arts classes were a looooooooooooooooooooong time ago. ---
**Author:** ![CadburyAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@CadburyAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CadburyAngel)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/11 "2003-08-13T22:52:19Z")
Dogs can own real estate? ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/12 "2003-08-13T23:31:45Z")
Sure. J. Lo owns a house. Back to the OP: I taught ESL for 14 years. The reference from Webster is correct. You can use both boss’ or boss’s. Both are correct. ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2003, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/13 "2003-08-13T23:50:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CadburyAngel \* > \*\*Dogs can own real estate? \*\* [Yes](http://guntherdog.com/guntherabout.htm): > [@](#): > > Gunther the Dog is the beneficiary of a multi-million dollar trust which owns, among other assets, Madonna’s ex-Miami mansion. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/14 "2003-08-14T01:05:24Z")
Neither is _in_correct, but that’s not the same as saying they’re equally correct. " ss’s " is _correct_; " ss’ " is _acceptable_ if someone’s gonna get their undies in a bunch over it. Any editor worth his or her salt will correct the latter in favor of the former. ---
**Author:** ![Wumpus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8c91f0/32.png) [@Wumpus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wumpus)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/15 "2003-08-14T01:09:05Z")
Rule #1 of Strunk and White’s Elements of Style: Form the possesive singular of nouns by adding 's. Follow this rule whatever the final consonant. Thus write: Charles’s friend Burns’s poems The witch’s malice [followed by the usual exceptions for Moses and Jesus.] …This is one of the few things from high school that I remember! ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2003, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/16 "2003-08-14T02:29:51Z")
Huh. I saw this commercial tonight and thought it was wrong too. I’ve was taught that "-s’ " is used when words end in “s” and have always followed that rule. ---
**Author:** ![Sternvogel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bc79bd/32.png) [@Sternvogel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sternvogel)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2003, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ashton-kutcher-and-punctuation/194840/17 "2003-08-15T01:09:45Z")
In addition to Jesus and Moses, Achilles also simply gets the apostrophe appended to his name, at least in the constructions _Achilles’ heel_ and _Achilles’ tendon_.