# Asian Cooking and corn (maize) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 18, 2011, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479 "2011-07-18T19:37:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/21 "2011-07-19T11:12:47Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Yep, it’s all over the place in Europe. Not sure about Italy, but I’ve seen it in Germany, Austria, and Hungary. In fact, Dr. Oetker (a German company) makes a frozen pizza line called “Big Americans”, and you can see corn on their version of the [supreme pizza](http://italyforayear.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/copy-of-pa140569.jpg). And [Here’s a Hungarian pizza joint](http://www.americanpizza.hu/menu.php) called “American Pizza” with several pizza items that contain corn. (look for the word _kukorica_.) You probably don’t want to know what’s on that menu. There’s even a hot dog pizza with mustard and ketchup. _shudder_ I had corn on a pizza last night, standard fare on a vegetarian pizza. You also get corn in tuna salad (bleh). ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/22 "2011-07-19T12:13:40Z")
> [@Arrendajo](#): > > Corn has to have come late to traditional Chinese cooking, in that there couldn’t possibly have been corn in China in any quantity until - WAG - 18th century? This isn’t really a cite, but I read somewhere respectable that corn was first cultivated in China as early as 1555. Interesting foods that grow well in a climate tend to move pretty quickly. I don’t think the new world explanation works very well–I mean, lots of old world cuisines are _defined_ by New World crops: potatoes in Ireland, tomatoes in Italy, peanuts and peppers in Thailand. ---
**Author:** ![Oswald\_Bastable](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oswald_bastable/32/214_2.png) [@Oswald\_Bastable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oswald_Bastable)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/23 "2011-07-19T12:29:04Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Yep, it’s all over the place in Europe. Not sure about Italy… I have not only had sweertcorn on a pizza in Italy, but I’ve had it on a pizza in Naples. As has been said it’s pretty standard on vegetarian pizzas across Europe. In Germany I once had potato in a pizza. OB ---
**Author:** ![Enilno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/58f4c7/32.png) [@Enilno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enilno)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/24 "2011-07-19T13:31:26Z")
Corn is a staple in Northeastern China. Its eaten off the cobb, or ground into cornmeal. There’s a type of [corn bread](http://www.chinainfoonline.com/Chinese_Food/Steamed_Corn_Bread.htm) which is kind of like a big steamed hush puppy, or it can also be made into a porridge. It’s commonly seen as peasants food, eaten when wheat flour wasn’t available. My parents grew up on them. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/25 "2011-07-19T14:04:47Z")
> [@GaryM](#): > > My wife and I have eaten a great deal of Asian food over the years and I’ve realized that corn, or maize of you prefer, is absent. Other than those little baby corn things used in many dishes. Is there no tradition of using full sized corn in their cuisine, or have I just been ordering the wrong dishes? From my personal experience, corn is a fairly rare ingredient in most of the non-Chinese restaurants I’ve been to as well (at least outside of regions where grits and cornbread are quite popular). ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/26 "2011-07-19T16:07:16Z")
> [@Oswald\_Bastable](#): > > I have not only had sweertcorn on a pizza in Italy, but I’ve had it on a pizza in Naples. As has been said it’s pretty standard on vegetarian pizzas across Europe. In Germany I once had potato in a pizza. > > OB Potato is actually a common enough topping in Italy, too. Usually, it comes in the form of a white pizza with rosemary. Very delicious. I’ve actually always thought of potato pizza as being an Italian thing, as I’ve only seen it in Italian-style pizzerias and homemade at Italian friends houses. ---
**Author:** ![Greg\_Charles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/839c29/32.png) [@Greg\_Charles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greg_Charles)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/27 "2011-07-19T17:03:49Z")
Barbequed corn on the cob is popular throughout Viet Nam, but I can’t really remember it used as an ingredient in cooking much. I have a poor memory when it comes to food though, so it may be in some dishes I can’t remember. I don’t know that the new worldness of it makes much difference. Tomatoes are a new world crop, yet are a big part of “traditional” Italian cooking. Also phở, the traditional Vietnamese beef noodle soup, is only about 100 years old. Interestingly, the Vietnamese feel they’ve had corn forever. It shows up in several folk tales, including one about 3rd C. heroine Ba Trieu, who caught an elephant that had been trampling the corn fields, and famously rode it into battle for the rest of her life. While there may have been an elephant that trampled something, it couldn’t possibly have been corn. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/28 "2011-07-19T17:29:38Z")
The use of the word “corn” in such an old folktale might have something to do with the word “corn” being a generic word for “grain” in Merrie Olde England before it was appropriated to refer to _Zea mays_. So… perhaps the elephant was trampling grain (type unspecified) rather than maize. ---
**Author:** ![pancakes3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ba9def/32.png) [@pancakes3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pancakes3)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/29 "2011-07-19T17:53:41Z")
corn is eaten, and even integrated into dishes. it’s called “yu mi” which loosely translates to “western rice”. i’ve seen it mostly on the cob, but also sauteed with ground pork, in egg drop soup, and in breads/pastries/pizza as topping. ---
**Author:** ![Arrendajo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Arrendajo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arrendajo)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/30 "2011-07-19T17:57:16Z")
I would not be surprised if my WAG of 18th century was off by a couple of centuries. I was trying to estimate how long it would take from “first cultivated” to “widespread enough to be common in Chinese cuisine.” China is geographically huge and diverse, and there must be places there where corn grows really well. I have a Chinese propaganda poster from 1965 that shows a woman sorting ears of corn (“select good seeds for increased yields”) and yes, there is a copy of Mao’s little red book peeping from her pocket. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/31 "2011-07-19T18:48:41Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > This isn’t really a cite, but I read somewhere respectable that corn was first cultivated in China as early as 1555. Interesting foods that grow well in a climate tend to move pretty quickly. [Etymonline](http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=corn&searchmode=none), of all sources, agrees. > [@](#): > > Maize was introduced to China by 1550, it thrived where rice did not grow well and was a significant factor in the 18th century population boom there. Not sure what the etymological dictionary’s source is, though. ---
**Author:** ![cuberdon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/45deac/32.png) [@cuberdon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cuberdon)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/32 "2011-07-19T19:46:17Z")
> [@Darryl\_Lict](#): > > I was watching the [Hokkaido](http://eater.com/archives/2011/04/26/no-reservations-japan.php) version of Anthony Bourdain’s No Reservations and he mentioned that the noodles there are traditionally served with corn. I’ve never had it but it sounds delicious. Corn butter miso ramen? Sounds DELICIOUS. ---
**Author:** ![Enilno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/58f4c7/32.png) [@Enilno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enilno)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2011, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/33 "2011-07-19T19:50:42Z")
Here’s an [article](http://www.nal.usda.gov/research/maize/chapter5.shtml) that supports maize being introduced to China in the 16th century based on 16th and 17th century medical and botanical texts. It suggests that maize may have been introduced by trade from the Middle East or India through the Silk Road. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2011, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/34 "2011-07-20T03:16:47Z")
> [@Enilno](#): > > Here’s an [article](http://www.nal.usda.gov/research/maize/chapter5.shtml) that supports maize being introduced to China in the 16th century based on 16th and 17th century medical and botanical texts. It suggests that maize may have been introduced by trade from the Middle East or India through the Silk Road. That would seem rather indirect, considering that at the time, the Spanish controlled both the New World where Corn came from and trade with China. It seems far more likely that the Spanish brought Corn, Peppers, Potatoes and other crops with them to China along with the Silver. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2011, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/35 "2011-07-20T03:34:13Z")
> [@pancakes3](#): > > it’s called “yu mi” which loosely translates to “western rice”. That’s actually a pretty good description. Potato slices on pizza would soak up the excess grease better than napkins while helping you maintain the correct balance of animal fats. ---
**Author:** ![Greg\_Charles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/839c29/32.png) [@Greg\_Charles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greg_Charles)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2011, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/36 "2011-07-20T18:45:01Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > The use of the word “corn” in such an old folktale might have something to do with the word “corn” being a generic word for “grain” in Merrie Olde England before it was appropriated to refer to _Zea mays_. So… perhaps the elephant was trampling grain (type unspecified) rather than maize. Ah, but the Vietnamese tend to tell their folk tales in Vietnamese, not English. The word actually used is bắp when told in the south, and ngô when told in the north. Both of these words have only the maize sense of corn. ---
**Author:** ![Enilno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/58f4c7/32.png) [@Enilno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enilno)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2011, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479/37 "2011-07-20T19:44:39Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > That would seem rather indirect, considering that at the time, the Spanish controlled both the New World where Corn came from and trade with China. It seems far more likely that the Spanish brought Corn, Peppers, Potatoes and other crops with them to China along with the Silver. Yeah Portuguese and later Spanish traders were listed as possible sources, but there aren’t any records. Probably corn would have been introduced multiple times from multiple sources. The gist of the article I linked seems to be that corn spread very quickly laterally from west to east because it’s well suited to growing in the temperate zones. Within a century of Columbus corn was being grown all over Eurasia. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/asian-cooking-and-corn-maize/589479.md?page=1)