How long do chickens live if you do not eat them?
EddyTeddyFreddy, I love the photos. I have a buff kitty who looks almost exactly like Peanut. A few years ago my sister and I were held up at the crossroads by an angry mob of guineas. They surrounded the car and stood on the hood looking “badass”.
A meat-type chicken:
You hatch at a commercial hatchery with zillions of brothers and sisters. You are vaccinated.
You and all your siblings travel to a new place where you are put in a really, really, big room. There is a red light that keeps you warm and all the food and water you could want. There are a lot of you in here, but it is spacious on the shaving-covered floor.
As the next six weeks pass, you and your siblings grow. Since everyone is still young, there aren’t a whole lot of fights, despite there being so many of you in the room. You still have lots of food and water and you can see the outside through the screened walls of the room. (typical in California, but solid walls are more common in colder places)
One day, some humans come and put all of you into travel cages. You are taken by truck to a strange place. It is dark, so you are relatively calm. You are picked up and your ankles are clasped onto a conveyor belt. You dangle upside-down for less than a minute in the dark.
That’s the last thing you remember.
After this point, a moderate electrical charge is applied to the bird’s head, stunning them. They are then exsanguinated by slicing the jugular veins and carotid arteries.
**
An Egg Laying chicken**
You and your brothers and sisters hatch. The boys are sorted into a separate box. They are humanely euthanized.
You and your sisters are vaccinated and placed on a shaving-covered floor in a large room. You stay here for a while, with all the food and water and warm lights like the meat birds, until you are just about ready to go through puberty (about 16 weeks).
At that time, you are all placed into smallish cages, in groups of 3 or 4. The cage bars are wide enough that you can stick your head through to look around at the other cages or to reach the food and water, which are still omnipresent.
You lay eggs.
Depending on the egg market, several things might happen to the egg laying birds after a year in production.
The biology of the birds is such that they need a break in egg production a couple months out of the year to recuperate, or else egg size and number drops. This halting of egg production would happen naturally in the winter if the birds were in the wild. This period is called “molt” because the birds also grow a new coat of feathers at this time.
If the market is good, the producer might delay molt by a week or two to try and optimize profits.
If the market is poorly, he may trigger the birds to go into molt by putting them on a low-calorie ration. The drop in calories, combined with a drop in the the number of hours that the building is lit, fools the bird’s bodies into thinking that it is winter, so they stop laying eggs.
If the market is really poor, he might decided to send the birds to slaughter. The last I heard, the hassle of processing these meat-poor birds was such that farmers had to pay the slaughter plant to take the animals. If sent, these birds would end up in dog food or other secondary places like that.
Either way, very few flocks of birds go through molt twice. So, they live about 2 years in egg production.
Free Range Poultry
Pros: It makes people feel better about being meat-eaters.
Cons:
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The birds are at higher risk of disease. It is very difficult to disinfect the ground, and disease outbreaks tend to persist from year to year as new, immunologically naive birds move in.
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Similarly, it is impossible to keep out disease-carrying wild birds and predators unless the “outdoors” is very carefully controlled. Between these first two, more birds end up suffering and dying than if the bird were kept indoors
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The exact definition of “free range” has not, to my knowledge, been made legally clear. One guy who lets his birds run all over the place, to the damage of the local ecology, is just as free range as the guy who opens a door on the poultry house that leads onto a completely fenced yard for 10 minutes a day.
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“Free Range” usually goes hand in hand with “antibiotic free.” Now, I can understand restricting the use of antibiotics in feed (though the natural stress of being in a big group of animals is bound to cause diarrhea in some, which was the point of giving them antibiotics in their feed in the first place). However, no antibiotic use whatsoever means that if all the birds catch a treatable disease, we can’t treat them. They simply have to be slaughtered and thrown away.
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“free range” also goes hand in hand with “cage free” for egg laying birds. I, personally, feel we could reach a better compromise on exactly how big the cages are. However, placing the birds on the floor massively increases the number of birds that die and the number of eggs that are lost. Egg laying birds get to live a lot longer than meat type birds, which means there are more opportunities for them to pick up some disease and die. Cage free producers provide nest boxes for the birds to lay eggs in, but not all of them use the boxes. Significant numbers of eggs end up getting stepped on or simply covered in feces. On the not-so-rare side, you can get birds who develop a taste for other bird’s eggs. This can grow into a fanatical drive, to the point where the birds start picking at each other’s vents until they’ve opened each other up and are feasting on the tasty innards within.
So, IMHO, there is room for improvement, but there are solid reasons, well grounded in animal welfare, for raising the birds the way we do in both meat and egg production.
If we really want to raise birds in ways that make us feel better about eating them, then we need to go back to everyone keeping their own poultry or we need to accept less efficient production systems, which means more birds will die in order to produce the same number of chicken nuggets. We would also need to accept a higher price for eggs and every product that they go into, like bread.
Another common myth I’d like to dispel: Meat birds are not given hormones. They don’t need it. That rapid growth was achieved through selective breeding.
And while we’re at it: The hormone supplements they give to dairy cows are a synthetic form of COW hormone. It cannot interact with the human receptor, but that doesn’t matter because cows who receive the supplements don’t put any more of that hormone into the milk than they do naturally, and the hormone gets digested like any other protein in your gut, so it couldn’t even get into your bloodstream to not have an effect anyhow.
I think I’ve run out of soapbox. It’s cold down here on the floor. Wish I had a red heat lamp.
Males only fight each other over stuff. Girls, food, space. With enough of these, males are happy to coexist. There can easily be two roosters in the barnyard, though one might be socially lesser than the other in the eyes of the chickens.
What you heard applies to the egg production industry. Males aren’t very good at laying eggs.
Meat farms raise the boys and girls alike. These meat breeds of birds would have bigger health concerns if they lived long enough to reach puberty than to fight with each other.
No. The only difference between the two is whatever microgram of protein that sperm added. Tasty.
Occasionally, eggs will contain a small meat or blood spot. These are bits of the oviduct that got caught up in the egg as it was being made. They are perfectly eatable.
Side note: Brown eggs are not, in any way, nutritionally different from white eggs. Common myth.
I haven’t had the chance to experiment. To do so, I’d have to raise some birds myself (or get some from the guy raising Roosters only nextdoor), kill it and eat it, since anything available at a store will be the quick growing breeds. I’ll report back if I can.
I tried looking up the official stance, but now I can’t find it. It’s somewhere in the early teens, 13-14 years old.
Pullet, thanks for all the fascinating insights. In gratitude, here’s a red heat lamp to keep you warm and cozy while answering our questions. 
A few follow-up questions, if I may
(1) Is there any scientific evidence to indicate that gassing chickens is more humane than the stun & exsanguinate method you described for meat-producers? And what’s this about using a vat of electrified water to stun the birds?
(2)
How are the male chicks euthanized, and what, if anything, is done with the remains?
(3) Based on your comments about free-range chicken production methods I think I know what you’ll say, but just to be sure I’m not reading something into your comments that isn’t there: would free-range chickens be more or less vulnerable to epidemics like avian flu?
Mmmm. Toasty. Thank you.
There is a fair amount of debate going on in the scientific community about exactly which method is most humane. Part of the problem is that chickens and other poultry are fairly stoic creatures. Something that would surely be painful to a person seems to just sort of make them sleepy. That makes it hard to assess exactly how stressful the method is.
[spoiler]For example, I only recently perfected my skill at cervical dislocation. This is a technique where, using your hands, you take the head off of the chicken without tearing the skin. It is largely recognized as the most humane way to euthanize an adult chicken because, when done right, it is damned near instantaneous.
However, doing right takes practice. Horrible practice. When I did it wrong, I would basically just separate the vertebrae of the neck in several places and leave the bird alive. These birds never complained. Not a peep, not a stirred feather. They just looked like they were suddenly in want of a nap and quietly closed their eyes.
It’s not a skill I am especially proud of.[/spoiler]
I have some professors who detest gas euthanasia because the birds gasp for several minutes before they die. It isn’t fast enough. I have other professors who hate the electrocution method because it has to be carefully metered in order to supply the right voltage to stun completely without cooking the bird. Captive bolt, where a metal rod is hydrolically driven through the skull, quickly causing brain death, is effective when done right, but is tricky.
Unfortunately, cervical dislocation, though widely agreed as the best for the bird, can only be done by hand and it’s exhausting. It’s not viable for the number of birds that are processed for meat. So, we muddle along with either gas or electrocution or captive bolt as best we can.
It’s an area that needs more work, and there are people working on it.
(side note: even when gas is used to stun the birds, they still have to be exsanguinated. Having blood in the tissue will spoil the meat)
Here’s where that shame of modern practices that logically are okay kicks in.
The technical term is “Maceration.” At least, this is what I have been told. The chicks are, in a split second, utterly crushed by very large, heavy, and sharp blades.
It’s gross and finding a better solution is one of the reasons I got into the field. We’ve found ways to manipulate growing embyros so that they all come out male. If we can find a way to make them all come out female, or to sex them in the egg, then we won’t need to do this. Until then, maceration is the best combination of humane and cost effective.
I don’t know for sure, but I imagine the remains go the same places as all those feathers and bones and blood from the slaughtered birds: as ground protein supplement for other animals, as compost, etc.
They would be much more vulnerable. Much, much. Modern poultry houses aren’t perfect, but they are a vast improvement.
Look at the countries that are currently having such a hard time with AI: all poor areas where people are keeping birds under the stars. The chickens can’t be kept away from wild birds, or from contaminated areas, or be effectively vaccinated. And because people live with their birds much more closely, more people are exposed to and pick up the virus.
Ok, I double check with some folks who have their finger on the pulse of quail raising.
Short answer: No. Button quail are still as worthless as mothers as you remember.
Long answer: Get a table-top incubator/brooder. Or, get another quail breed to brood the buttons, like a Japanese or a Coturnix. Or, mount a massive re-breeding project to selectively put broodiness back into the line yourself. I guess they aren’t supper popular in the fancy quail corners, so no one is really trying to get broody ones.
Who knows, if you succeed you’ll probably get enough money to buy hybrid pheasants and guinea fowl!
Unless you really like the screams of a tortured toddler throttling a cat, then yes. They are gorgeous though and it was fun to watch the feral cats stalk the male peacock. They have that great huge blind-spot when the tails are fanned out which enables the inquisitive cats to get quite close. I promised the cats that if they caught me a peacock, I’d share it with them. (You know you’ve been in the SCA too long when you find yourself wondering what peacock tastes like.)
The peahens are quiet. Very quiet. I don’t mind them in the yard at all.
Pullet, thanks for this thread. I’m really enjoying it. After reading The Omnivore’s Dilemma I’ve become almost obsessed with raising my own meat.
So another question: For someone who wants to start raising their own birdage for meat/eggs and who isn’t too picky about what they start out with, what you would recommend? Just chickens? How about geese, ducks or turkey? What breeds?
And is there a bird on this planet that will eat those little tiny black ants?
Thanks. 
(Did I already ask this?)
What are the four most important products from chickens throughout history?
I’m really enjoying it to. It’s totally distracting me from my classwork. 
I haven’t had a whole lot of personal experience raising birds, but, from the outside, chickens appear to be the easiest. Waterfowl like ducks and geese are fun, but their size and required pond makes them messier and a bit more challenging. They are also difficult to slaughter humanely by hand. That much I know from personal experience.
Quail are smaller and easier to keep clean, but are flighty and have to be kept in pens with mesh tops.
Chickens can be keep in a normal-sized backyard with not much more than shelter, a fence, food, and water. Storey’s Guide to Raising Chickens is a nice complete text. They are, largely, well behaved an calm and are a really manageable size.
The best way to keep diseases off your property would be to mail order day-old chicks from a hatchery. Read up on how to keep baby chicks first, so you have everything set when they arrive. And make sure the hatchery vaccinates for Marek’s disease. Double check with your local Poultry vet, agricultural advisor, or 4H or FFA leader, or to see if there are other diseases in your area that are worth vaccinating against. Don’t take the advice of the feed store guy. They are notoriously misinformed and are motivated to boot.
Breeds: Go for either some cross bred, dual purpose types. This website has a nice list of various breeds and this website has more detail. A dual purpose should give you meat without growing problems and a consistent supply of eggs in the long day months.
For beginners, try to stay away from breeds that have feathered feet, or long trailing tails, like the cochins or phoenixes. They are beautiful, but harder to keep clean.
Note: Don’t keep waterfowl and chickens and turkeys, or any combination thereof, in the same yard. One species invariably harbors diseases that make the others horribly ill. And don’t keep pigs with your birds. Same problem. Saw that in a book I own on keeping poultry. I think I’ll have to burn that book now.
Not sure about the ants. Maybe a pet hedgehog?
Neat question!
Not in order of importance:
Eggs
Meat
vaccine production
Artificial insemination in mammals
I have turkeys, ducks, and chickens. I keep the turkeys separate but I do have one rooster that is convinced he is a turkey and will sneak into the turkey pen given half a chance. The funny thing is that the turkeys leave him alone, too. Any other chicken gets chased out immediately.
Thanks for this thread, I don’t have any immediate questions to ask, but if I think of one I’ll be back!
How about:
Meat,
Eggs,
Feathers and
guano.
Feathers were a remarkable pre-industrial product. The last forever with proper care. they were used as ornamental dress and cushioning. Hawaiian kings had robes covered with (parrot) feathers.
It depends on how you define “most important.” Sure, feathers have a long history, but not specifically feathers from chickens. Feathers from birds of prey and song birds are generally preferred for decoration. Feathers from waterfowl were preferred for pillows and jackets. Moreover, the functions for feathers were rarely the kinds of jobs that saved lives, or vastly improved quality of life for animals or people.
(nitpick: the native birds of Hawaii are almost exclusively passarines, not parrots)
Guano certainly is useful fertilizer, but often the guano of fish-eating birds is preferred due to the nutritional content of the feces. Inland, cattle dung is more plentiful. Cattle feces also doesn’t have the problem of excessive nitrates mixed in from urine. When a bird eliminates, both urine and feces comes out, so it is higher in nitrates. Just look at what crusted on bird crap will do to a car’s finish. Chicken guano from our modern productions, since there is so much more of it in one spot and since we have the techniques to process it, often goes into fertilizer. However, many animals provide into the pool of feces, so it’s hard to measure the impact of chickens alone in this industry.
I’m going to stick with vaccine production as more useful to humanity overall than feathers and guano.
And the use of egg yolk in suspensions for sperm in order to do artificial insemination has allowed significant advances in animal genetics, just in the last 50 years or so. Those changes are what let us feed our teaming numbers more efficiently on less land and with fewer animals, relatively.
YMMV
Do the chickens have large talons?
Roosters have spurs (those things sticking out of its ankles)
I’ve even seen some bloodlines (probably bred for fighting) where the females had spurs that large.
Pullet, Thanks for your answer, but at the moment I’m compelled to throw out an “Awwwwww, come on…* nobody*???..I thought it was funny…”
<whooooosh!>
My comment was a reference to the film “Napoleon Dynamite”. The line “Do the chickens have large talons?” is a funny line in the film.
I was just trying to be a comedian. 
I was going to post this but I thought for certain, it would have been on the first page.
Just how cowardly are chickens?