# Ask the "crazy" settler **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 15, 2010, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889 "2010-09-15T21:10:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2010, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/101 "2010-09-16T23:57:00Z")
Thanks for that. Let’s let her answer for herself, though. Assuming that our interlocutor, or the Eretz Yisrael movement in general, is unwilling to contemplate trying to recover all those lands by force, then what would they be willing to accept short of that? How would the decision about how much less to accept be reached? And why would that border have to be drawn at the Jordan to be acceptable to them? Would they be willing to cede the Negev to get it? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/102 "2010-09-17T01:05:19Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > Your right and my right has been established by the Canadian/British government and no higher authority. They assumed that authority by putting the indigenous population under duress. But I am part of the indigenous population. > [@](#): > > The so called right of conquest only applies to 1967. This is a right that existed only in one calendar year, is it? > [@](#): > > Your problem is that you see rights as a zero sum game over time. Furthermore, you see an Israeli annexation of the West Bank as stealing land, but you would have no problem if it was turned over to Jordon or Syria or even back to Turkey. > Frankly, I find that position anti-semetic. You’re a fool and a liar. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/103 "2010-09-17T02:31:14Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > You’re a fool and a liar. Tone it down, please. Insults are not allowed in this forum. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/104 "2010-09-17T02:42:10Z")
**Shinna Minna Ma** , I don’t have a question, just want to say thanks for the interesting thread and don’t mind the inevitable cranks in here. I’ve never been to Israel, but the wife stayed in Jerusalem twice for several weeks each time in connection with a project she was in charge of here in Thailand that was partially funded by Hebew University. She enjoyed it very much. Maybe I do have a question. I’m curious if you’ve ever heard of [Pizza IDF](http://pizzaidf.org/) and if it’s well known there, because we’ve actually sent pizzas to the troops there in the past. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/105 "2010-09-17T02:53:35Z")
OK, so the Israelis say they have to expand settlements. So you must know, is your settlement crowded with people who do not have places to live? (Or on the other hand, are there plenty of empty apartments?) Do any Israeli Arabs live in your settlement? If not, how is that enforced? ---
**Author:** ![Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shinna_Minna_Ma)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/106 "2010-09-17T05:03:43Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > > [@Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](#): > > > > I’ve only been outside of Israel once in the time we’ve been here > > Know what? You LIVE outside of Israel. Based upon my address I pay Israeli taxes and I hold an Israeli passport and identity card; therefore, I think you are incorrect. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/107 "2010-09-17T05:08:41Z")
What you think is incorrect is incorrect. You do not live in Israel. You illegally squat outside the borders. Speaking of taxes can you give me a convincing reason for why I, as an American, should have to keep paying for you to do this? ---
**Author:** ![Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shinna_Minna_Ma)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/108 "2010-09-17T05:12:16Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > **Shinna Minna Ma** , I don’t have a question, just want to say thanks for the interesting thread and don’t mind the inevitable cranks in here. You’re welcome. > [@](#): > > Maybe I do have a question. I’m curious if you’ve ever heard of [Pizza IDF](http://pizzaidf.org/) and if it’s well known there, because we’ve actually sent pizzas to the troops there in the past. I am aware of it because I think we donated money towards it when we were still living in the U.S. How well known it is in the army I don’t know; maybe once my daughter is in the army she would be able to tell me. ---
**Author:** ![shamblesmaybe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/50afbb/32.png) [@shamblesmaybe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shamblesmaybe)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/109 "2010-09-17T05:59:03Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > OK, so the Israelis say they have to expand settlements. So you must know, is your settlement crowded with people who do not have places to live? (Or on the other hand, are there plenty of empty apartments?) > > Do any Israeli Arabs live in your settlement? If not, how is that enforced? Don’t see you getting that answered any time soon but perhaps I can help. Arabs don’t live in the settlements they are not allowed into the settlements. They are forbidden from using the roads to the settlements sometimes to the extent that they are forbidden from actually even crossing the roads to the settlements. Any peaceful protests from the Arabs concerning any of these points are broken up by the army. On the other hand the settlers have free reign over the lands and villages surrounding the settlements, abuse and beatings of the locals are common and the likelyhood of an arab successfully prosecuting a settler for assault of damage to crops of equipment are laughable. Freedom and justice cannot only be applied to one side if people really want peace ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/110 "2010-09-17T06:22:40Z")
Forgive me, I value this thread and wish to learn, what about an Arab who is in the IDF? An Arab who is a firefighter? Can his non-Jewish family live in your settlement? They are after all fellow Israelis. If they are not allowed, how is this enforced? By the homeowner’s association? The local government? ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/111 "2010-09-17T12:41:26Z")
I hope my question did not run **shamblesmaybe** off. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/112 "2010-09-17T13:28:44Z")
**TWEEEET!** The issue of the opinion of the OP as to whether the “settlements” are illegal has been answered in the negative. Any further questions or challenges to that position will be taken up in a separate thread because it is just going to result in a hijack and a trainwreck in this one. **[/Moderating]** ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/113 "2010-09-17T13:29:36Z")
What is the level of anti-Arab prejudice? Obviously, that’s a hard question - it’ll vary a lot from place to place, people are all individuals, and so on. But if the OP and **Alessan** could talk to this based on their own experiences, that’d be cool. Interesting side note: My dad served in the IDF, and has a very, very dim view of marijuana use or legalization. When I pressed him on it once, he said (rather reluctantly) that one of the reasons was that he’d seen a lot of Arabs smoking it when he was working in the West Bank. My dad’s a good guy and a liberal Democrat, but he does seem to have picked up a bit of anti-Arab prejudice - is that common? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/114 "2010-09-17T16:07:14Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > **TWEEEET!** > > The issue of the opinion of the OP as to whether the “settlements” are illegal has been answered in the negative. It’s not an opinion that the settlements are illegal, it’s a fact. Since when are we not allowed to treat facts as facts. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/115 "2010-09-17T16:22:00Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@tomndebb](#): > > > > **TWEEEET!** > > > > The issue of the opinion of the OP as to whether the “settlements” are illegal has been answered in the negative. > > It’s not an opinion that the settlements are illegal, it’s a fact. Since when are we not allowed to treat facts as facts. [Thread concerning this subject in ATMB.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=578606) ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/116 "2010-09-17T17:47:22Z")
Heh, amusing that the ATMB thread is action packed while this one went quiet. I suggest this get moved back to where it started, the ATMB thread get moved to GD (or the Pit) and life goes on. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/117 "2010-09-17T19:16:25Z")
Ok, serious question. Do you think it would be a solution (in part) to the current “tensions” if every other house in each settlement was occupied by a Palestinian family? Seems like attacks from mortars, etc, would be less likely, and perhaps the kids could all grow up liking (and understanding) each other. Also, as I understand it, it would be a significant improvement in the standard of living for average Arabs in the area. Small price to pay for a hope for peace? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/118 "2010-09-17T19:18:10Z")
> [@Shinna\_Minna\_Ma](#): > > Because as Orthodox Jews, we feel we belong in Israel. It felt hypocritical, to me, to pray every day about returning to Israel without doing it. This is where we belong. We feel the quality of life is better here. I can go by my Hebrew name, and everyone can pronounce it and knows what it means. We live by a Hebrew calendar here, so we don’t worry about working on Shabbat or holidays. My kids are bilingual, and have much more freedom here than the could have in the U.S. If a Jewish state had been established in Austria instead of Palestine, would you still have wanted to move to a Jewish state or would the fact that it wasn’t in the holy land make the move not worthwhile? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/119 "2010-09-17T19:30:04Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > What right would Israel have had to do annex that land from the start? > > What right does France have to Strasbourg? What right does Poland have to Danzig? What right does (North) Vietnam have to Saigon? What right does the U.S. have to Texas? > > Maps are drawn by wars. You’re allowed think that they shouldn’t be; you’re allowed to think that they aren’t anymore - although in the latter case, you’d be obliged to explain why the cutoff date was before 1967. I can make an argument that cutoff date more or less coincides with the end of WWII and the creation of the UN. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889/120 "2010-09-17T20:04:33Z")
> [@Revenant\_Threshold](#): > > “Right of conquest” doesn’t usually mean there’s a law on the books somewhere that says “finders, keepers”. It’s more code for “Well, we’re here now, and we have weapons. It isn’t worth enough to you to turf us out”. Basically it’s pretty much just a statement of the practicalities rather than deference to some legal basis. What you’re saying is that Israel’s “right” are based on the fact that noone with the ability to kick them out are willing to undertake the venture and the only people willing to risk it don’t have the ability to accomplish it. If the Palestinian suddenly got the nuke, do you think this would accelerate the peace process or just turn Jerusalem into glass? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-crazy-settler/553889.md?page=7)