# Ask the Freemason Part II **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 21, 2014, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948 "2014-05-21T18:24:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![leftfield6](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leftfield6/32/18780_2.png) [@leftfield6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leftfield6)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/41 "2014-06-09T15:51:32Z")
Could I, a non-believer in a deity, be considered for membership? Would I be welcomed, or shunned? If I were welcomed _officially_ would I be truly welcomed by the members? Oddly enough, I have a first name that I have been told is very significant to Freemasons. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/42 "2014-06-09T16:38:14Z")
Here’s a family story - I’ve always wondered if it was true/possible. My dad had a car that he was getting restored. It was in a specialty shop. He could not get ahold of them for a week, so dropped by. When he got there, the sherriff was just putting a forclosure notice on the locked door of the shop. My dad said his car was in there. The sherriff said that was too bad, since everything was going to be sold to collect debts, but maybe he could fill out a ton of paperwork, and with any luck, maybe get his car back in 4 to 6 months. My dad (apparently) gave him a masonic sign, and the sherriff unlocked the door and told him he had 5 minutes to get the car out. He told my dad that he had never actually seen him. Wink wink. Possible? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Nylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Mr.Nylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Nylock)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/43 "2014-06-09T16:42:49Z")
Yes it is possible, the couple freemasons I have known also had similar advantages ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/44 "2014-06-09T17:11:50Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > In case you’re a Simpsons fan, I’ll mention that in the latest update for the phone/tablet game “The Simpsons Tapped Out,” Springfield has been taken over by the Stonecutters, the show’s satirical version of the Masons. Is Montgomery Burns running the whole thing? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/45 "2014-06-09T17:18:52Z")
> [@leftfield6](#): > > Could I, a non-believer in a deity, be considered for membership? Would I be welcomed, or shunned? If I were welcomed _officially_ would I be truly welcomed by the members? > > Oddly enough, I have a first name that I have been told is very significant to Freemasons. As a ‘non-believer in a deity’ you would _not_ be eligible for membership. One of the pre-requisites for membership is ‘belief in a higher power’. One could possibly fake their way through the whole ‘belief in a higher power’ thing, if they were willing to compromise their personal integrity and lie about their religious beliefs. A huge component of Masonry encompasses religiosity, though, and I couldn’t imagine why an atheist would want to subject themselves to it. YMMV ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/46 "2014-06-09T17:19:57Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Here’s a family story - I’ve always wondered if it was true/possible. > > My dad had a car that he was getting restored. It was in a specialty shop. He could not get ahold of them for a week, so dropped by. When he got there, the sherriff was just putting a forclosure notice on the locked door of the shop. My dad said his car was in there. The sherriff said that was too bad, since everything was going to be sold to collect debts, but maybe he could fill out a ton of paperwork, and with any luck, maybe get his car back in 4 to 6 months. > > My dad (apparently) gave him a masonic sign, and the sherriff unlocked the door and told him he had 5 minutes to get the car out. He told my dad that he had never actually seen him. Wink wink. > > Possible? Totally. ---
**Author:** ![leftfield6](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leftfield6/32/18780_2.png) [@leftfield6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leftfield6)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2014, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/47 "2014-06-10T21:09:54Z")
> [@Winston\_Smith](#): > > As a ‘non-believer in a deity’ you would _not_ be eligible for membership. One of the pre-requisites for membership is ‘belief in a higher power’. > > One could possibly fake their way through the whole ‘belief in a higher power’ thing, if they were willing to compromise their personal integrity and lie about their religious beliefs. > > A huge component of Masonry encompasses religiosity, though, and I couldn’t imagine why an atheist would want to subject themselves to it. YMMV Thanks for the direct answer. I truly appreciate it. My atheist leaning is not an area where I would be willing to compromise. I’ve met a number of Masons over the years that, open discovering my first name is Hiram, have encouraged me to look into membership. I appreciate your straightforward answer, it tells me that this is not the group for me. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Nylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Mr.Nylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Nylock)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/48 "2015-03-08T17:25:40Z")
After reading this thread, I was interested in learning a little more about the freemasons. Recently I was able to attend a small meet and greet with a local lodge. I guess I could say it is not what I was expecting after reading this thread; the atmosphere was nothing like what any doper would find remotely interesting (I’m exaggerating a little, but just bear with me I’m trying my best to describe the situation). There were a few men, older white men mostly. Their bearing and manner seemed to be some sort of cross between foghorn leghorn and Ronald Reagan; which to me was pretty cool to see in person. It was like taking a time capsule and going back to the 50’s where woman’s place was in the home, children were to be seen and not heard, and the blacks knew not to stir up too much trouble. I know that what I’m saying does not sound flattering - but I kind off appreciate that these relics still exist; I don’t think that these attitudes are evil per se, but just extremely unenlightened. So, anyhow, I was totally uncomfortable in the situation. I’m uncomfortable in lots of situations and just suck it up and get over it so I can meet people. This time I didn’t really do that, I just felt that there would be no point. To me, I could not see why anyone with professional aspirations would want to spend much time getting involved in this, there just seems to be no real benefit. I mean, spending time being influenced by the thoughts and ideals of a bygone era does not seem to confer any benefit to any upper level professional. Also, I think the fact that membership for all intents and purposes is exclusively male means that the networking opportunities available cut out the largest segment of college graduates in the modern age (women). I know, the purpose is supposed to be religious; but I can just go to a church for that too, and I don’t have to piss in a cup to join. I do think, however, that this is probably a good organization for blue collar/working class types. They tend to maintain similar cultural beliefs and also would benefit more from the support that Freemasons give. So, I think it is really good that Freemasons are still around and I hope that they continue to thrive. They also do a tremendous amount of charity work, and I think that people overlook that too often. It’s just not for me though - and I am pretty certain I would not be for them either - and that’s OK. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2015, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/49 "2015-03-10T12:26:54Z")
> [@Mr.Nylock](#): > > After reading this thread, I was interested in learning a little more about the freemasons. > > Recently I was able to attend a small meet and greet with a local lodge. I guess I could say it is not what I was expecting after reading this thread; the atmosphere was nothing like what any doper would find remotely interesting (I’m exaggerating a little, but just bear with me I’m trying my best to describe the situation). There were a few men, older white men mostly. Their bearing and manner seemed to be some sort of cross between foghorn leghorn and Ronald Reagan; which to me was pretty cool to see in person. It was like taking a time capsule and going back to the 50’s where woman’s place was in the home, children were to be seen and not heard, and the blacks knew not to stir up too much trouble. I know that what I’m saying does not sound flattering - but I kind off appreciate that these relics still exist; I don’t think that these attitudes are evil per se, but just extremely unenlightened. > > So, anyhow, I was totally uncomfortable in the situation. I’m uncomfortable in lots of situations and just suck it up and get over it so I can meet people. This time I didn’t really do that, I just felt that there would be no point. To me, I could not see why anyone with professional aspirations would want to spend much time getting involved in this, there just seems to be no real benefit. I mean, spending time being influenced by the thoughts and ideals of a bygone era does not seem to confer any benefit to any upper level professional. Also, I think the fact that membership for all intents and purposes is exclusively male means that the networking opportunities available cut out the largest segment of college graduates in the modern age (women). > > I know, the purpose is supposed to be religious; but I can just go to a church for that too, and I don’t have to piss in a cup to join. > > I do think, however, that this is probably a good organization for blue collar/working class types. They tend to maintain similar cultural beliefs and also would benefit more from the support that Freemasons give. > > So, I think it is really good that Freemasons are still around and I hope that they continue to thrive. They also do a tremendous amount of charity work, and I think that people overlook that too often. It’s just not for me though - and I am pretty certain I would not be for them either - and that’s OK. This disappoints me, but doesn’t really surprise me. Lodges are made up of members of the local community, and while the governing ritual, precepts, and ideals are more or less universal, the culture of individual lodges is certainly not. In business terms, a lodge is a bit like a franchise. You buy in, get your charter and get to work, hiring from your community and reflecting it’s demographics. I live in an affluent suburb of Boston (even our conservatives are liberal, by some standards), and my lodge is highly diverse in terms of race, ethnicity, religion, age, “class” and so on. We’re a cross-section of local culture and demographics. ---
**Author:** ![Arch\_Trout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@Arch\_Trout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arch_Trout)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2015, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/50 "2015-03-10T13:00:58Z")
> [@Mr.Nylock](#): > > To me, I could not see why anyone with professional aspirations would want to spend much time getting involved in this, there just seems to be no real benefit. I mean, spending time being influenced by the thoughts and ideals of a bygone era does not seem to confer any benefit to any upper level professional. > [@Mr.Nylock](#): > > It’s just not for me though - and I am pretty certain I would not be for them either - and that’s OK. You’ve nailed it. Your first quote shows it’s not for you and you’re not for them. ---
**Author:** ![Whiskey\_Dickens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/9fc348/32.png) [@Whiskey\_Dickens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whiskey_Dickens)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2015, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948/51 "2015-03-10T14:57:55Z")
How much did you learn about actual Masonry (i.e. working with a chisel, square, stone, hammer, etc)? Is being able to work with stone any part of the organization? Any requirement to learn more about geometry? My understanding is that the Masons believed in geometry having some sort of fundamental relationship with our world. I’m interested in whether becoming skilled is any part of the organization, or if it’s more elaborate dress-up for people with a charitable bent. My apologies for being glib, but it does seem a little ridiculous to an outsider. Akin to a teenager wearing chain mail and telling his friends that he’s a level 42 Dragon Master, but he can’t tell you anymore about it because it’s super secret. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason-part-ii/688948.md?page=2)