# Ask the Freemason **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 18, 2010, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931 "2010-03-18T20:16:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2010, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/121 "2010-03-25T15:26:16Z")
> [@luvrbcs](#): > > What are the home visits like? What are they looking for? How common is it to be turned down? > > I just started, literally, I just filled out the Membership Information Request Form to find out where I send my petition and I don’t know what to expect. They didn’t actually visit me at home, so I can’t say for sure, but I’m guessing they just want to make sure you live where you say you do, and that you live in a don’t actually live in a crack house or something. My Lodge had an applicant a few years ago whos home address couldn’t be confirmed - he was rejected. I think the idea behind it is to make sure you have a stable home that you take care of, both of which are sort of indirect prerequisites to taking the Degrees. I don’t think it’s very common to be turned down, but this initial investigation is intended to make sure you are who you say you are, and that you’re a good man. Instead of a home visit, I had to provide 9 (yes, _nine_) references: 3 neighbors, 3 friends and 3 business associates. They called every one of them. When they called my best friend, Chris, they asked him what he thought about me joining the Masons, and he said “I think it will be good for him”. The investigator said “Why? Does he have _flaws_?” and my buddy said “Yeah. Don’t we all? He was saying he needed to get out more, and didn’t want to sit around in barrooms, and thought the Masons would be really good for him”. We both thought that whole “Does he have _flaws_?” thing was sort of funny, but I guess the guy has a job to do and he was doing it. I never asked my other references about the calls, so I don’t know what sort of questions were asked, but I’m guessing it’s just general “What sort of a man is Winston? Good friend? Good neighbor?” etc. You may find that the process to get to initiation takes several months. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions down the road and it’s too late to resurrect this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2010, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/122 "2010-03-25T15:35:05Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > So a key tenet in terms of membership is a collectivism regarding all religions, in a sense. Which would explain why fundamentalist Christians are so up in arms about your group, cuz you know, you accept as members people that are “other” than a Christian faith. > > Is that accurate? No exactly. A _requirement_ of membership is belief in a higher power. But beyond that, it’s don’t ask, don’t tell. They aren’t really interested in _what_ God you believe in, only that you believe. The religiosity within the Lodge is pretty generic Old Testament-type stuff, that seems like it’s every bit as compatible with Christianity as it is with Judaism. I presume and based on what I’ve been told, compatible with the Muslim belief structure as well. ---
**Author:** ![Redwing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/dfb087/32.png) [@Redwing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Redwing)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2010, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/123 "2010-03-25T16:38:54Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > So a key tenet in terms of membership is a collectivism regarding all religions, in a sense. Which would explain why fundamentalist Christians are so up in arms about your group, cuz you know, you accept as members people that are “other” than a Christian faith. > > Is that accurate? Well, sort of. As a fraternity, we want members who believe in [a] god. We don’t care which god. Our stories are based (loosely) on the Old Testament, but don’t much feature direct deific intervention. Some of the appendant bodies require a particular faith, but Blue Lodge (basic) Masonry does not. If you ask three Masons why belief in [a] god is required, you’ll get five different answers. As an organization we have a Universalist bent, in that we believe that there is [a] god, but that we (as an organization) do not know the exact form that the deity takes. We’re perfectly comfortable if Brother Bill and Brother Todd both believe the other is going to hell, as long as they get along in the lodge and are willing to work together in any task the lodge asks them to undertake. If your brand of god tells you that anyone who talks about god, but isn’t of your brand is actually the devil; well, Masonry probably isn’t for you. > [@Winston\_Smith](#): > > They didn’t actually visit me at home, so I can’t say for sure, but I’m guessing they just want to make sure you live where you say you do, and that you live in a don’t actually live in a crack house or something. My Lodge had an applicant a few years ago whos home address couldn’t be confirmed - he was rejected. I think the idea behind it is to make sure you have a stable home that you take care of, both of which are sort of indirect prerequisites to taking the Degrees. > > I don’t think it’s very common to be turned down, but this initial investigation is intended to make sure you are who you say you are, and that you’re a good man. > > [snip] > > You may find that the process to get to initiation takes several months. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions down the road and it’s too late to resurrect this thread. To illustrate the differences in lodges, I’m pretty sure **Winston** and myself are subject to the same Grand Lodge (Massachusetts), but I had a home visit from two brothers, though I don’t recall having anywhere near nine references. The home visit was pretty informal, they wanted to meet me and my wife, and talk to us about what being Mason entailed. Talking to spouses and significant others is important to my lodge, we don’t want to be a disruption to family life, and to let the spouse know that we’re just a bunch of ordinary guys. We don’t like turning people down, and my lodge tends to believe that any concerns should be dealt with before the candidate reaches the voting stage. (I was told, after I was raised, that one of the senior members of the lodge had wanted to know why a eunuch wanted to be a Mason. Explaining my job to him was the last controversy I recall candidate facing in my lodge). I’m also open to being PMed if any one has any questions. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2011, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/124 "2011-05-19T16:52:23Z")
I decided over the weekend to resurrect this thread, because I’ve experienced many things which were previously discussed herein. To recap… I’ve been a Master Mason for 14 months now. I was invited and have become a junior officer of the Lodge (I can explain a little more about this later if anyone is interested). Some of what I have experienced _first hand_ were asked about when I first ran this thread, so I’m going to re-read it, pick out the handful of posts I wanted to re-respond to, and give any newcomers a chance to participate in what _I_ think to be a pretty interesting topic of discussion. BTW, I may know more about Freemasonry, but I’m still almost completely ignorant of Mormonism. While I _am_ aware that the founder of Mormonism was indeed a Mason, and appears to have “borrowed” some of the ritual, secrecy &Etc. from Masonry, that’s pretty much all I know. Just wanted to get that out there, because from a quick scan of the last page of this thread it looks like that was the highlight topic. I’d prefer to keep the discussion and Q/A on Masonry. ---
**Author:** ![OtisCampbellWasRight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/d78d45/32.png) [@OtisCampbellWasRight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtisCampbellWasRight)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2011, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/125 "2011-05-19T18:07:18Z")
Welcome Brother Winston! I am a Past master of my Lodge, and a Past Patron of my Eastern Star Chapter. I have taken the 32nd degrees in both the York and Scottish Rites. I have to tell you that you have fielded these question remarkably well for someone relatively new to Masonry. I was raised in 1997, and I consider it one of the best choices I ever made. Freemasonry is like so many other aspects of your life: you get out of it a reward proportional to your commitment to it. I can offer this insight, though, regarding the “secrecy” aspects of the craft: We are NOT a secret society, we are a society with secrets. Moreover, our secrets; which are indeed available to someone willing to spend a few minutes on the internet, don’t mean much outside the context of the degree work. We like to keep them secret for the same reason that you gift wrap a present to someone; not to ruin the surprise. Human nature being what it is, people will ALWAYS think you’re up to something nefarious if you do it behind closed doors. Keep enjoying Masonry and keep up the good, square work! ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2011, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/126 "2011-05-19T18:37:28Z")
> [@OtisCampbellWasRight](#): > > Welcome Brother Winston! > > I am a Past master of my Lodge, and a Past Patron of my Eastern Star Chapter. I have taken the 32nd degrees in both the York and Scottish Rites. I have to tell you that you have fielded these question remarkably well for someone relatively new to Masonry. I was raised in 1997, and I consider it one of the best choices I ever made. Freemasonry is like so many other aspects of your life: you get out of it a reward proportional to your commitment to it. > > I can offer this insight, though, regarding the “secrecy” aspects of the craft: We are NOT a secret society, we are a society with secrets. Moreover, our secrets; which are indeed available to someone willing to spend a few minutes on the internet, don’t mean much outside the context of the degree work. We like to keep them secret for the same reason that you gift wrap a present to someone; not to ruin the surprise. > > Human nature being what it is, people will ALWAYS think you’re up to something nefarious if you do it behind closed doors. > > Keep enjoying Masonry and keep up the good, square work! Thank you for the complement! I have good teachers! ---
**Author:** ![california\_jobcase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@california\_jobcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/california_jobcase)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2011, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/127 "2011-05-19T22:25:02Z")
Massachusetts Masons drink beer after lodge? Alcohol and dancing are forbidden inside a lodge building down here in Georgia. We do make awesome barbecue for sale twice a year, however. Past Master, 2004 ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2011, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/128 "2011-05-19T22:29:42Z")
> [@Redwing](#): > > (I was told, after I was raised, that one of the senior members of the lodge had wanted to know why a eunuch wanted to be a Mason. Explaining my job to him was the last controversy I recall candidate facing in my lodge). I gotta know what this is all about… ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/129 "2011-05-20T01:47:05Z")
> [@Winston\_Smith](#): > > I decided over the weekend to resurrect this thread, because I’ve experienced many things which were previously discussed herein. I’ve heard of Scottish Rite and York Rite. This is Haitian Rite? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 9:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/130 "2011-05-20T09:01:28Z")
What do you make of the paranoia people seem to have around Masons/Masonry? ---
**Author:** ![OtisCampbellWasRight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/d78d45/32.png) [@OtisCampbellWasRight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtisCampbellWasRight)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/131 "2011-05-20T11:47:55Z")
etv: Like I said above, whenever you do something behind closed doors, people will think you are scheming something. While movies like “National Treasure” and to a lesser extent “From Hell” have renewed interest in our fraternity, and given us more public visibility, they have also dragged up the anti-Masonic sentiments of a century ago. We are NOT a religion, nor do we try to be. In fact, most jurisdictions forbid conversations of a religious nature in lodge, as this may serve to disrupt the peace and harmony of the Lodge. The creators of Freemason simply saw the value of respecting the spiritual points of view of others (tolerance) and tried to incororate this into our paradigm. You may have heard the old saying that you never discuss politics or religion in a bar - this is why. The “physical defect” provision is merely a guideline too. I personally raised a candidate with a prosthetic leg. In our time, the Masonic fraternity serves as a largely social vehicle that also allows the Brothers to perform acts of charity via strength in numbers. Many of the “lessons” we are taught in Lodge are sound, common-sense precepts aimed at helping society at large. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/132 "2011-05-20T13:19:05Z")
I, too, can personally attest to the “physical defect” provision not being a deal breaker with regard to initiation. I participated in the initiation of a guy with two prosthetic legs about 8 months ago, and we’re initiating a guy with one prosthetic leg now. I couldn’t imagine turning a guy away because he was unable to participate in the physical parts of the initiation. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/133 "2011-05-20T13:20:16Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > I gotta know what this is all about… I’m going to go out on a limb and guess he’s a UNIX Systems Administrator. ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/134 "2011-05-20T13:46:15Z")
> [@Infovore](#): > > A couple of questions: > > 1. What’s the difference between a Job’s Daughter and a Rainbow Girl? Is it an age thing? They’re both Masonic offshoots, right? > > 2. Do you guys have DeMolay? If so, do they ever serve tables? I don’t mean to try to find sexism where none exists, _**but it seems a little weird that the young girls are serving a bunch of guys (especially if the boys never do it)**_. This was specifically one of the things I wanted to revisit when I decided to bump this thread. To set the context: one element of our monthly meeting is dinner in our hall. It’s typically a pretty complete meal: cheese and crackers with soft drinks, then rolls & butter and salad, then the main meal (this month we had roast beef with green bean casserole and mashed potatoes) (chicken alternative meal), then dessert (ice cream with chocolate sauce and whipped cream). It is all plated at the kitchen window and served by the Rainbow Girls. After the meal, baskets are placed on the tables and we pony up a couple bucks for tips, which are then counted, deposited, and presented to the Rainbow Girls organization to fund the stuff they do (charitable works, etc.) A few months ago, the Rainbow Girls had their Big Yearly Meeting, and the guys from my Lodge cooked for them, served _them_, and provided security (the Lodge was in the city). Just last month, they were our guests for dinner and we served them again. So, it’s not a sexist thing, as far as I can tell. Also, I frequently assist in serving our meals, and cleaning up. I’ve observed our Worshipful Master (Grand Poobah) doing dishes in his Tuxedo after our meeting was over because the kitchen was short-staffed and help was needed. I guess my point is that we all work together to everyone’s mutual benefit, and the girls don’t serve us meals so we can make them subservient to us - we serve them when the circumstances dictate it. ---
**Author:** ![Damfino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Damfino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damfino)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2011, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/135 "2011-05-20T22:17:34Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > Why does the meme that Freemasonry is equivalent to Baal worship persist? If you google “Freemasonry Baal Worship” you come up with some…interesting results. > > Like this one, for instance: [http://www.bloomington.in.us/~lgthscac/freemasonry.htm](http://www.bloomington.in.us/~lgthscac/freemasonry.htm) > I only skimmed it, but it appears that the issue these guys have with Freemasonry is that Masons equivocate all religions, while _pretending_ to be Christians. Or something. Can you make any logic of this cite and these accusations in general? > > If it is a Christian-based fraternity like you say it is (and you’re a Catholic to boot), why all this other nonsense? Smear campaign by fear-mongers? Freemasonry has been present in India since around 1727. The first Indian Mason, a Muslim, was inducted in 1775 or therabouts. The first Hindu was inducted in 1857. The Grand Lodge of India was formed in 1961 with parent Grand Lodges being those of England, Ireland and Scotland. There are several hundred lodges, with membership representing all religions. At the altar are placed the Bible, the Koran, the Bhagavad Gita, the Sikh Guru Granth and the Parsi Zend Avesta. Ironically a Christian member of the Lodge of which I am aware was forced to resign because his wife believed that Freemasons worship the Devil. (This Lodge does not have home visits.) ---
**Author:** ![DarrenS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/977dab/32.png) [@DarrenS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DarrenS)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2011, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/136 "2011-05-21T17:01:33Z")
Have you ever seen this [documentary](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t1bHBthJN9w)? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2012, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/137 "2012-02-26T18:34:51Z")
(I hope it’s not considered unmannerly to bump an old thread like this.) Was it common for American men in 19th century to convert to Episcopalianism when they became Freemasons? (This question derives from something I read recently.) Another question: Would lodges be likely to have interesting info on members from 100 years ago or so, and if so, would it be likely they would share the info? ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2012, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/138 "2012-02-26T19:16:06Z")
Is there any connection between Freemasonry and tyhe (secretive) fraternity “Skull and Bones”? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2012, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/139 "2012-02-26T21:03:10Z")
Do people laugh at you a lot? ---
**Author:** ![chowching](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@chowching](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chowching)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2012, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931/140 "2012-02-27T06:38:00Z")
> [@Infovore](#): > > A couple of questions: > > 1. What’s the difference between a Job’s Daughter and a Rainbow Girl? Is it an age thing? They’re both Masonic offshoots, right? > > 2. Do you guys have DeMolay? If so, do they ever serve tables? I don’t mean to try to find sexism where none exists, but it seems a little weird that the young girls are serving a bunch of guys (especially if the boys never do it). I think you should have a relative who is a Freemason for you to join Job’s Daughter. For Rainbow I think the requirements are just similar to those of DeMolay. You’d have to be 13-21 y/o. We boys do serve our Dad Masons too. We help set tables during their gatherings. We participate in their fund raising activities. We assist in anyway we can. Job’s Daughters, Rainbow Girls, DeMolays all do that. Hi Dad Winston. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-freemason/532931.md?page=8)