# Ask the guy who is pretty good at SF Story Identification **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** books-writing-myths\ **Created:** [September 7, 2008, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417 "2008-09-07T00:08:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/61 "2008-09-08T20:40:26Z")
[quote=“AHunter3, post:41, topic:462417”] You left out “Bottommos” for the low-slung 3rd moon of Mars. QUOTE] The one with Bottomos is “The Holes Around Mars” by Jerome Bixby, not Asimov, though it was collected by Asimov in a great anthology called “Where Do We Go From Here?” ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/62 "2008-09-08T20:48:03Z")
> [@Naturally\_Oblivious](#): > > Another one, which I think is a short story, has this guy who invents a telescope that lets him see through anything, including back and fowards in time. This eventually leads the main character to realize that everyone is being watched by someone, always. > > I’m sure there’s more, but that’s all I remember right now. I’m pretty sure (as someone else has suggested) that this is Damon Knight’s “I See You” but as someone else points out it also is similar to Asimov’s “The Dead Past”. In The Dead Past, an archaeologist builds his own time viewer because the agency that controls the one and only such device keeps rejecting his proposals; the archaelogist discovers that a) time viewers are easy to make, and b) they won’t show anything further than 100 years or so ago. The government is covering this up to prevent people from realizing that anyone can easily spy and anyone else. The main character is obsessed with Carthage and haunted by the death of his daughter in a house fire that he fears he caused. In I See You, we have two plotlines - the life story of someone who grew up after timeviewers were universal, told in the second person, and the story of the guy who invented the device and how people reacted immediately after the invention. This story ends with “you” realizing as “you” review your past (on a 40th or 50th birthday) that even when you were hiding as a child, someone was watching you and someone will be always watching you. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/63 "2008-09-08T20:52:09Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > You really think that’s worse than > > “Give my big hearts to Maude, Dwayne. Dismember me for Harold’s choir. Tell all the Foys on Sortibackenstrete that I will soon be there --” > > [http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BdPDEcUWu3s](http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=BdPDEcUWu3s) They’re both pretty bad, but in Loint of Paw, Asimov came up with a situation where it was fairly plausible that a puckish judge could write “A niche in time saves Stein,” while the “Death of a Foy” relied on some made-up names and a less plausible buildup - but your mileage may vary of course ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/64 "2008-09-08T21:16:47Z")
> [@ArchiveGuy](#): > > I remember finding a book in the seatback of a plane I was on, so I thumbed through it (reading bits & pieces amounting to about 60% or so). Cheap paperback, at least a decade ago (though I got the sense the book was even older by the look of it), in the 200-300 page neighborhood. Don’t remember the author, but the name definitely didn’t ring a bell at the time. > > Protagonist is Tour Guide who works for Time Travel Agency. He takes people back to different periods of time to indulge in period-style adventures, including decadent/erotic behavior. Don’t remember all the setpieces, but ancient Rome (orgies, debauchery, etc.) was a prominent setting. There is quite a lot of fairly explicit sexual descriptions throughout the book. > > Don’t remember any of the plot elements, but I think he ends up falling for this woman (perhaps a redhead?) and sleeping with her, only to discover that she is his ancient ancestor (from the Arthurian age, maybe?). Although there seem to be more liberal provisions involving the interference/undue influencing of time, I believe the Time Travel protocols still involve a couple big DON’Ts, and this is one of them. He becomes a pariah or outcast or fugitive or non-entity or something, but can’t remember anything more (including how it ended). > > Didn’t take the book off the plane, but always wondered about it and always meant to post the inquiry here, so…There you Go! 🙂 - Up the Line,\* by Robert Silverberg (ever heard of him? He’s written a couple of books). Byzantium, not Rome, but you’ve pretty much remembered the plot - except for the fact that he gets into trouble, not for sleeping with an ancestor, but for losing a tourist somewhere in time. As for the ending, what happens is that ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/65 "2008-09-08T21:18:52Z")
Did you ever read the one about a society where you needed a license to talk? ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/66 "2008-09-08T21:29:03Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > - > > Up the Line,\* by Robert Silverberg (ever heard of him? He’s written a couple of books). Byzantium, not Rome, but you’ve pretty much remembered the plot - except for the fact that he gets into trouble, not for sleeping with an ancestor, but for losing a tourist somewhere in time. Thanks! 🙂 Some of the descriptive stuff is ringing more of a bell, and there were obviously chunks I skipped over altogether. I didn’t recognize Silverberg then, though I’ve read some of his short fiction since. I see the book’s OOP but now I’m curious enough that I may go ahead and order it. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2008, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/67 "2008-09-08T23:14:24Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > Did you ever read the one about a society where you needed a license to talk? Yes. “The Man Who Had No Idea” by Tom Disch. It’s collected in one of the Best of F&SF collections (which is where I saw it) ---
**Author:** ![Kat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b19c9b/32.png) [@Kat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kat)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/68 "2008-09-09T02:13:43Z")
> [@Risha](#): > > Found it. It’s _Velvet Fields_ from “The Girl Who Heard Dragons”. > > I remembered this story right off the bat because it, quite frankly, really disturbed me. It’s told from the perspective of one of the colonists, who is proud to say (though he no longer has a tongue) that they did what was right to make up for their accidental crime. Thank you! I never would have guessed McCaffrey. Yes, it was extremely disturbing to me as well especially an offhand comment about cutting off a little boy’s arm or something similar and yet, for some reason, I feel like I need to read it a second time. ---
**Author:** ![Sleel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/73ab20/32.png) [@Sleel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sleel)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/69 "2008-09-09T02:49:28Z")
I think I’ve asked about this book on this board before. I’ll give it another shot here. It was a paperback novel, written probably about the mid-80s. I doubt the author was all that well-known. I remember very bright colors on the cover, which had some kind of standard fantasy scene depicted, but with more neon-ish colors than usual. The story involves an online fantasy world created by the main character and some partners when they were in college. The guy is middle-aged now, with some health problems, and is brought in as a consultant by the company or the government because some important people have not been able to jack out; they’re stuck online, and no one can track them down in the virtual world either. They’ve also brought in a Russian woman who ends up to have a bit of a hero-worship/crush on the protagonist. He’s upset at the changes in the world that have made it more commercial. I remember him remarking that the chainmail bikini look the female NPCs usually sport now was not part of the original setting, and that it’s highly impractical. He is a proficient fencer and kendo practitioner who created his own sword style based on a blending of the two. In the virtual world, he tracks down some of his old stuff including his swords, one of which was called, I believe, Crystal Caliburn or something like that. The sword was a short sword made of actual crystal. (Googling that name turns up a pinball game.) The AI who was overseeing the world has a crush on him also, and the problems might have been a way for it to meet him. In the virtual world, it created a character and took a female persona. I think she may have caused some problems for the Russian woman out of jealousy. He has hints of what the AI is along the journey. She met up with them early on in the guise of an NPC. He figures it out close to the end of the story. I don’t remember the actual ending, but I think he successfully found the Russian Premiere or somebody like that who was the reason they recruited him, and he regains regular access to the network. Can’t remember what happened with the AI. Hopefully, one of you guys can ID this story. It’s bugged me for about 15 years that I can’t find it again to re-read it. No idea if it stands up as a good story, but it’s probably one of the earliest virtual-world-with-a-fantasy-setting books I can remember. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/70 "2008-09-09T07:05:30Z")
> [@Sleel](#): > > I think I’ve asked about this book on this board before. I’ll give it another shot here. It was a paperback novel, written probably about the mid-80s. I doubt the author was all that well-known. I remember very bright colors on the cover, which had some kind of standard fantasy scene depicted, but with more neon-ish colors than usual. I have this somewhere. It’s got at least two novels in it. Wm. Mark Simmons. When Dreams Collide, In The Net of Dreams. Reprinted as the Dreamland Chronicles. I like his One Foot In The Grave / Dead On My Feet, too. Didn’t know it was the same guy. > **[The Dreamland Chronicles: Wm. Mark Simmons: 9781892065605: Amazon.com: Books](https://www.amazon.com/Dreamland-Chronicles-Wm-Mark-Simmons/dp/1892065606)** > > The Dreamland Chronicles \[Wm. Mark Simmons\] on Amazon.com. \*FREE\* shipping on qualifying offers. The Dreamland Chronicles ---
**Author:** ![MerryMagdalen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@MerryMagdalen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MerryMagdalen)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/71 "2008-09-09T08:34:08Z")
Ok, here’s two. One scifi, one more fantasy. Keep in mind I haven’t read a lot of either, so obvious stories might work. Also haven’t read the whole thread. Scifi: A group of schoolchildren, maybe on a starship, who’ve never seen the “Sun”, but it’s coming out soon for the first and probably only time in their lives. There’s one girl they lock up in a closet during some schoolchild bullying, she misses the sunrise/sunview, and she maybe falls out of the closet when they come to get her (after all of them go see the light) and that’s the end? Fantasy: A witch steals beautiful children at puberty, but only if she can say their name. So the village tries to name their kids complicated things, but it doesn’t work. A boy is born who is ugly so they name him Dan. He becomes friends with a beautiful girl (with a complex name) and when the witch inevitably takes her he gains access to the castle and rescues her. I can’t remember how. If you could give me the names of these, I would love it. ---
**Author:** ![Hunter\_Hawk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/50afbb/32.png) [@Hunter\_Hawk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hunter_Hawk)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/72 "2008-09-09T08:37:57Z")
> [@MerryMagdalen](#): > > Scifi: A group of schoolchildren, maybe on a starship, who’ve never seen the “Sun”, but it’s coming out soon for the first and probably only time in their lives. There’s one girl they lock up in a closet during some schoolchild bullying, she misses the sunrise/sunview, and she maybe falls out of the closet when they come to get her (after all of them go see the light) and that’s the end? Ray Bradbury, “All Summer In a Day” (I swear, we should just have a sticky for this one–it seems to be _the_ most common “identify this story” request of all) ETA: The parenthetical comment is not intended as snark toward **MerryMagdalen** ; it’s just that that story seems to be the one that everybody vaguely remembers but can’t identify. Was it reprinted in textbooks or something, so it got wider exposure? ---
**Author:** ![Sleel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/73ab20/32.png) [@Sleel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sleel)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/73 "2008-09-09T10:46:42Z")
**E-Sabbath** , thanks! I had to look up the constituent books to get a synopsis, but I think the first one, [In the Net of Dreams](http://www.sff.net/people/wm.mark.simmons/Net%20of%20Dreams.htm), was the book I read. I thought I was a few years younger when I read it, but it was apparently published in 1990 when I was a teen. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/74 "2008-09-09T15:34:52Z")
There was a children’s story about an alien name Jon who can read minds. He has a golden dagger, and is arrested for some reason. Another children’s story about, astronauts on another planet who meet aliens who communicate with them via telepathy. Unfortunatly, the aliens look like plants and the astronauts unwittlingly kill a few of them. The astronauts who communicate with the aliens all receive th same mesages but the words are slightly different to each astronaut. ---
**Author:** ![A\_shameful\_cracka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@A\_shameful\_cracka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_shameful_cracka)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/75 "2008-09-09T21:49:01Z")
> [@MerryMagdalen](#): > > Ok, here’s two. One scifi, one more fantasy. Keep in mind I haven’t read a lot of either, so obvious stories might work. Also haven’t read the whole thread. > > Scifi: A group of schoolchildren, maybe on a starship, who’ve never seen the “Sun”, but it’s coming out soon for the first and probably only time in their lives. There’s one girl they lock up in a closet during some schoolchild bullying, she misses the sunrise/sunview, and she maybe falls out of the closet when they come to get her (after all of them go see the light) and that’s the end? This one was asked and answered (by me) on the first page of this thread! ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/76 "2008-09-09T22:10:27Z")
> [@Hunter\_Hawk](#): > > Ray Bradbury, “All Summer In a Day” (I swear, we should just have a sticky for this one–it seems to be _the_ most common “identify this story” request of all) > > ETA: The parenthetical comment is not intended as snark toward **MerryMagdalen** ; it’s just that that story seems to be the one that everybody vaguely remembers but can’t identify. Was it reprinted in textbooks or something, so it got wider exposure? It’s been published many times ([http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?58363](http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?58363) just lists some of the times - I’m sure it’s been in textbooks too), and it is really memorable for children, since it deals with bullying, and being an outsider, and being unbelieved. All that being said, I’m tempted to list a few of the classic story IDs pre-emptively ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2008, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/77 "2008-09-09T22:25:13Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > There was a children’s story about an alien name Jon who can read minds. He has a golden dagger, and is arrested for some reason. > > Another children’s story about, astronauts on another planet who meet aliens who communicate with them via telepathy. Unfortunatly, the aliens look like plants and the astronauts unwittlingly kill a few of them. The astronauts who communicate with the aliens all receive th same mesages but the words are slightly different to each astronaut. These don’t ring a bell unfortunately (luckily I called myself “the guy who is pretty good at SF story identification,” not “the guy who is terrific…”). The second one reminds me of John Christopher’s “The Lotus Caves” about kids on the moon who discover a cave with an intelligent (somewhat hypnotic) plant. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/78 "2008-09-10T00:08:10Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > There was a children’s story about an alien name Jon who can read minds. He has a golden dagger, and is arrested for some reason. > > Another children’s story about, astronauts on another planet who meet aliens who communicate with them via telepathy. Unfortunatly, the aliens look like plants and the astronauts unwittlingly kill a few of them. The astronauts who communicate with the aliens all receive th same mesages but the words are slightly different to each astronaut. _The Forgotten Door_ was one of my favorite childhood books. It’s by Alexander Key, and readily available at Amazon. I don’t recognize your second story. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/79 "2008-09-10T00:18:49Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > _The Forgotten Door_ was one of my favorite childhood books. It’s by Alexander Key, and readily available at Amazon. > > I don’t recognize your second story. I’m embarrassed - I read “The Forgotten Door” when I was a kid, and didn’t recognize the description (I’m pretty sure I have a copy of it somewhere too). Alexander Key wrote “Escape to Witch Mountain” too ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2008, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417/80 "2008-09-10T00:44:49Z")
This is not one I’ve read but one I’ve just heard about and wanted to read, even though I know the ending: There’s an idyllic community (don’t know if it’s a city or a country) where everybody has wonderful happy lives, except that some leave. At a certain age everyone is taken into a (temple? palace? storm shelter? guest house?) and shown a horribly tortured child who is in complete agony and made to know that the beauty of the town requires his suffering. Some remain and keep the secret, others choose to leave. (Occasionally somebody will say “Cool… hey, if I kick the kid in the nuts really hard, can I have an I-Phone?”) Does anybody recognize this outline? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-guy-who-is-pretty-good-at-sf-story-identification/462417.md?page=5)