# Ask the (hopefully soon-to-be-former) Hoarder/Clutterer **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 29, 2012, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303 "2012-04-29T06:16:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Lsura](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Lsura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lsura)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/41 "2012-04-30T13:12:22Z")
> [@Tapiotar](#): > > This is a GREAT technique. I use it myself, not just for cleaning, but for exercising when I don’t feel like it, or tackling any necessary but unappealing chore. If 20 minutes seems too long, set the timer for 10. Chances are, by then you’ll be into the task and want to keep going. I do this too - I do 30/10s and 45/15s, based on some of the ideas from [Unfuck Your Habitat](http://unfuckyourhabitat.tumblr.com/). Best of luck this week, **choie**! I know it’s going to be stressful, but you can do this. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/42 "2012-04-30T13:40:43Z")
Thanks guys! OMG they came early. Last post before It Begins but I wanted to give one more thanks to y’all. What kind of guys dealing with neurotics come a half-hour early?! Argh! Not mentally ready yet! (Or even dressed). They threw me in the deep end while I was planning on wading in slowly. Ah well. In for a penny, in for a pound. I’ll speak to you guys later when the first day’s through (or maybe at half-time if I need the courage). But many many thanks for your support, and a big warm hug to those who popped in to acknowledge your own problems in this area. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/43 "2012-04-30T13:42:49Z")
> [@choie](#): > > 1. Stuff I feel sorry for. I kind of think of things as… well, not really “alive,” or sentient, or whatever – I’ll cop to a lot of issues but I’m not _that_ crazy to think my broken chair is a living creature. I don’t talk to it or anything like that. My psychological smorgasbord does not include delusions. However, as I mentioned earlier, if it’s possible to anthropomorphize something, I _will_. Rather stupidly and self-destructively, I like to name things. I named my reclining chair “Oliver” (it’s olive-colored) and my mouse"George" (as in “I’m gonna love it and keep it and call it George” from the Bugs Bunny cartoon). My computer du jour is always “Computy.” (Okay, that’s not a very creative name, so sue me.) Anyway, of course now that “Oliver” is broken I’m going to feel ridiculously guilty throwing [del]him[/del] it out, but that’s what will need to happen at the end of the week. > > In short (too late!), anything I’ve lived with long enough to “get used to it,” so to speak, becomes part of me and I feel like it’s presumptuous of me to feel more important than either bugs or garbage. Yeah, low self-esteem is a problem for me, why do you ask? 🙂 > > I mentioned this before but do you guys remember that old IKEA commercial where they showed a broken lamp set out in the garbage, and this Swiss-accented guy explains that it’s broken and no one wants it, and finally at the end of the commercial he says something like, “And now you’re feeling sorry for the lamp? Get over it, it’s a lamp.” That’s totally me. I thought I was the only one who was like this. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/44 "2012-04-30T14:02:33Z")
Breaking news just in! Ebay servers crash as system overloaded with massive numbers of questionable nicknacks suddenly for sale! Just teasing. Good luck! ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/45 "2012-04-30T14:04:25Z")
They probably came early so you couldn’t hide. 🙂 ETA - **Lsura** , I am now in love with Unfuck Your Habitat. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/46 "2012-04-30T14:37:43Z")
> [@Anne\_Neville](#): > > I thought I was the only one who was like this. Maybe it’s the circles I was raised in but I don’t know anyone who isn’t like that. We’re taught to love and empathize w/ inanimate things starting w/ dolls, sometimes it sticks. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/47 "2012-04-30T15:45:35Z")
Does anyone else get the desire to hang onto old books because re-reading them can help you relive an earlier time in your life? There’s an element of not wanting to admit that a particular period of my life is over to it, too. I’m having trouble culling my book collection because of this. I’m also having a lot of trouble admitting that I will probably never be as thin as I was twelve years ago, so I should get rid of clothes from then that don’t fit any more. Maybe being pregnant can help me with that- everybody knows that your body changes shape after being pregnant, and it’s not my fault if that happens. My clutter is almost all made up of books and clothes. > [@Nawth\_Chucka](#): > > Maybe it’s the circles I was raised in but I don’t know anyone who isn’t like that. We’re taught to love and empathize w/ inanimate things starting w/ dolls, sometimes it sticks. Yeah, I’ve already decided to be really careful on encouraging our baby to empathize with her toys. I don’t want her to destroy stuff for fun, but a little less empathy than I have with inanimate objects than I have might be nice. ---
**Author:** ![Snickers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@Snickers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snickers)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/48 "2012-04-30T17:34:38Z")
> [@Lasciel](#): > > First off - if your trash place does any level of recycling, then most everything you throw out – broken lamps, small appliances, etc are going to be pulled out and used as the building blocks for new things. Think of it like a karmic reincarnation for objects - this sad old lamp is tired and ready to move on to his new life as a set of freshly created brass candlesticks that someone will love and cherish! Having a grounded, reality-based, and specific thought in mind that items will be re-used or re-purposed can maybe help you feel less like you are “abandoning them” when it’s time for them to move on. 🙂 To take this a step farther, perhaps (as long as it won’t make you feel bad): by hanging on to all these items, you’re preventing them from moving onto their new lives. Currently, they’re stuck as they are, as soon as they’re gone from your home later today, they’ll be liberated. I agree with everyone else - it’s taken courage to post about this, and you’ll need more to get through the cleaning. And you can do it. I have no doubt. ---
**Author:** ![Maastricht](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@Maastricht](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maastricht)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/49 "2012-04-30T18:01:36Z")
Choi, have you arranged for fresh paint or new flooring? You might as well , if they are overhauling everything already. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2012, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/50 "2012-04-30T19:35:45Z")
**Choie** , I know everyone is waxing enthusiastic about how much better you’ll feel when this is done, but I hereby give you permission to NOT feel better immediately. If you do, that’s great, but it can take me _a couple weeks_ to feel better about a major overhaul/cleaning/reorganizing. Sometimes I feel a little disoriented, like the space isn’t quite _mine_ at first. You may not feel this, but if you do, know that you’re not the only one to go through that. Tell the well-meaning folks that while yes, it’s cleaner and more organized it’s a big change for you and you’ll need a little time to adjust to it all. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/51 "2012-05-01T02:12:20Z")
Hi everyone. I just took a long nap after the guy left, because even though he did almost all the work, I was _exhausted_. First the amusing bit – and btw thanks to **Alice the Goon** , I believe it was, for finding the correct link to Home Clean Home: this company promises discretion and “oh we won’t tell your landlord anything, honest!” Which I do admire, of course. But this morning, the guy (I’ll call him Sol) arrived wearing a T-shirt that not only had the HCH logo on it (which wouldn’t be a problem) but also the logo for their _other_ business – “BED BUGS 911.” Now, in NYC, the words “Bed Bugs” are spoken in hushed tones lest the grisly terror be invoked. And this good-natured, well-intentioned guy walks in with a couple of assistants to my doorman, who unfortunately happens to be accompanied by my Super, wearing a T-Shirt emblazened with BED BUGS 911 on it. Cue that scene in _Battleship Potemkin_ where everyone runs down the steps screaming in horror. Okay, it wasn’t that bad, but when Sol came up to my apartment, he was accompanied by my Super, whom I’ll call Marco – who is now _certain_ I’ve called these guys in to clear up a bedbug infestation instead of a ‘regular’ heavy duty cleaning. Marco is a good guy but obviously (and understandably) nervous about having bedbugs in the building. So he asked me, what’s going on? I told him. When he mentioned the bedbug thing, I told him vehemently no, as far as I know I do _not_ have bedbugs. He said “you know, you don’t have to pay if you have bedbugs; we’ll do this for you, no charge, just tell us and it’s okay.” Apparently he thought I was so embarrassed about having bedbugs that I wouldn’t have told him and instead would’ve brought in outside help. Which, in fairness? Is probably what I would’ve done if I _did_ have bedbugs, heh. However, I assured him, about three times, that no, I’m finally addressing this unholy mess, that’s all! The company I hired has two businesses, but I’m only utilizing the cleaning side, I swear! So Marco chatted to Sol in Spanish for a while, leaving me out of it – which I thought was a little irritating, like when my parents, aunts and uncles used Yiddish when they wanted to talk in private. Apparently, according to Sol later, Marco was just telling him to make sure to bring the garbage outside on Mondays, Wednesdays & Fridays. Anyway, apparently Marco called the freakin’ building manager to make sure it was “all right” (I mean, wtf? Half this building has housekeepers, but after twenty years I finally have a guy in to deep clean and it has to be approved by the Supreme Court?) Marco later came up _again_ and pulled me gently from the apartment to talk in the fire stairwell, saying it was okay with the manager (gee, thanks) but again asked about the freakin’ bedbugs. Again: No, Marco, there are NO FREAKIN BEDBUGS. Actually I was not angry, just smiling and reassuring him, but inside part of me is dying of embarrassment. But (to answer **Maastrict** ’s question from above), on the good side, Marco also said, “you know, once all this is done, why don’t you have us paint the place for you? And if I can find the right size of window blinds, I can replace those too. Just don’t tell the manager that I’m the one who suggested it, I’ll say you asked for it, okay? They don’t want me to _offer_ the service.” (Even though it’s part of the lease, I should mention. But they’re landlords, they’re predisposed to be stingy asshats. Mea culpa to anyone who’s a landlord out there, I’m sure there are some good ones too. And in fairness, if I had me for a tenant, paying below standard price for an apartment that could be earning them twice what I’m paying, I wouldn’t be feeling very generous either.) I thanked him profusely for looking out for me and finally went back to my place. Amused but in a rueful way, y’know? Because it was bad enough that I’d had to let a few people into my apartment (there were two helpers that just helped Sol bring in some of his equipment, then they left), but also my super AND my frickin’ building manager were now involved too. Joy. Still, it really was nice of Marco to mention the painting and definitely the window blinds, because my blinds are in shitty shape. So, with that mini-drama settled, now to business. Sol was _very_ nice and did not make me feel ashamed in the _least_. He went about his business, basically starting at the far end of the apartment and working his way in what I’d call the north-west quadrant of the place, moving further south (but staying on the western half). I told him the stuff that most matters to me: photos (obviously) and writing/letters. He said no prob and separated stuff into boxes, and gave me piles of papers to sort through so I could throw out the junk myself. He was impressed that I’m a writer (he asked if he coudl borrow a copy of one of my books, and I gave him the only one I had on hand, which kind of funnily was the teen version of my werewolf romantic suspense novel; let’s just say Sol isn’t someone I’d expect to be the target audience for this sort of book!) and also noticed my guitar and Casio keyboard, so we talked about music for a bit. I put on his favorite radio station (CBS 101.1, an ‘oldies’ station) and asked if he wanted any water or anything. He was _amazingly_ thorough. For example, I have a few wicker baskets filled with old mail and papers. After emptying them and giving the papers for me to sort, he washed off the basket so it was free of dust and any carpet beetles or whatever icky things may have been in there. So we’re not talking mere surface clean, but genuine clean, which is exactly what I was hoping for. Sol said that I was a great client and mentioned that many others are nosey and love asking about other people he’d worked for, I guess questions like “what kind of other horrible messes have you cleaned up?” He said he doesn’t talk about other people’s businesses. (Of course he kinda was, but very obliquely.) Though he did mention one dead war veteran whose home he’d had to clean a couple of weeks back, saying it was a damn shame that he’d obviously had no one to care for him in his last months, and Sol had found war medals that made Sol sad that the government didn’t take better care of its veterans. I mentioned that maybe the old man was just too ashamed or sick or proud to ask for help. Anyway, all this is to say that I’d say about 30% of my apartment looks a fuckton better than it did. Of course the big issue is that all the stuff he dug out still has no place to go yet, but I suspect once we tackle the closets that’ll be helped. Cleaning can sometimes be a case of “things look worse before they look better.” But even with all these _things_ around with no home yet, there’s a definite different feeling to the section he worked in. The floor’s empty (and he says on Friday he’ll wash and wax the floor for me) and obviously there’s no dust anywhere he was working. I was able to throw out things I didn’t think I’d ever get rid of, not because of sentimental reasons but just because I’ve had them so long it’s like they’d become physically attached to the apartment, like leeches or parasites. Stuff I’d had ever since leaving my first job, my first VCR which had a tape stuck in it and I was keeping the VCR always with the intention of digging that damn tape out of it. But when Sol tried and couldn’t remove the tape, I just said, “you know what? don’t bother, just dump it.” Wow! I heard myself say that and I was like, “who _is_ this woman?!” My homework tonight (delayed due to nap) is to do some preliminary sifting through the stuff he set aside, and also the big thing is for me to go through the books on my booskhelves and decide which to keep, which to donate. So all in all it was a good, if mentally and physically exhausting, first day. Part of me is anxious that there still won’t be a place for this stuff, but if worse comes to worst I’ll buy a bunch of containers from the aptly named Container Store and put stuff in there, where at least things won’t get dusty and I’ll label them and, if the closets are cleaned, store them there. I wasn’t able to take any pictures today, but I’ll do so tomorrow night and you’ll be able to see some before/after shots, though of course it’ll still only be a work in progress. **Broomstick** , thank you for your wise words. Right now, tentatively, I can say that I do feel better but a little nervous, as mentioned above, because I worry that I just have too many things for a studio apartment. So far no regrets, but I can very easily imagine I may have some separation anxiety, so to speak, and God knows when it’s time to throw [del]Oliver[/del] my chair out, which will be on Friday (that’s Big Trash day outside my building), that’ll be a toughie. All in all, Sol was such a straightforward, kind guy, and he made things so _easy_ for me, that I got through this with such relative ease due to him – and in no small part due to you guys, who I know had my back, at least in spirit. 🙂 So, off to work on the books. Thanks again to everyone who helped me through Day #1! ---
**Author:** ![Alice\_The\_Goon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Alice\_The\_Goon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alice_The_Goon)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/52 "2012-05-01T02:23:38Z")
Nope, that was **Nava** with the correct link. Glad you had a productive day- I was wincing for you, reading about the beginning. Oy! :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maggie_the_Ocelot)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/53 "2012-05-01T02:53:27Z")
Yaaaaay **choie**!!! I am so PROUD of you! ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/54 "2012-05-01T02:55:40Z")
May you have the rest tonight you very much deserve and tomorrow be sunnier than today! ---
**Author:** ![Tapiotar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3be4f8/32.png) [@Tapiotar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapiotar)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 12:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/55 "2012-05-01T12:37:29Z")
Yay, **choie**! It sounds like a terrific first day. I hope the rest goes just as well, or even better. Your attitude is terrific! You are doing something difficult with great spirit. ---
**Author:** ![sandra\_nz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eada6e/32.png) [@sandra\_nz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sandra_nz)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/56 "2012-05-01T12:46:11Z")
Awesome, you rock! It might have been awkward having Marco involved but hey, you get a paint job and new blinds out of it - woot! ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/57 "2012-05-01T13:25:58Z")
Way to go! **Choie** , you and this thread inspired me to do a Major Clean in my own room. (That, and the fact that I couldn’t find the slide adaptor for my scanner. Or my French books.) I got rid of half my clothes for donation, boxed up all the books that were in bags, tossed stuff, and vacuumed. Now, the clothes are in bags by the door ready for donation, and the boxes are ready to go down into the crawlspace. Next frontier: the paper “miscellanies”. Thank you, **choie** , for getting me off _my_ butt. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/58 "2012-05-01T14:32:06Z")
> [@choie](#): > > Marco! > [@sandra\_nz](#): > > Marco! Polo! Can’t help it. :o ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/59 "2012-05-01T17:55:40Z")
I am fascinated, and am subscribing to this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_I\_Am](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e495f1/32.png) [@Sam\_I\_Am](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_I_Am)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303/60 "2012-05-01T18:30:19Z")
> [@choie](#): > > - This level of over-empathizing with inanimate objects or bugs makes life _very_ hard for me. It’s exhausting and I know it’s irrational, and likely due to my incredibly low self-worth. I’m working on that. Hopefully this week will sort of be an immersion into my deep empathy issues and maybe help rid me of them, at least to get some proper perspective on what things should be valued and what I grew up in a very enmeshed relationship with my mom, and this lack of detachment from objects was one of the symptoms. I view it that people who grow up with good boundaries have kind of a smooth surface; those of us that didn’t are more like those kids toys that can stick and walk down walls - all sorts of protuberances, and sticky, so everything that we come into contact with sticks with us. It can be improved. A lot. It’s ok to have boundaries, to have a more solid edge to yourself. It’s not unsafe to leave the rest of the world to its own devices. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-hopefully-soon-to-be-former-hoarder-clutterer/620303.md?page=4)