# Ask the Librarian **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 3, 2010, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495 "2010-09-03T15:13:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![dzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@dzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzero)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/101 "2010-09-08T17:34:31Z")
> [@lindsaybluth](#): > > > [@dzero](#): > > > > If you’re going to keep insulting me by implying that I’m “uninformed” let me disabuse you of that notion. In addition to having 2 grad degrees, I also subscribe to and read a host of publications dealing with science, technology, finance, etc. I’m one of the last people you could justifiably call “uninformed”. > > I’m assuming they weren’t in social or cultural anthropology :rolleyes:. By the way, having a grad degree around here doesn’t mean shit. It’s clear you’re brand spankin’ new around here, so you’d be well served to do half as much talking and twice as much reading. As someone who is upper middle class or even solidly middle class (as it sounds you are) it’s easy to forget how the “other half” lives. Working in a public library is eye opening, and I worked alongside librarians last year for 5 months. It reminds you that large numbers of Americans don’t have internet access, and internet access is largely how you apply for jobs, check email, pay bills, read the news, and generally stay abreast of life anymore. Libraries aren’t going anywhere, their business model will (and should) change a bit to be more of a job and internet center than one that is research-based. And **Justin\_Bailey** is also correct that libraries are reactive with technology, and that budgets come in, at most, a yearly basis. If you want to pile on, by all means, give it your best shot. Of course as an old timer here you should know that such things are to be prosecuted in the pit. I look forward to your starting a thread for me. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/102 "2010-09-08T17:42:42Z")
> [@howye](#): > > What are your busiest days and times of days? I ask because my local library system cut back hours after budget cuts, but the hours did not make a lot of sense. They are completely closed on Sundays, which I would think would be a heavy volume day that you would want to be open for. You’d think so, but weekends are notoriously slow. People bitch and moan when a library announces that it plans to cut weekend hours, but when they are offered, no one comes in. Monday is definitely the busiest day, followed by Tuesday. Then it probably goes Friday, Wednesday and Thursday (a library is basically a ghost town on Thursday, don’t really know why either). The busiest times are early in the morning and right after school lets out with another mini-rush from 4-5. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/103 "2010-09-08T17:43:31Z")
Are libraries today actively trying to get young (5 - 9 years) involved in reading? Something like a book club or even volunteers to read books to pre-schoolers? I’ve wondered what is the current approach for kids reading programs? I recall my hometown library had the children’s section decorated and had child size chairs, tables etc. It made it more fun. But, I wished there had been more variety. It never seemed to change. ---
**Author:** ![howye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9adbd/32.png) [@howye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/howye)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/104 "2010-09-08T18:36:46Z")
Well then, the cut back hours make perfect sense. Although, knock on wood, a successful bond issue in Nov. would mean the restoration of full hours. Even so, its nice to know they are trying to be available as much as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/105 "2010-09-08T18:44:26Z")
That’s funny - Sundays are by FAR our busiest day. Partly that’s because only the main library is open then - all the branches are closed - and partly because we’re only open 4 hours, so you gotta get in and get it done in less time. But Jesus Christ, there are Sundays I never once sit down. ---
**Author:** ![lindsaybluth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/90db22/32.png) [@lindsaybluth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lindsaybluth)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/106 "2010-09-08T19:37:55Z")
> [@dzero](#): > > If you want to pile on, by all means, give it your best shot. Of course as an old timer here you should know that such things are to be prosecuted in the pit. I look forward to your starting a thread for me. Don’t flatter yourself anymore than you already have, dearest. **Justin** , I’m interested to hear how you choose your history books. I noticed we either lacked or only had missing copies of a couple of well known books that are utilized in college classrooms and to your average person interested in history. When I brought this to the attention of our history guy, he seemed unfazed. Whereas I’m continually impressed with our selection of science stuff and cook books. Are the lacking areas often due to just one person’s decisions, and where’s the oversight? **aceplace57** , I’m not a librarian, but I was an intern for five months last year. For part of that time my duties were those of the children’s librarian, who was on maternity leave. Our summer reading program was very popular, and a lot of time, money, and publicity went into it. There was a kick off petting zoo at the Main library and tons of other smaller events (sporting event ticket giveaways, rewards for certain local restaurants for reading so many books, etc). But I can definitely tell you, beyond a shred of a doubt, that nothing, _nothing_ matters more than the makeup of the parents or caregivers. I remember one little girl and boy came in with their grandfather twice a week. They loved Grandpa, and looked up to him - and he left the library with a DVD and multiple books each time, and so did they. They were fiercely competitive with each other in regards to how much they read. Conversely, lots of parents would come in with their rugrats screaming (at ages of like 6 and 10, ages kids certainly have control over themselves to an extent) and sign up for the free sporting tickets and often lied about what the kids read in order to get restaurant coupons. I honestly think that the “get your kid to read in the summer!” crap doesn’t help, it’s just fun for the kids who were already GOING to read, it doesn’t bring anyone new or on the bring into the fold. I should also mention that the branch I was at (for 2 months) was in a working class neighborhood, so income wasn’t a factor there. What helps is a ton of books and a knowledgeable librarian or library assistant and programs where kids are read to - no matter what age. This is, of course, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![dzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@dzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzero)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/107 "2010-09-08T19:54:47Z")
> [@lindsaybluth](#): > > Don’t flatter yourself anymore than you already have, dearest. Duly noted and filed. ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/108 "2010-09-08T22:56:36Z")
More questions: Do you still buy books now that you have access to your library’s entire collection? Are you ever tempted to buy books for the library that you personally want to read (and that you wouldn’t otherwise purchase)? Have you ever felt physically threatened by a patron? Are you concerned about being stalked by some of the odd people who use the library? How do you deal with ethically questionable requests for help? Let’s say that a mentally ill patron wants help searching for the home address of the mayor or somebody on the Internet? Can you refuse or does that violate the Librarian’s Code? ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/109 "2010-09-09T05:35:58Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Are libraries today actively trying to get young (5 - 9 years) involved in reading? > Something like a book club or even volunteers to read books to pre-schoolers? I’ve wondered what is the current approach for kids reading programs? Libraries will never stop trying to get young kids to read. It’s practically our entire reason to exist (which does cause a little jealousy sometimes). The Summer Reading Club is always very popular. Kids read 20 minutes a day, they come in and get a little prize and always leave with more books. Storytimes, school visits, reading lists. We don’t stray too far from the standard stuff. But the big push nowadays is teaching literacy as well as pushing books to read. Storytimes will include a game or a song or something that builds on a literacy skill and we have stacks of literacy kits that parents can use at home to help their kids become better readers. > [@lindsaybluth](#): > > **Justin** , I’m interested to hear how you choose your history books. I noticed we either lacked or only had missing copies of a couple of well known books that are utilized in college classrooms and to your average person interested in history. When I brought this to the attention of our history guy, he seemed unfazed. Whereas I’m continually impressed with our selection of science stuff and cook books. Are the lacking areas often due to just one person’s decisions, and where’s the oversight? It depends entirely on who and how many people a library has for book selectors. Most small to medium-sized public libraries have one or two people choosing the books and if they’re not well versed in a subject they’ll by what the recommended titles are. With history, it’s important to remember that what might be well known might also be old, so a librarian may be holding out for a more updated take on the same subject. So yes, it often comes down to one person’s decision and there is no official oversight. You just have to make your suggestions and hope the other person is listening. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/110 "2010-09-09T05:47:28Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > Do you still buy books now that you have access to your library’s entire collection? Are you ever tempted to buy books for the library that you personally want to read (and that you wouldn’t otherwise purchase)? I was never a big book buyer and all working for the library has done is made me appreciate used books more. So I’ll buy a ton of books at our book sale for 50 cents, but the number of new books I buy for myself has stayed at a pretty constant 1-2 year for my whole life. I’m not the book buyer for my library, but I definitely buy DVDs and CDs that I’m interested in for the collection. I rationalize this by saying that my tastes match up with a lot of our patrons (and it’s true, I’m not blowing smoke up my own ass), but I will admit I buy them for me first and the collection second. > [@](#): > > Have you ever felt physically threatened by a patron? Are you concerned about being stalked by some of the odd people who use the library? I’ve never felt physically threatened, but I definitely feel like Witness Protection Man and Muttering Guy Who’s Definitely Not All There have a violent streak to them. It wouldn’t surprise me if either one ever took a swing at somebody, but I’ve never felt like “today’s the day” in their presence yet. As for stalkers, I’m not concerned about it, but I definitely think about it. Especially because Muscle Shirt Man likes to make a point of “I saw you at [store close to my house]” or “I saw you walking your dog on [street near my house]” when I know for a fact that Muscle Shirt Man doesn’t live anywhere near there. > [@](#): > > How do you deal with ethically questionable requests for help? Let’s say that a mentally ill patron wants help searching for the home address of the mayor or somebody on the Internet? Can you refuse or does that violate the Librarian’s Code? All I have access to is publicly available materials. So if someone wants to know an address for someone, all I can do is open the phone book and look. So in a situation like that, I’d just look up the address and hope for the best. I can’t say I’ve ever dealt with anyone that I felt was looking for an address to do a beatdown on the owner though. But I will say that if the request bothers me, I won’t put my full effort into it. Oh, Crazy Magnetic Waves Lady, you want me to find a study from the early 80s that proved that homosexuals were depraved psychos who admit they deserve the die? Yeah, I looked and I couldn’t find anything (I didn’t really look). Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/111 "2010-09-09T17:19:53Z")
As a female librarian at a downtown library I definitely worry about seeing some of my patrons near my house. It’s happened, because I don’t live that far from the library and the bus goes near my house, and I don’t know if it’s ever been on purpose, but I’ve informed security at the library a few times. I also have a very large, ugly dog. ---
**Author:** ![MTCicero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a4c791/32.png) [@MTCicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MTCicero)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/112 "2010-09-09T19:17:38Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > It’s **alright**. Talk about being uninformed. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/113 "2010-09-09T19:25:14Z")
I live in world-renowned :rolleyes: Gainesville, Florida, and my local library has Terry Jones’ book, Islam is of the Devil, listed as being on order. What do you predict will happen to it? My prediction is that the first person to check it out will “lose” it. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/114 "2010-09-09T20:18:58Z")
> [@MTCicero](#): > > > [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > > > It’s **alright**. > > Talk about being uninformed. Do you have a problem with words that trace their usage back to the 1800s? [http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/alright](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/alright) ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/115 "2010-09-09T20:23:32Z")
> [@Dung\_Beetle](#): > > I live in world-renowned :rolleyes: Gainesville, Florida, and my local library has Terry Jones’ book, Islam is of the Devil, listed as being on order. What do you predict will happen to it? My prediction is that the first person to check it out will “lose” it. I know about the preacher but I didn’t know his name was Terry Jones. My first thought was “Odd name for a book by a Monty Python member”, but he is a medieval history & Crusades enthusiast so it could work. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/116 "2010-09-09T22:35:51Z")
As an academic librarian a lot of my issues are different from public librarians, but to chime in on the “future of libraries” (an oft discussed topic) I’m not what anybody can call an optimist but I honestly do think they’ll be around for many years and libarianship as a profession with them. Librarianship is first and foremost a service profession and like other service professions we evolve as needed to keep up with the demand; daily life for librarians in 2010 is significantly different than in 1990 which was significantly different than in 1970. Go back further into the history of the occupation and it’s amazing how much it’s changed: at one point librarians were famous for prudery and acting as local censors and arbiters of morality- a stereotype some still have associations with even though it was generations ago- whereas today they’re famous for the other extreme- zealous protectors of information availability and freedom (at least where adults are concerned, sensible precautions for the underage of course are in force- Billy Jr. and Cindy don’t really need to be checking out _The Joy of Gay Sex_ and _The Anarchist Cookbook_ for their respective 3rd grade projects just yet). In academia there’s also the issue of students who think that because they’ve used the Internet daily most of their lives they’re experts in finding information, then they find out they’re not. Databases can be very complicated for starters, then there’s the issue of not everything being on the Internet, then there’s the issue of “it’s on the Internet but I challenge you to find it if you don’t know where to look”. (Government Documents are perhaps the leader in this field- if you want to know about estimated graphite deposits in Iowa or how many gas pumps were in Sioux City, Iowa in 1948 or the text of a House of Reps speech from 1988 it’s in a government document and probably online, but you’ll go nuts getting to it.) If librarianship had an official motto or mantra it would be the quote from Boswell’s _Life of Johnson_: > [@](#): > > “Knowledge is of two kinds. We know a subject ourselves, or we know where we can find information upon it.” We’re the people who know where to find information upon it. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/117 "2010-09-09T22:39:26Z")
Or, as I said once on another message board- and was reprinted in _Library Journal_ (with permission and attribution of course), (to the tune of [Modern Major General](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSGWoXDFM64)): > [@](#): > > \*\*The Very Model of a Modern-Day Librarian > > Reference Librarian:\*\* > > I am the very model of a modern-day librarian > > I know information sources, both online and antiquarian > > I can catalog a book or note in LC or Dewey Decimal > > From general subject heading to specifics infinitesimal > > I’m very well acquainted, too, with surfing of the Internet > > and just how to find authority for the web sites that you get > > of deducing just who wrote this, why and when and where and what > > using Boolean indicators AND and OR and WI-3 and NOT. > > **Chorus:** > > Using Boolean indicators AND and OR and WI-3 and NOT > > Using Boolean indicators AND and OR and WI-3 and NOT > > Using Boolean indicators AND and OR and WI-3 and NOT > > **RL:** > > I help students find the sources that they need for freshman literature > > finding books and essays, articles and all else that you can get at your > > own library then I’ll ILL a tome on Proustian simile > > and find the latest explication of that damned “A Rose for Emily.” > > **Chorus:** > > The latest explication of that damned “A Rose for Emily” > > The latest explication of that damned “A Rose for Emily” > > The latest explication of that damned “A Rose for Emi-Emi-ly” > > **RL:** > > I’ll locate English text translations of postmodern Belgian histories > > and get the latest stats for algae growth in Mekong delta fisheries > > for psych majors I’ll find papers on disorders with delirium > > and for bio majors all that’s writ about this week’s assigned bacterium > > I can tell a Finnish scholar why his Parliament’s bipartisan > > and how to carve a dragon shield if he’s a Viking artisan > > Then I can find a diarist who opines about technology > > From Pepys to blogs who entered logs which also dissed phrenology > > **Chorus:** > > From Pepys to blogs who entered logs which also dissed phrenology > > From Pepys to blogs who entered logs which also dissed phrenology > > From Pepys to blogs who entered logs which also dissed phrenolo-nolo-nology! > > **RL:** > > Then I can take a freshman whose search skills are rasa tabula > > And teach him to find sources from Internet to incunabula > > In short, in info sources, from online to antiquarian > > I am the very model of a modern-day librarian. > > **ALL:** > > In short, in info sources, from online to antiquarian > > I am the very model of a modern-day librarian. > > **RL:** > > In fact, when I know what is meant by “metatags” and “Dublin Core,” > > When I know Basic Books v. Kinkos and just what the Rule of Five is for, > > When I can tell what separates the popular from the scholarly, > > And when I know what changes happen in databases hourly, > > When I can name the journals on more subjects than I could ever list, > > When I’ve been on more committees than a Haight-Ashbury activist > > In short, when I can use a database like the most-skilled impresario, > > You’ll say you never saw a more informed bibliotecario. > > **ALL:** > > You’ll say you never saw a more informed bibliotecario. > > You’ll say you never saw a more informed bibliotecario. > > You’ll say you never saw a more informed bibliotecario. > > **RL:** > > For all our information knowledge, people never grasp how grand we are, > > As true today as true it was in ancient Alexandria, > > But still, in info sources, both online and antiquarian > > I am the very model of a modern-day Librarian. > > **ALL:** > > But still, in info sources, both online and antiquarian > > I am the very model of a modern-day Librarian! ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/118 "2010-09-09T23:33:02Z")
You should probably just cut me off, because as someone who spends too much of my free-time in libraries, I have a million questions. You mentioned that modern librarians don’t restrict what people check out. What if a ten-year-old wants to check out something racy? Like the Story of O or something? What about something tamer, like Lady Chatterly or Lolita, but you know they have conservative parents? Are there minor policies in place? How often do you actually notice what your patrons are checking out? If I go up to the check-out desk with a Cat Fancy magazine, a copy of _120 Days of Sodom_, and _Build Your Own Fireworks at Home_, will you even notice, or will you discreetly wait until I leave and then tell all your coworkers about Firework Cat Porno guy? I was at the public library a while ago and the lady in front of me had a couple dollar fine from two or three years ago. She loudly proclaimed that she had already paid it, she had returned the items in question on time, etc. Finally, the clerk said just forget it and proceeded to check out the new books or DVDs to her. The woman continued to proclaim her innocence. How would you have handled the situation? Is it easier to just forgive a couple bucks when you know the person is going to kick up a stink? ---
**Author:** ![MTCicero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a4c791/32.png) [@MTCicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MTCicero)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2010, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/119 "2010-09-10T00:52:10Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > > [@MTCicero](#): > > > > Talk about being uninformed. > > Do you have a problem with words that trace their usage back to the 1800s? > > [http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/alright](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/alright) No. I just have a problem with you referring to someone as uninformed when you choose to use the [vulgar corruption of “all right”](http://www.dailywritingtips.com/is-alright-all-right/). ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2010, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495/120 "2010-09-10T01:05:00Z")
> [@MTCicero](#): > > No. I just have a problem with you referring to someone as uninformed when you choose to use the [vulgar corruption of “all right”](http://www.dailywritingtips.com/is-alright-all-right/). I don’t care if it’s vulgar or corrupt: natural language change is alright by me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-librarian/552495.md?page=7)