Thanks! (I’m going to PM you because now I am curious about what you do.)
When I started painting in 1979, it was very rare to see women painting, or in the trades generally. It’s still rare but not as much so. The popularity of faux and decorative painting over the last decade or so has brought a lot of women into the decorative/faux end of the biz. I work a lot with a couple of women who are excellent faux painters/decorative plasterers and they’re very competent.
I think what annoys me about some women are the types that assume they’re incapable of doing anything that involves manual labor or anything that seems like “men’s work.” Either professionally, or around the home - mowing, taking out the trash, replacing a high lightbulb, whatever. They can but they assume they can’t because of their gender. That’s sexism too.
Heh…for some reason I am having a hard time thinking of assumptions, wrong or right. Painting-specifically, assumptions include that a wall o’ scaffolding is necessary to paint foyers or big walls (almost never), people are surprised that we can paint straight lines without needing tape (my stock answer “30 years of experience and $25.00 brushes”), and yes, that it goes so quickly once we get rolling.
Nowadays I do almost all residential repaints. Back when I was doing new construction, remodels and so on, where there were a lot of trades involved, I encountered more cranky customers and non-paying general contractors. Because painting and flooring is about the last thing to get done, people are sick and tired of the mess, everyone’s running out of money, and it’s an insider joke that other trades (carpenters and drywall finishers mostly) will leave imperfections and sloppy work because “oh, the painter will fix it.” :rolleyes:
No…I pretty much have a standard formula for what I charge and IMO I’m very fair…with little up- and down-charges for things like distance from home (driving 30 minutes round trip v 2-3 hours) and unpleasantness - ie extremely dirty homes, or a tall exterior on a hill and surrounded by trees and shrubs. If I really like a client, I’m more likely to throw in extras. Like I’m painting inside but their front door looks dreadful…meh, a quart of paint and an hour of work to make a big difference and make them happy…worth it to me!
I charge by how long it will take. For a bedroom…walls only, ceilings too, trim? Very basically, I figure roughly $200 per day labor plus materials. Two coats, walls only, on a 15 x 15 bedroom, absent any big drywall repairs, will take me…5 or so hours? And two gallons of paint. Or maybe a gallon and a quart, depending. Add the ceiling…will bump it to a full day, or possible two separate visits because the ceiling has to dry before I can cut in the walls unless we use the same paint on walls and ceilings, which I very rarely do. And a gallon of ceiling paint. So your bedroom would be somewhere between $250 and $350. Yes, I’d put a wallpaper border up for ya.
There’s no standard pricing in the paint biz, like there is, say, with flooring where you’re more likely to be charged a square-foot price. Too many variables.
I work for less here in Michigan than I did 10 years ago on Colorado. Partly the economy, but also the cost of living is much, much lower here. Like most people, I will quote less for a job when there isn’t much work, say in February or March. Because I’d rather work for something than not work at all. But I sort of hate doing that. Yes, there have been jobs where stuff happened and I made barely any money…sometimes my screw-up, sometimes just unavoidable stuff or wildly difficult clients. Luckily that doesn’t happen much, and since it’s all word of mouth and repeat business, I get along well with and like almost everyone I do work for, and some have become friends.
Sure I guarantee my work…not in a set-in-stone formulaic way. But I make it very clear to people that if they see something I’ve missed, or didn’t do right, I will come back and make it right. Honestly I can’t afford not to, even if I wanted to! Like a lot of good trades people, I rely on my reputation to keep working. If word got out that I was being unprofessional, I wouldn’t have as much work.
Yes, I’ll fix things or do things right, even if the client doesn’t care or wouldn’t know the difference. Of course. Have there been times I haven’t? Sure.
I learned on the job working for myself (and I shudder to think of some of the sloppy work I must have done back then, heh.) I actually started way back with another woman; her parents managed a large motel and we started painting the motel rooms, and it sort of grew from there. Yes I have liability insurance, it’s cheap, under $500 per year. I’ve had as many as a dozen people working for me, now it’s just me and a helper. Occasionally I need extra help for a day here or there; I have people I can call.
I have not seen any “day laborers” hanging around looking for work since I moved to Michigan…was common in Colorado. I understand that’s not so much the case any more, though. I have hired day laborers a few times and paid them cash under the table, yes. By illegal I guess you mean “undocumented worker” …no, I don’t think I ever have, although not for any ethical reasons. Just because the opportunity never arose, I guess. AFAIK any foreign-born person who’s ever done work for me was here legally.
Here’s an assumption I run into a lot: “Oh, anybody can paint.” And while it’s true that more or less anyone can slap color on the walls, it’s also true that people who can paint well, and not make an unholy mess, are worth pretty much whatever they see fit to charge. I’ve actually begun putting a clause in my leases to stop my tenants from painting because they do such a wretched job and create so much extra work for me.
Anyway, chiroptera, thanks for your suggestions. You’re a mine of information. If I can ask one more question, what brand of brushes do you use?
We’re planning to repaint our front porch deck this summer and wanted to check with you as to method and material. My plan of attack is to scrape any loose bits up, do a light sanding with a pole sander using, say, 120 grit, power wash, then paint with a roller. I’m assuming I won’t have to do any heavy power sanding for this, and that 120 is good enough to profile the existing paint. Do you have a recommendation for deck paint? Somehow, in 40 years of construction and maintenance work, I never had to paint a deck (not that I’m complaining).
Also, I’m curious about something: why is it that you don’t sound like you’ve had your head in a can of thinner too long? Most painters I’ve known were pretty loopy after some years in the biz, and could barely speak coherently, let alone write.
That’s absolutely true - it’s why when GM went toes up and the economy around here plummeted, the market was flooded with people who were bidding jobs at $8-10 an hour. Suddenly I was being underbid all over the place.
I have to say that I do run into homeowners who have done some of their own painting and they do a very competent job. But more often…yah. Nothing I would charge to do, for sure!
Purdy or Wooster. The Purdy brushes with the blue bristles…can’t think of the name - that they came out with a couple of years ago are things of beauty. Hold a ton of paint, cut an exquisitely nice line, last forever. Well, maybe not forever. But I bought several when they first came out (“ooh, cute! Blue bristles!”) and still have them. Tip: Screw a cup-hook into the wood just above the ferrule (the metal band) so you can hang the brush on the inside edge of the bucket. Instead of resting it on the bottom so the bristles bend, or resting it on the top where it dries out. I am terribly picky about my brushes, nobody else uses them, and it makes me twitch when I see good brushes mistreated. It’s like seeing puppies kicked or kittens stepped on. I hate it.
Honestly? I talk people out of painting wood decks or porches all the time, because I’ver never seen a painted deck or exterior porch floor look good for more than a year or two. But yours is already painted so…
120 grit won’t touch it. If anything, wash first. Don’t powerwash - get a good deck/siding cleaner that kills mildew (if my read of your location is correct you’re in the PNW where this is an issue?). Follow directions on the product label; usually apply, scrub, hose off. Powerwashing forces water everywhere, and can take days or weeks to dry enough for applying solvent-based products.
Sanding a dirty surface simply gums the sandpaper up with dirt, like in minutes. Also a pole sander pad is a pretty flat surface - so you won’t be sanding the rounded edges or uneven bits.
If you sand, I’d start with 50-60-grit depending on how rough the surface is, then resand with 80, then 120. I’d only start and finish with 120 if it’s already very smooth and slick.
Do you know what type of paint is on there currently? (If you don’t know, rub it with some rubbing alcohol - that will soften and lift water-based paints; won’t affect oil-based.)
Generally speaking, oil-based paint over existing oil, or primer + acrylic/epoxy-modified latex over existing water-based paint.
It’s been a long time, but Dunn Edwards, back when I painted out west, had some excellent epoxy-modified water-based paints, very hard and quite high build.
Generally speaking: oil-based paints will promote mildew (it’s food for mildew spores) and are harder, but more brittle and more prone to failure from moisture. Acrylic/epoxies are more flexible and less brittle, and less likely to fail in damp conditions. So the product you use should be suited to your region and weather conditions.
That’s generally speaking: I would go to whatever good regional or national-brand stores in your area where painters shop, and ask the staff (and any painters standing around waiting for their paint to be mixed.) If you’re in a lake or ocean region…visit a boat supply store.
Sorry if that sounds like a cop-out…I haven’t applied paint to a deck in well over a decade and the one client who didn’t heed my advice and painted a humungous deck BRIGHT BLUE after I refused to do it, had a big peeling mess on his hands the very next year.
I do a lot of ceilings with a 1/4 formula flat mix of the wall color (whatever sheen). Adds a little punch to the place and the ceilings still look substantially brighter than the walls. And I hate any sheen on a ceiling. In my 35+ yrs experience, I’ve seen maybe 3 perfectly flat ceilings. Even a heavy panda-paw texture won’t hide seams if you put a sheen on it.
I’ve worked with some very good women painters. A job’s a job and if a person can do it well, pay 'em!
Also, most of the painters of my generation that I know (and myself), are very careful about using respirators when spraying lacquers, epoxies, or alkyds. Not a mere dust mask, a respirator. Our spray classes (offered by Graco and others) spend the first part of class detailing how to adjust them properly, when to change the filters, etc… I haven’t seen a lacquer-head in a couple of decades, and they were all of the previous generation. Thank you OSHA!
Some good stuff there, especially on the power-washing. If it comes down to power-sanding, I’ll have to hire somebody. My knees just won’t take it anymore. In fact, I’ll probably do that anyway, but get the paint on my own. I know a one-man operation who takes on small jobs. The surface is pretty smooth, as the porch area was rebuilt in recent years before we bought the place. I think they used a cheap paint on it, however, some of which is in a can in the garage. It’s not horrible, since the rain doesn’t hit it, but it’s rubbing off where we have a rubber-backed entry carpet.
The question about why I don’t sound like I’ve been imbibing thinner for decades?
Seriously: good genes is my best guess. I know quite a few people (some much, much younger than me) who have had all sorts of health issues and operations and whatnot. I haven’t ahem lived a particularly pure life, but AFAIK I’m healthy as a horse and compos mentis, usually.
Also, since the EPA and other pesky entities have started regulating things like lead and toluene and MEK, I suppose neurological damage and mental decline in middle-aged persons who regularly work with such things is also on the decline and I am just a lucky Boomer.
Most of the painters I knew seemed to be heavy drinkers, but excellent craftsmen. One guy got blitzed every night, but still managed to suit up in the morning, climb up the scaffolding, and run his paint gun like it had a laser sight. His personal life was a complete disaster, of course, and I never saw him wear a respirator.
I don’t see that in my particular field. But, I tend to work a lot of fairly high end remodels, referred from a particular batch of GCs, decorators, and realtors. Probably has a little to do with who I see on any regular basis.
It’s been many years since I’ve done a ton of spraying (my little Graco is an older model, back in the day I had 2 or 3 and it was a daily thing…had one just for lacquers) but YES I had my Darth Vader respirator. Combined with a Walkman (NPR is my friend at work unless I have to talk to people) it was sort of a sensory deprivation experience. Spray hood, respirator, Walkman, glasses or safety goggles.
I’ve seen that, I even worked with a guy who drank a case of beer every day WHILE WORKING (no, oh HELL no I didn’t hire him, he was a friend of a painter friend who brought him in on a rush commercial job we did together) and you wouldn’t know he just had to be bombed out of his mind. He went on autopilot, I guess, he was fast and good.
Like NoClue…I almost exclusively do high-end residential repaints and the occasional remodel these days and almost everyone I know in the trades is very professional, very trustworthy.
It’s taken a lot of years and tears to re-educate the tradespeople. When I started out as a young electrician in the late 60s, the first thing anybody did was to remove guards and safety devices on tools, and even cut off the grounding lug on cords. Respirators - hell, even dust masks - and earmuffs/plugs were never used, and asbestos had yet to hit the radar. Full face protection was for welders, and people routinely used bench grinders without goggles or the built-in guards. It’s amazing that more people weren’t maimed, blinded or poisoned, and I count myself lucky to have escaped with nothing more than tinnitus. I’m glad to see that people are working smarter nowadays.
Do you have any recommendations for painting a bathroom, like type of paint? The walls in both bathrooms haven’t been painted since my condo was built six years ago, and I’m finally getting around to painting them in a few weeks.
I want to get my master bedroom and the dressing area/bathroom painted. Right now, the surfaces have some texture, but they aren’t popcorn. I’m guessing that this will eliminate a wallpaper border and/or stencils?
How do I go about finding a good painter? My husband has nominated his 15 year old nephew, but I would prefer to have this done RIGHT the first time. It’s cheaper in the long run. Also, what amenities should I offer? I don’t plan on offering beer (or other alcohol), just lemonade and/or pop.
How much prep am I expected to do? I have the bed, one small desk, and one night stand in the bedroom, because I have refused to put more furniture in the room until after it’s painted. I have Elfa shelves covering one wall, but I don’t have books in them yet, because I don’t want to remove the books and then replace them. Should I just remove the shelves? I really don’t want to remove the racks that the shelves are on. I am thinking that I really should remove the shelves (it’s simple to do) so that the walls behind the shelves can be painted. Otherwise I’ll have to leave that whole wall white, and I hate white walls.
What should I do about the white ceiling? Paint it a lighter or darker shade of the walls? Around here, everyone seems to leave the ceiling white, but my accent colors are medium purple and a beige. The main color is a pale lavender. Go ahead, laugh. Lavender makes me happy. White walls make me unhappy.
What do you think about Glidden brand? My husband likes it, but I am open to other brands. We’ve got at least one Sherwin Williams store around here, and possibly Benjamin Moore.
Used to be semi-gloss was the standard recommendation, but water-based paint has come a long way and I prefer the matte/satin finishes, sometimes called “washable flat” paint. Not as much glare, won’t show imperfections as much, hold up really well.
Count on two coats, especially over builder paint.
Caulk gaps everywhere, also caulk where the shower stall meets the drywall…there’s almost always a crack there and caulking prevents moisture getting behind the drywall.
