# Ask The Patriotic American Intellectual Conservative Christian **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 9, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234 "2010-02-09T03:41:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/221 "2010-02-14T03:02:12Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > What Jesus said is pretty logical through inference but… No, it really isn’t. At all. > [@](#): > > Corinthians I 7:9 Paul was talking about sex, not masturbation. > [@](#): > > 1. What do you mean? Please elaborate. How are children supposed to be able to tell whether what they are being taught is true or false? > [@](#): > > 1. God would not lie to us like that-there is no direct factual error in the Bible if one recognizes certain passages are symbolical Are you sure you want to go here? I can show you many, many, many factual errors in the Bible that are not meant to be taken metaphorically or symbolically. > [@](#): > > HP Lovecraft, Abraham Lincoln, and a great theologian-maybe Jonathon Edwards and I’d like to talk about History, politics, and theology. HP Lovecraft WAS a great theologian. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/222 "2010-02-14T03:17:18Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > No, it really isn’t. At all. > > Paul was talking about sex, not masturbation. Masturbation **is** a sexual act. > [@](#): > > How are children supposed to be able to tell whether what they are being taught is true or false? I suppose they will have to learn about it elsewhere and it matters of faith decide for themselves in the end. > [@](#): > > Are you sure you want to go here? I can show you many, many, many factual errors in the Bible that are not meant to be taken metaphorically or symbolically. For instance parts of Genesis may be allegorical. But I guess I STHU about it now. > [@](#): > > HP Lovecraft WAS a great theologian. 😉 Yes he was the greatest theologian since Abdul Alhazred for the Sect of the Great Old Ones. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/223 "2010-02-14T05:23:06Z")
Hey, a joke. Well done. I’m less worried now. ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/224 "2010-02-14T07:01:31Z")
**Ask The Patriotic American Intellectual Conservative Christian** What does ‘Patriotic’ mean to you? I mean, say if you were born in England for example, do you think you would be a patriotic Englishman/woman? Why, or why not? If so, why is being patriotic an important part of your self-identity? Doesn’t it just mean ‘I was born into this country, so that’s what I know, and that’s what I love’? Or is it something else? I’m interested to know what you think it means. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/225 "2010-02-14T07:17:25Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Masturbation **is** a sexual act. Paul was talking about actual sex. Your Bible never mentions or condemns masturbation. Trust me on this. I know more about it than you do. > [@](#): > > For instance parts of Genesis may be allegorical. But I guess I STHU about it now. There are parts which are _not_ intended to be allegorical which are factually inaccurate. Once again, you can trust m on this. ---
**Author:** ![ToeJam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@ToeJam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ToeJam)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/226 "2010-02-14T07:51:36Z")
1. Who do you think should run against Obama in the next election for the republicans? 2. How do you feel about Sarah Palin in general? Would you support her bid for the office if she ran under the republican ticket (why or why not)? ---
**Author:** ![adhay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecd19e/32.png) [@adhay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adhay)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/227 "2010-02-14T13:59:45Z")
> [@Isamu](#): > > **Ask The Patriotic American Intellectual Conservative Christian** > What does ‘Patriotic’ mean to you? … I’m interested to know what you think it means. Let me help you out. **Patriotic American** : My country, right or wrong, American hegemony forever, no matter how unchristian our foreign policy. To **Curtis** , the killing of millions of innocent bystanders in our illegal wars to spread freedom, democracy and the free market is perfectly justified, despite the 6th commandment, which he considers to be the revealed Word of a just creator. **Intellectual** : For instance (one of **Curtis** ’s favorite expressions), see > [@adhay](#): > > This is the foundation for your statement (as an “intellectual”) that NC is smarter than you? Well… **Conservative Christian** : **Curtis** ignores the “problem of evil”, i.e., how to reconcile his idea of an omnipotent and loving creator with what he calls “sin” and “evil” in the world along with it’s eventual God ordained eternal punishment. When called to account regarding particular instances of this conundrum, his answer is “I am not a theologian”. He has expressed admiration for the ideas of Jonathan Edwards, an 18th century theologian most noted for his rousing sermon entitled, [Sinners in The Hands of an Angry God](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinners_in_the_Hands_of_an_Angry_God). Not surprisingly, Edwards (who was also a prodigy, he entered Yale when he was 12 years old) also seems to have ignored the issue. God help us. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/228 "2010-02-14T20:46:32Z")
Curtis, here are a few questions for you. 1. What are your favorite movies? 2. What are your favorite TV shows? 3. Do you participate in any sports? 4. Did you ever consider that children are taught religious “truths” in order to keep them out of trouble, but somewhere along the way, the children forget to sort out what is truth and what is fairy tale? Since every religion claims to be the “truth”, and has beliefs stemming from before the dawn of modern science, do you think that a large dose of skepticism might be a good thing? ---
**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/229 "2010-02-14T21:41:51Z")
Um…I got nothin to ask this go 'round. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/230 "2010-02-14T22:00:28Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Economic sloth, falling to competition against China, India, and Brazil, massive tax burdens. India and China’s industry is a creation of American greed. we started business there, moving ours lock ,stock and intellectual property so our corporations could take advantage of low pay and weak environmental laws. They did not invent a better mouse trap. We sent ours there for short term huge profits. The rest of the country will have to pay for that. The American people are suffering for that. But damn, some people made a fortune. We not only allowed them to take our businesses and jobs abroad, but gave them tax breaks for doing it. International corporations owe no loyalty or respect for the countries that create them. They will move anytime it makes them money. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/231 "2010-02-14T22:12:20Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > All humans naturally want to lie to hide embarassing secrets or attack people they hate. That is why humans are not perfect and thus sinners. Lust cannot be compeltely overcome but it can be controlled. > > I accept scientific theories such as evolution or the Big Bang-but also acknowledge God is behind it. > > If God exists than certainly He must have revealed His truths-ie in one of the religions. > > I struggle with my faith like many other Christians do. > > God said it is a sin (ie “abusers of themselves”) and thus I follow Him. > > He also built up the Strategic Air Command as a general and helped build up America’s massive air power. We keep getting whipped by countries with no airforce or navy. War by remote control will not win. Boots on the ground wars have to have soldiers who believe they are fighting for a cause. many soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan don’t know why we are there. They fight for their fellow soldiers. They fight because they are told to and forced to. They want to survive their time and come home. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2010, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/232 "2010-02-14T23:02:27Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > One can’t choose not to be hungry but you can choose whether to eat a bowl of soup or fifteen Big Macs. (snip) By which logic, you are here arguing that it isn’t masturbation that’s a sin, but _excessive_ masturbation. I personally disagree that even excessive masturbation a sin, but acknowledge that there may be reasons to discourage it when we teach our children about sex. Masturbation is a perfectly normal thing and no more harmful or sinful than eating or defecating. As others have mentioned, we want our kids to learn good habits, and in the process we may make some blanket declarations that the kids, as adults, learn to separate from the sensible advice (most adults do, anyway). Are you aware that a hundred years ago, many people believed that masturbation caused all kinds of health problems, which we now know is baloney? That’s the fallout of drawing the boundaries of ‘sin’ too indiscriminately. ---
**Author:** ![B.Serum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/b.serum/32/14266_2.png) [@B.Serum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/B.Serum)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2010, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/233 "2010-02-15T00:12:38Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > That’s part of Mosaic Law along with kosher dietary rules which no longer apply to Christians… Curtis, I know you’re getting thrown a lot of question here, but when you toss off brief one-liners that fail to thoroughly answer the question, people are going to respond back in spades with more question to clarify what could have been put to rest in a single, thorough response (see below). So Curtis: please stop tossing off. 😉 So you don’t believe the Ten Commandments apply to Christians? Doesn’t Leviticus fall under Mosaic Law? Who said Christians aren’t bound by Mosiac? Are there any other portions of the Bible you don’t take as word of God besides Mosaic Law? ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2010, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/234 "2010-02-15T16:40:40Z")
> [@Isamu](#): > > **Ask The Patriotic American Intellectual Conservative Christian** > > What does ‘Patriotic’ mean to you? I mean, say if you were born in England for example, do you think you would be a patriotic Englishman/woman? Why, or why not? > > If so, why is being patriotic an important part of your self-identity? Doesn’t it just mean ‘I was born into this country, so that’s what I know, and that’s what I love’? > > Or is it something else? I’m interested to know what you think it means. Well naturally since I was born here I love my nation-it’s pretty natural. So yes if I had been born in the UK I’d suppose I’d be a British patriot. > [@ToeJam](#): > > 1. Who do you think should run against Obama in the next election for the republicans? David Petreaus. Failing that, Mitt Romney. > [@](#): > > 1. How do you feel about Sarah Palin in general? Would you support her bid for the office if she ran under the republican ticket (why or why not)? Personally I feel she’s an embarssment and quite possibly the Republican George McGovern. And if Sarah Palin does gain the 2012 nomination I would be uncertain who to support. > [@needscoffee](#): > > Curtis, here are a few questions for you. > > 1. What are your favorite movies? I believe I said this-Star Wars. > [@](#): > > 1. What are your favorite TV shows? _The Simpsons_ > [@](#): > > 1. Do you participate in any sports? Only for PE or independent exercise. > [@](#): > > 1. Did you ever consider that children are taught religious “truths” in order to keep them out of trouble, but somewhere along the way, the children forget to sort out what is truth and what is fairy tale? Since every religion claims to be the “truth”, and has beliefs stemming from before the dawn of modern science, do you think that a large dose of skepticism might be a good thing? In what sense? For instance not endorsing Young Earth Creationism is different from saying the whole Bible was allegorical and Jesus was just a man. > [@gonzomax](#): > > We keep getting whipped by countries with no airforce or navy. War by remote control will not win. Boots on the ground wars have to have soldiers who believe they are fighting for a cause. many soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan don’t know why we are there. They fight for their fellow soldiers. They fight because they are told to and forced to. They want to survive their time and come home. Curtis LeMay lived during the Cold War. :rolleyes: > [@F.U.Shakespeare](#): > > By which logic, you are here arguing that it isn’t masturbation that’s a sin, but _excessive_ masturbation. I personally disagree that even excessive masturbation a sin, but acknowledge that there may be reasons to discourage it when we teach our children about sex. > > Masturbation is a perfectly normal thing and no more harmful or sinful than eating or defecating. As others have mentioned, we want our kids to learn good habits, and in the process we may make some blanket declarations that the kids, as adults, learn to separate from the sensible advice (most adults do, anyway). Are you aware that a hundred years ago, many people believed that masturbation caused all kinds of health problems, which we now know is baloney? That’s the fallout of drawing the boundaries of ‘sin’ too indiscriminately. What about when the Lord said that when a man lusts after a woman in his mind he already has commited adultery? :dubious: > [@B.Serum](#): > > Curtis, I know you’re getting thrown a lot of question here, but when you toss off brief one-liners that fail to thoroughly answer the question, people are going to respond back in spades with more question to clarify what could have been put to rest in a single, thorough response (see below). So Curtis: please stop tossing off. 😉 > > So you don’t believe the Ten Commandments apply to Christians? Jesus affirmed the Ten Commandments. > [@](#): > > Doesn’t Leviticus fall under Mosaic Law? Yes, it does. > [@](#): > > Who said Christians aren’t bound by Mosiac? See Galatians. > [@](#): > > Are there any other portions of the Bible you don’t take as word of God besides Mosaic Law? You’re misunderstanding me here-Mosaic Law is the Word of God-but it has been superseded. So I consider every portion of the Bible to be the Word of God. ---
**Author:** ![akennett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee59a6/32.png) [@akennett](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/akennett)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2010, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/235 "2010-02-15T17:23:07Z")
How do you defend your assertion that the OT laws have been superseded in light of the words of Jesus himself in Matthew 5:17-19? ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2010, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/236 "2010-02-15T18:08:15Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > What about when the Lord said that when a man lusts after a woman in his mind he already has commited adultery? :dubious: Are you saying that a man thinking about a woman while masturbating is committing adultery? That’s one _heck_ of an indiscriminate delineation of sin. I thought you had to be married to commit adultery? Also, is it a sin for a married man to think about his wife while masturbating? I don’t mean to disrespect your religion. And I don’t like pulling rank based on age. But I’ve never met a grown man who sincerely believed that actually having sex with someone is morally equivalent to lusty thoughts about them (and I’ve known some very religious men). To paraphrase what was said about Pope Paul VI in 1965 after he issued a controversial ruling on the use of birth control: _Until you’ve played the game, don’t trying making the rules._ ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2010, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/237 "2010-02-15T19:03:04Z")
If you’re so intellectual, wouldn’t you have at least one opinion that isn’t mainline neocon orthodoxy? If so, what is it? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2010, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/238 "2010-02-15T20:14:39Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Curtis LeMay lived during the Cold War. :rolleyes: And…? ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2010, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/239 "2010-02-15T20:19:42Z")
> [@akennett](#): > > How do you defend your assertion that the OT laws have been superseded in light of the words of Jesus himself in Matthew 5:17-19? I’ll leave it to **Curtis** to give his take on it, but my understanding is this: the concept of The Law Jesus (and the Rabbis) are using is akin to the concept of The Law that a lawyer would use in explaining why a court precedent is as much “the law” as a statute. Just as a court overturning a statute that flies in the face of the Constitution is not “destroying the law”, voiding a literalistic reading of, e.g., the kosher laws, is not “overturning the Law” but keeping its true meaning. I suspect that **cmkeller** himself would tell us that if The Buzarre-Hypotheticals Villian confronts him and says that he, the BHV, will torture to death an innocent child unless he, **cmk** , eats a prokchop, **cmk** would eat that porkchop with a clean conscience, knowing that he has saved a life by doing so. The summary of the Law is what is absolute, the Ten Commandments and other provisions are nearly-always-proper means of carrying them out … but to be broken with impunity on those rare occasions when something else supervenes. (Example: knowing First Aid, you are otherwise alone at the scene where someone is bleeding to death. The only thing available for a tourniquet belongs to someone else who is unreachable at the time. Though the strictest of readings would consider taking that ‘something’ to make the tourniquet to be theft, but I think any ethicist would deem it to be the proper course nonetheless. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2010, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234/240 "2010-02-16T01:53:16Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > If you’re so intellectual, wouldn’t you have at least one opinion that isn’t mainline neocon orthodoxy? If so, what is it? Do you mean politics wise or theology wise? 😕 > [@Guinastasia](#): > > And…? Back than such air forces were necessary to defend America from the Soviets. > [@Polycarp](#): > > I’ll leave it to **Curtis** to give his take on it, but my understanding is this: the concept of The Law Jesus (and the Rabbis) are using is akin to the concept of The Law that a lawyer would use in explaining why a court precedent is as much “the law” as a statute. Just as a court overturning a statute that flies in the face of the Constitution is not “destroying the law”, voiding a literalistic reading of, e.g., the kosher laws, is not “overturning the Law” but keeping its true meaning. I suspect that **cmkeller** himself would tell us that if The Buzarre-Hypotheticals Villian confronts him and says that he, the BHV, will torture to death an innocent child unless he, **cmk** , eats a prokchop, **cmk** would eat that porkchop with a clean conscience, knowing that he has saved a life by doing so. The summary of the Law is what is absolute, the Ten Commandments and other provisions are nearly-always-proper means of carrying them out … but to be broken with impunity on those rare occasions when something else supervenes. (Example: knowing First Aid, you are otherwise alone at the scene where someone is bleeding to death. The only thing available for a tourniquet belongs to someone else who is unreachable at the time. Though the strictest of readings would consider taking that ‘something’ to make the tourniquet to be theft, but I think any ethicist would deem it to be the proper course nonetheless. Yes, that’s the best explanation. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-patriotic-american-intellectual-conservative-christian/528234.md?page=13)