# "Ask The.." thread in Great Debates **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [September 17, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097 "2010-09-17T16:20:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/1 "2010-09-17T16:20:07Z")
In this [_Ask the “crazy” settler_ thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=578385) in Great Debates, there was a bit of a kerfluffle about whether or not establishing settlements outside of Israel’s border are legal. The OP says no, others disagree, then **tomndebb** steps in: [QUOTE=tomndebb] TWEEEET! The issue of the opinion of the OP as to whether the “settlements” are illegal has been answered in the negative. Any further questions or challenges to that position will be taken up in a separate thread because it is just going to result in a hijack and a trainwreck in this one. [/Moderating] [/quote] Now I realize that “ask the..” threads are usually for the purpose of asking questions of the OP, accepting the answers and moving on…but _this_ particular “Ask the..” thread is in Great Debates, where the rule is that people are allowed to disagree with the OP and post their reasons why. If participants are not allowed to debate the OP in a situation like this, why is it in Great Debates in the first place? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/2 "2010-09-17T16:38:40Z")
Thank you. The OP in that thread has is ostensibly taking questions on a very controversial and incendiary subject regarding a practice which most of the world sees as illegal (and which is, as a matter of pure fact, against international law), but the moderators appear to be unwilling to allow and challenge or disagreement on the core issues. The OP is allowed to freely post his/her own views and political opinions with no obstruction and with no one allowed to rebut or debate them. Why is that thread allowed to remain in GD if no debate will be permitted on the most core, controversial points? If the OP is not willing to take any fire, the thread should be closed. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/3 "2010-09-17T16:41:15Z")
If I may suggest, the subject was broached in a tone more hostile than necessary. I suppose better phrasing would have been “How do you feel about organizations that claim your resideny is illegal?”, as opposed to “How do you feel about doing something that is illegal?” The OP of the other thread is under no obligation to recognize the authority of “international law” as defined by whatever agencies were being cited. Possibly the government of Israel is, depending on which treaties are in effect. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/4 "2010-09-17T16:45:34Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > If I may suggest, the subject was broached in a tone more hostile than necessary. I suppose better phrasing would have been “How do you feel about organizations that claim your resideny is illegal?”, as opposed to “How do you feel about doing something that is illegal?” > > The OP of the other thread is under no obligation to recognize the authority of “international law” as defined by whatever agencies were being cited. Possibly the government of Israel is, depending on which treaties are in effect. I asked the second question because that was what I wanted to know. I am not interested in the OP’s opinion about what other organizations think. I’m interested in how the OP feels about being a criminal. That the settlements are illegal is a fact, not an opinion. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/5 "2010-09-17T16:47:21Z")
Aren’t “ask the…” threads supposed to go in another forum now? That would make more sense because, in large part, we are getting that one person’s opinion. We’re just trying to learn about what that person does or sees or experiences, not challenge that person’s beliefs. And with that particular subject (the settlements in Israel), I could easily see the thread devolving into a pissing contest. Open a thread specifically about the settlements and be done with it. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/6 "2010-09-17T16:48:26Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > If I may suggest, the subject was broached in a tone more hostile than necessary. I suppose better phrasing would have been “How do you feel about organizations that claim your resideny is illegal?”, as opposed to “How do you feel about doing something that is illegal?” > > The OP of the other thread is under no obligation to recognize the authority of “international law” as defined by whatever agencies were being cited. Possibly the government of Israel is, depending on which treaties are in effect. I f I might suggest, the OP is stating is opinion in Great Debates where, under normal circumstances, we are under no obligation to let him have his say without debate. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/7 "2010-09-17T16:48:45Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I asked the second question because that was what I wanted to know. I am not interested in the OP’s opinion about what other organizations think. I’m interested in how the OP feels about being a criminal. That the settlements are illegal is a fact, not an opinion. Here we go again… No, that is not a fact. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/8 "2010-09-17T16:53:36Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Aren’t “ask the…” threads supposed to go in another forum now? That would make more sense because, in large part, we are getting that one person’s opinion. We’re just trying to learn about what that person does or sees or experiences, not challenge that person’s beliefs. > > And with that particular subject (the settlements in Israel), I could easily see the thread devolving into a pissing contest. > > Open a thread specifically about the settlements and be done with it. If it’s a pissing contest, the OP started it with the very nature of the thread itself. The OP has also been permitted free reign to espouse whatever views he wants, I might add. To start a thread on a subject as incendiary as this one, and then brook no debate or challenge about it, is just trolling. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/9 "2010-09-17T16:55:07Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > I asked the second question because that was what I wanted to know. I am not interested in the OP’s opinion about what other organizations think. I’m interested in how the OP feels about being a criminal. That the settlements are illegal is a fact, not an opinion. > > Here we go again… No, that is not a fact. I’m afraid that it is. The settlements are illegal under international law. That is a fact. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/10 "2010-09-17T16:56:08Z")
I think the question behind it all is, you know, it’s an “Ask the” thread. Do you actually want to find out how she lives and how she feels about things, or do you just want to yell at her? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/11 "2010-09-17T16:58:37Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > That the settlements are illegal is a fact, not an opinion. It’s a fact that some people claim so, yes. Illegality isn’t a matter of demonstrable physics, though. > [@Czarcasm](#): > > If I might suggest, the OP is stating is opinion in Great Debates where, under normal circumstances, we are under no obligation to let him have his say without debate. It’s not clear that any amount of debate will advance that particular issue beyond “it’s illegal / no, it’s not” (a pattern already being repeated in THIS thread) and it was already pretty hostile, with promise of more hostility to come. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/12 "2010-09-17T16:59:08Z")
If I start a thread called “Ask the meth cook,” and invite questions about my methamphetimine manufacturing and resale business, can I expect the mods to admonish other posters for challenging me on the legal and/or ethical issues of my business? I would still expect to be allowed to espouse my OWN view with full force, of course, I just don’t want to be rebutted on anything because that would be rude. Also, in my opinion, making meth is not illegal, so there’s no reason for anyone to keep saying that it is. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/13 "2010-09-17T16:59:39Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@John\_Mace](#): > > > > Here we go again… No, that is not a fact. > > I’m afraid that it is. The settlements are illegal under international law. That is a fact. Please do not restart that debate here. That fact that it _is_ debatable at all is the point of this thread. Letting someone start a very controversial “Ask the..” thread in Great Debates without letting the rest of membership debate just doesn’t seem right to me. If it is allowed, other people with questionable points of view will demand the same consideration. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/14 "2010-09-17T17:00:17Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > I think the question behind it all is, you know, it’s an “Ask the” thread. Do you actually want to find out how she lives and how she feels about things, or do you just want to yell at her? These kinds of “ask the” threads are trolling if they don’t allow challenges. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/15 "2010-09-17T17:02:45Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > That the settlements are illegal is a fact, not an opinion. > > It’s a fact that some people claim so, yes. Illegality isn’t a matter of demonstrable physics, though. > > > [@Czarcasm](#): > > > > If I might suggest, the OP is stating is opinion in Great Debates where, under normal circumstances, we are under no obligation to let him have his say without debate. > > It’s not clear that any amount of debate will advance that particular issue beyond “it’s illegal / no, it’s not” (a pattern already being repeated in THIS thread) and it was already pretty hostile, with promise of more hostility to come. The nature of the thread is already hostile by its very nature, and it would hardly be the only subject in GD which is polarizing and prone to be endlessly argued without resolution. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/16 "2010-09-17T17:03:24Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > If I start a thread called “Ask the meth cook,” Well, unless you’re _actually_ a meth cook and can speak from knowledge and experience, that thread would be started under false pretenses. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/17 "2010-09-17T17:03:50Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > I think the question behind it all is, you know, it’s an “Ask the” thread. Do you actually want to find out how she lives and how she feels about things, or do you just want to yell at her? It’s an “Ask the..” thread _in Great Debates_-a new situation. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/18 "2010-09-17T17:04:24Z")
If you start a thread called “ask the meth cook”, it would probably be shut down because you’d be talking about how to violate US law. The settlements don’t violate US law. They may or may not violate “international law”. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/19 "2010-09-17T17:04:24Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > If I start a thread called “Ask the meth cook,” > > Well, unless you’re _actually_ a meth cook and can speak from knowledge and experience, that thread would be started under false pretenses. This doesn’t really address the rhetorical point of my question, does it? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/20 "2010-09-17T17:05:28Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > > [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > > > I think the question behind it all is, you know, it’s an “Ask the” thread. Do you actually want to find out how she lives and how she feels about things, or do you just want to yell at her? > > It’s am “Ask the..” thread _in Great Debates_-a new situation. Then if the mods should do anything, it should be to move it to MPSIMS. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097.md?page=2)