# "Ask The.." thread in Great Debates **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [September 17, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097 "2010-09-17T16:20:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/41 "2010-09-17T17:45:29Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@John\_Mace](#): > > > > OK. Then it should be moved back, and posters should be told that debate about the settlements is not allowed. > > > > Problem solved. > > No, that would be sanctioning a troll. Then I guess we’d just have to live with you feeling that way. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/42 "2010-09-17T17:48:44Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > She know the subject is inflammatory because she said so. She is also a criminal. That is a fact. It’s not a fact. She’s not a criminal. Everything she’s doing is legal under Israeli law, and she’s not violating international law. International law governs conduct between states, not conduct by individuals. Israel may or may not be violating international law by allowing the settlements, but she’s not by living there. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/43 "2010-09-17T17:59:58Z")
Thank you for that. 1. Move thread back to IMHO, with mod instruction to avoid debate on the legality of the settlements. 2. Start a separate GD or Pit thread if you want to bitch about the OP or the settlements. 3. Yay. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/44 "2010-09-17T18:10:02Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > She know the subject is inflammatory because she said so. She is also a criminal. That is a fact. > > It’s not a fact. She’s not a criminal. Everything she’s doing is legal under Israeli law, and she’s not violating international law. International law governs conduct between states, not conduct by individuals. Israel may or may not be violating international law by allowing the settlements, but she’s not by living there. Israeli law is irrelevant. She is breaking international law. You can rationalize it all you want, but you can’t say that the settlements are uncontroversial or that claiming to be a settler would not be easily predictable as inflammatory. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/45 "2010-09-17T18:11:38Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Thank you for that. > > 1. Move thread back to IMHO, with mod instruction to avoid debate on the legality of the settlements. This would be ludicrous. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/46 "2010-09-17T18:12:45Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > No, that would be sanctioning a troll. > > Then I guess we’d just have to live with you feeling that way. But apparently I’m not permitted to say it. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/47 "2010-09-17T18:14:52Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > The OP knows how inflammatory the subject is, and even recognizes it with a sarcastic thread title. The OP is admitting to an illegal act and inviting questions about it. Illegal and crazy are not the same thing. You can be crazy but not be doing anything illegal and vice versa. Independent of the issue of whether the settlements are illegal, the settlers themselves are frequently portrayed in the media as fanatics. The thread was intended to be a discussion of the OP’s lifestyle, and the reference to “crazy” was appropriate in that context. The legality of the settlements is another issue. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/48 "2010-09-17T18:15:51Z")
**Diogenes the Cynic** , the OP is not trolling. Opening a discussion on an inflammatory subject is not trolling. If it were, we wouldn’t have a Great Debates forum. Deliberately aggravating people is trolling, and while some people have gotten worked up in that thread, it’s not because **Shinna Minna Ma** is baiting them. I don’t have any issues with **tomndebb** ’s instruction. By that point the thread was on page three and the OP had been asked over and over again about that issue. It was starting to drown out any other discussion in the thread. It’s not as if he preempted the question before anyone could ask about it. I think the thread would be fine in MPSIMS or Great Debates but I’m inclined to leave it where it is because there are other GD-type issues that could still be discussed. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/49 "2010-09-17T18:28:14Z")
Opening a subject on an inflammatory subject is not trolling as long as _everyone is permitted an equal voice_. This is a case where only one opinion on a controversial debate is being allowed. Whether or not that is technically “trolling” on the part of the OP, it is certainly counter to the spirit of this board and smacks of political censorship. This person is boasting of criminality and being protected from challenges. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/50 "2010-09-17T18:38:19Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Opening a subject on an inflammatory subject is not trolling as long as _everyone is permitted an equal voice_. This is a case where only one opinion on a controversial debate is being allowed. Whether or not that is technically “trolling” on the part of the OP, it is certainly counter to the spirit of this board and smacks of political censorship. This person is boasting of criminality and being protected from challenges. Eh. Moderators restrict the scope of debate all the time to keep threads from degenerating into rat holes. This is no different. And she’s not boasting, and she’s not a criminal. If you want to challenge her, open a thread about that topic and invite her to participate. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/51 "2010-09-17T18:38:58Z")
Yes she is and yes she is. ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/52 "2010-09-17T18:55:32Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > If you want to challenge her, open a thread about that topic and invite her to participate. Why should that be necessary? From **Shinna** ’s OP: > [@](#): > > So, if anyone has **any** questions, remember to raise your hands. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/53 "2010-09-17T19:02:51Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > The nature of the thread is already hostile by its very nature Horseshit. It became hostile when you started calling her names. I repeat - move the thread back to MPSIMS where “Ask the…” threads belong. It’s not the OP’s fault if some people can’t debate in a civilized manner. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/54 "2010-09-17T19:03:34Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Yes she is and yes she is. No she is not and no she is not. ---
**Author:** ![CaveMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cavemike/32/16379_2.png) [@CaveMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaveMike)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/55 "2010-09-17T19:05:18Z")
> [@PlainJain](#): > > > [@John\_Mace](#): > > > > If you want to challenge her, open a thread about that topic and invite her to participate. > > Why should that be necessary? From **Shinna** ’s OP: > > > [@](#): > > > > So, if anyone has **any** questions, remember to raise your hands. For the rest of us that are interested in the original OP, but not so interested in exchange that just goes around and around in a circle. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/56 "2010-09-17T19:06:00Z")
[Moderating] _ATMB is for discussions of the rules, and it’s not the place to reargue the subject of the thread. If anyone wants to call the OP a criminal, open a Pit thread. Or open a different Great Debates thread and argue about the Israeli border issue for the 500th time. This thread is not going to be the receptacle for the debate that was shut down in the settler thread._ [/Moderating] > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Opening a subject on an inflammatory subject is not trolling as long as _everyone is permitted an equal voice_. There is still absolutely no way this is trolling. The OP did not shut anyone down. You disagree with the way the thread was handled but that doesn’t make the OP a troll, and introducing that term is only making this less clear. You and several other posters spent a couple of pages discussing the legality of the settlements. **Shinna Minna Ma** responded to those questions and I don’t know what other answer you are expecting. And it’s not only one side that’s being shut down. The topic of the legality of the settlements is off limits, pro and con, in that thread. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/57 "2010-09-17T19:08:12Z")
Then there’s no reason for the thread to be open, since that is the one and only topic that’s relevant in the thread. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/58 "2010-09-17T19:09:47Z")
Virtually no time was spent addressing the subject of legality, by the way. The OP just waved away the questions. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/59 "2010-09-17T19:12:01Z")
Incidentally, are we still allowed to ask questions about the _morality_ of her actions, and other tangentially related political questions (like why I should have to subsidize her with my tax money)? Or does it all all have to be tea and sympathy? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2010, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097/60 "2010-09-17T19:12:14Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > [Moderating] > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > Opening a subject on an inflammatory subject is not trolling as long as _everyone is permitted an equal voice_. > > There is still absolutely no way this is trolling. The OP did not shut anyone down. You disagree with the way the thread was handled but that doesn’t make the OP a troll, and introducing that term is only making this less clear. You and several other posters spent a couple of pages discussing the legality of the settlements. **Shinna Minna Ma** responded to those questions and I don’t know what other answer you are expecting. And it’s not only one side that’s being shut down. The topic of the legality of the settlements is off limits, pro and con, in that thread. Since the topic that got the thread moved from MPSIMS to Great Debates in the first place is now off-limits, shouldn’t the thread be moved _back_ to MPSIMS? Any other controversial aspect of the topic is directly tied to the elephant in the room. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ask-the-thread-in-great-debates/554097.md?page=4)